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#446152 - 09/01/13 07:20 PM Re: Soul ties... possible triggers [Re: csasurvivor1992]
GoldStone Offline


Registered: 05/28/13
Posts: 220
Loc: Far East
Good post Rich. Glad you are posting!

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#448242 - 09/25/13 09:44 PM Re: Soul ties... possible triggers [Re: csasurvivor1992]
Bluedogone Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/03/13
Posts: 174
Loc: Southeast US
A little late to this thread, but a very interesting topic.

Thank you csasurvivor for posting, even though I don't fully agree that "the souls of two people who have sex are tied together."

......Possible Triggers......
I certainly agree that my cousin (about the same age as I was at the time) and I formed a soul tie when he taught me to masturbate, and when we experimented with pretty much everything two teens could do sexually. We basically enjoyed it, and every time we were together we did it. We were in agreement and it continued for a few months until I wanted to stop. He didn't want to stop, so as far as I'm concerned it changed from oral sex to sucking a dick, and it was abusive. Nevertheless we had formed a soul tie, and were in agreement regardless of who enticed who to engage in the sex. I think I effectively broke this soul tie some years later when I saw him for the first time at my grandmother's funeral and we were both pall bearers. I surprised myself and was able to look hm in the eye and carry on a decent conversation with no mention of what had happened many years before. I thought, aha, the tie was broken. At least it was at the time, but has to be dealt with even now. I agree that it takes a lot of work to break the ties and over and over again sometime, even after you think the thought of abuse has been long gone. But the thoughts have a way of invading your mind at the worst possible times.

That was my cousin, and we had an interpersonal relationship for several years, not just the relatively short sexual interlude. But what about the other incidents that still plague me? What about the assistant softball coach who performed oral sex on me even when I said no, or the high school football jock who threatened me (and he was much bigger than me)if I didn't stop off on the way home for a little mutual masturbation. These two, and there were others all as a part of my life since I can remember, until well after HS graduation.
Although they have had a very profound and lasting impact on my life, these incidents were no more than a brief encounter, or a short episode of fear with ejaculation thrown in. I sure didn't enter into any agreement with these folks and there was no mutual understanding that my gratification was important or necessary for them to get off.

No doubt the pastor has a lot more experience with soul ties, but I think there's a world of difference between a personal relationship that doesn't work out like you want, (no matter how horrendous) and a chance encounter with someone intent on abusing you without regard for YOU. My cousin I can see I had a soul tie that I constantly have to be sure remains broken, but I can't see how a soul tie is established with a serial abuser that you hardly know or meet by chance.
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Never, never, never, never give up....Winston Churchill

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#448530 - 09/28/13 04:39 AM Re: Soul ties... possible triggers [Re: csasurvivor1992]
dark empathy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 1938
Loc: durham, north england
I don't know, I think this is a case as Bluedogone said of different experiences having different significances. For some people, who's abusers generated friendships, fraternal or other sort of emotional connections (however false those connections were), then maybe there is some sort of link, of soul tie. For some people though like genedebs said, there just seems to be nothing, a purely physiological form of violation. You might as well say someone who sticks a pin in you has a soul tie with you, since that's about the level of it.
*** possible trigger warning, ***

for me, there was absolutely no relationship, no context, heck not even a reason. The s/xual abuse just happened to be a progression of serious bullying, physical violence, insults and forms of humiliation, just something kids naturally did to make school more interesting. I don't even think there was any real desire for s/xual pleasure on the part of the girls involved in my abuse, since a lot of the abuse took the form of acts of indirect humiliation, eg, spitting in my face, having a used tampon stuffed down my trousers, public exposure just so people could laugh etc.

I don't even think the people involved were consistant, there were always more than three, but it really was "whoever was involved at the time"

My own physical responses were just that, simply and basically physical just a reflex, I felt no emotional attachment, no desire, indeed my chief feeling while things were happening was one of utter disconnection, feeling like a passenger in my own body. What my penis did when someone touched it was separate to me entirely, indeed I got to really hate those responses since on several occasions abuse sessions were triggered if I had an uncontrollable reaction. .

this is likely why now I am genophobic, but in need of love, since for me the absolute and total separation of s/x and love couldn't have been more extreme.

Soul tie? you might as well ask whether someone sitting in a car while a vandal smashes the car window has a soul tie to the vandal, indeed that was my chief and lasting feeling, of being an absolute passenger in my own body, the most extreme and profound expression of cartesian duelism.

@Rich, I understand that in many religions the s/xual practice has some sort of spiritual significance, but to be brutally honest the idea that "my seed" passing to someone else had anything spiritual about it just seems ridiculous. Several girls got it on there hands on various occasions, and usually responded by wiping their hands off on my face. To me this was no different to the time I unched a wall in furstration and got blood on someone, (not one of my s/xual abusers but a boy who usually responded with physical violence).

I think this is probably why now i feel such a need for intimacy, since the knolidge that the closest anyone has been to me, and that the most profoundly intimate reactions of my own body were simply a group amusement, a joke, really hurts a lot.

While as I said I appreciate that other people have different stories, to me at least it seems any spirituality in the experience of s/x, any experience of sharing or at least mutual regard must! come from people's own perceptions, true or false, believed or manipulated, just as seeing a Crocus as genedebs said was spiritually significant and affectig only when he was in that state of perception.

Of course, this also meas that the "spirituality" or otherwise of s/xual experience, or indeed any experience is pretty much up for grabs, and is something people could attain or remove with enough persistance and attention.

As I said I do appreciate that people's experiences are hugely different, but that is again why I'd myself prefer a belief in our freedom to interpret those experiences.

As to religious significance, well that's an entirely other matter.

Luke.

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#448575 - 09/28/13 09:28 AM Re: Soul ties... possible triggers [Re: csasurvivor1992]
On The Fringe Offline


Registered: 09/21/13
Posts: 326
Loc: Southeast USA
A freedom to interpret our own experiences. I just started a thread on that topic. Totally relate.

I am not in your shoes on one point, but I feel your pain as a man, human, person with feelings. On your most intimate physical reaction of your body being treated as a source of amusement for tormentors.

That is just vile, the act of depraved individuals that become even worse in groups.

I had a bit of DV done to me, occasionally involving groin hits. That triggered intense intense anger. Sub psychotic rage. It is such a weird bag of mixed damage and reactions we have. The idea some females think a hit there is funny was rage inspiring. I have no qualms with taco punching some idiot woman.

Your first commentary on a users and false emotional connections was right on. You and a few others keep pointing out the insanity of it. It has taken a while, but I hear you, finally...

Again, sorry for your pain. Thank you for sharing. Your insights are almost scary, like glimpses in my own head. Hang in there.
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#449153 - 10/04/13 09:07 AM Re: Soul ties... possible triggers [Re: csasurvivor1992]
dark empathy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 1938
Loc: durham, north england
Hi OTf.

I'm glad some of this was helpful, and yes, I did punch my abusers on several occasions but that just made me feel disgusting, indeed on one occasion when a girl reported to the teacher I got a stern telling off for "touching girl's chests" there's laugh, since said girl had been fine with touching my genlitals and buttocks. Don't talk about double standards!

My point however hear was that if there is a soul tie in s/xual experience, something of ourselves, it is something we choose! to give, ---- heck, maybe it is even something which people in that position can choose to take away, I don't know since for me there just wasn't that.

That is indeed my problem now, experiencing what was probably as close to gang rape as girls can do to a boy, but not! having anyone wishing to be close to me in a good way, being an immotional virgin if you like, for all that I am certain that for couples who are together s/x is only a part of the emotional intimacy and shared experience, not it's entirety.

this might also explain why I've never tried to seak out anything purely physical, since to me that would just be my abuse again, even if my genophobia would allow me to go through with it.

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#449166 - 10/04/13 12:37 PM Re: Soul ties... possible triggers [Re: csasurvivor1992]
tbkkfile Offline


Registered: 09/16/13
Posts: 154
Loc: Surrey, United Kingdom
My thoughts only so please I hope that I don't offend.

I'm having real problems relating the term "Soul ties" with my abusers, the way that I see it is that I have soul ties with my wife I love her dearly and couldn't imagine life without her, to me the term "Soul ties" represents everything that is good
_________________________
Go back?" he thought. "No good at all! Go sideways? Impossible! Go forward? Only thing to do! On we go!" So up he got, and trotted along with his little sword held in front of him and one hand feeling the wall, and his heart all of a patter and a pitter

J.R.R.Tolkien, The Hobbit

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#449167 - 10/04/13 12:40 PM Re: Soul ties... possible triggers [Re: csasurvivor1992]
concerned_husky Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/29/12
Posts: 585
I won't post much as I'm relegated to using my phone for the next few days, but I just wanted to add that perhaps it would be useful distinguishing between the terms 'soul ties' and 'enmeshment'/'entanglement'. I suspect the latter terms would be more appropriate in describing what *some* survivors deal with regarding their feelings towards their abusers.
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Husky

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#449171 - 10/04/13 03:01 PM Re: Soul ties... possible triggers [Re: tbkkfile]
Chase Eric Offline
Moderator
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/25/10
Posts: 1287
...


Edited by Chase Eric (11/21/13 06:50 PM)
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