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#84656 - 10/28/06 01:23 AM More research/child pornography
Ken Singer, LCSW Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/24/00
Posts: 5780
Loc: Lambertville, NJ USA
Child pornography link to abuse of children unclear
Internet and child pornography

(SACRAMENTO, Calif.) – If someone downloads child pornography onto their computer, is that an indication they're a pedophile, or might become one in the future?

That question is gaining the attention of forensic psychiatrists as never before, thanks to recent legislation making possession of Internet child pornography a federal crime constituting an unlawful transmission of information across state lines.

"A large number of cases are going to court and attorneys are calling us, wanting to know what is the reason this person has child porn on their computer," said Dr. Humberto Temporini, a forensic psychiatrist at UC Davis Health System. The answer is often unclear – not least because Temporini and his colleagues are still in the process of developing a standardized way to evaluate the risk, or lack of it, posed by someone who collects kiddie porn on the Internet.

The stakes are high. Dr. Charles L. Scott, associate professor of clinical psychiatry at UC Davis Health System, described the challenge facing forensic psychiatrists this way: "How do you assess the possession of Internet child pornography without the risk of offending, without the risk that the person will actually go out and molest a child?"

Such questions will be addressed at a panel discussion Sunday at the Marriott hotel in downtown Chicago dubbed "Internet and Child Pornography: The Impact on Forensic Assessments." The panel, part of a four-day conference sponsored by the American Academy of Psychiatry and the Law, will be chaired by Temporini, an assistant clinical professor in the Department of Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences. Scott, chief of the department's Division of Psychiatry and the Law, is part of the panel.

The AAPL conference, an annual event for forensic psychiatrists, seeks to cover the major issues facing the profession. Because Internet porn is still a relatively new phenomenon, Scott said there is a dearth of studies on its relationship to sexually criminal behavior. As a result, Scott will address the issue of Internet child pornography by taking a look backward.

According to Scott, two federally commissioned studies, one in 1970 and the other in the 1980s, failed to find a strong correlation between viewing erotica and acting out sexually. He said that the decriminalization of pictorial pornography in several northern European countries in the 1960s and 1970s was not accompanied by an increase in the frequency of rape. Case studies of sex offenders – which Scott describes as potentially limited because they depend on self-reporting – have also not shown a clear link between pornography and the commission of sexual crimes.

A study of 11 pedophiles found that the majority did not begin viewing child pornography "until after they had started their offending activity against children," Scott said. And in a 1991 study of 160 adolescent males charged or convicted of sex crimes, 70 percent reported that pornography played no role in their illegal activity.

Scott said the nature of the pornographic material is a key factor. Extreme porn depicting sadism, bestiality and the like may be "part and parcel" with sexually criminal behavior. But he said it's difficult to say that any type of pornography causes someone to commit a sexual crime.

"Now, does it foster such behavior or continue it?" asked Scott. "That hasn't really been studied."

Both Scott and Temporini said one thing is clear: The Internet has made it easier for large numbers of people to view child pornography.

"The ease of use and sense of privacy is greater," Scott said.

According to Temporini, people caught with child porn on their computers typically claim that the material was sent to them unsolicited.

"You can accept that if it's just one or two images," Temporini said. "But if it's 200 or they've created a special folder for the images, then such excuses aren't very believable."

One thing that muddies the water a bit, Temporini said, are so-called "vigilantes," people who collect child porn through the Internet as a way to flush out pedophiles. Temporini said forensic psychiatrists can determine a person's "pedophile interest" by subjecting them to a battery of tests regarding their sexual history and other issues. But he said it remains difficult to predict what someone possessing Internet pornography might do to a child.

"The tests don't tell us much about that," Temporini said.

###

UC Davis Health System is an integrated, academic health system encompassing UC Davis School of Medicine, the 577-bed acute-care hospital and clinical services of UC Davis Medical Center, and the 800-member physician group known as UC Davis Medical Group.


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#84657 - 10/28/06 03:45 AM Re: More research/child pornography
melliferal Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/03/05
Posts: 1159
It seems to me that child pornography doesn't do anything more to "convince" a pedophile to molest a child who isn't already keen on doing it. However, that is certainly beside the point when it comes to why CP should be illegal; and people who try to insist that it matters are just plain wrong.

I've heard some real idiots suggest deadpan (and without the slightest bit of supporting evidence) that, by providing an outlet for "release", child pornography can actually prevent pedos from abusing real children - and they say that, for this reason, the possession of "old images" of CP should be decriminalized. Asshats.

_________________________
Children cannot consent; they can only comply.

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#84658 - 10/28/06 03:46 PM Re: More research/child pornography
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
Years ago, I was involved in a first degree murder trial. Our client was not the one to deliver the fatal blows, but she was certainly there and took part in the crime. Both she and her partner were found guilty of 1st degree murder. All of us on Linda's team were really hoping for 2nd degree murder since we knew how the deal went down. The jury didn't see it that way and we were all devastated - at the time. It took time for me to be away from the case before I realized how warped my way of thinking had become. The bottom line was, our client had willingly participated in the murder of an innocent man and she got what she deserved. Her "degree" of guilt in this scenario wasn't really that important.

My point is, unless the possession of those images exist on your computer because they were truly sent unsolicited, then you are guilty of having them, should be charged as such and the authorities are duty bound to look deeper into your activities to ensure that children are safe. The circulation of those images is a crime with a horrific domino effect for the child(ren) in them.

BTW, if such images are there and you don’t want them, I would fully expect that only a forensic computer guy could find them because as soon as the person who didn't ask for them, got them, they were deleted.

I agree with Melliferal that

Quote:
“It seems to me that child pornography doesn't do anything more to "convince" a pedophile to molest a child who isn't already keen on doing it
but someone possessing it deserves a much deeper look at as he/she could be in a phase of “acceleration” and simply working themselves up to do evil.

Just my own very unprofessional 2 cents.

ROCK ON.......Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

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#84659 - 10/28/06 05:05 PM Re: More research/child pornography
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Ok, let us look a bit deeper into it all.
Possession of child porn is an offence, child abuse is also an offence.

The sad part is, that if you abuse a kid, you can get off with it, and sometimes never get put into the headlines to protect the child.
Having material proof however is not so easy to dodge.

The sad thing is, that the cops can say they are heavy on child abuse whilst doing very little to stop it.
The more they get as sex offenders on the register gives the public an uneasy but false picture of what the cops are doing.

Anybody looking at the rate of sex offenders would think the cops are pretty good at solving abuse agains kids, when they just go for the easy target and make figures.

Governments want figures to show the public, then the public think there is a sex offender on every corner because of the numbers the cops divulge.

The best way of collating data, is to put all the ones caught with images together, and study their pasts. It would give you a strong sample study.

What I am saying here is this. If you have 100 cases of child porn and just one has a past offence it gives you a sample, it could be any number but it is the only sample you can trust.

If I go back through many of the cases that come up in court, a very small percent involved abuse plus images, and in one case last week another one walked out of court over dates.

Serial pedophiles have been caught of past, notably JK who did not have any porn, but he had the kids for real, so he didnt need it.

Pedophiles would never fall into the trap of being caught with it, even if they had it.
They are masters at stopping kids telling on them leading to years of untold misery and an unsocial caucous of abused kids.

I think it is time that the sex offender register should be categorized, so that the public can see more easily what these figures really mean.

If the authorities really wanted to, they could put a heavy boot on those who distribute it, but they dont have the money,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#84661 - 10/29/06 05:08 PM Re: More research/child pornography
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
The problem with the public is that they are extremely ignorant of fact.
I worked for years with them, and could not believe the things they did or thought.

I do think it is wrong to criminalise those with images, it leads to them losing jobs and careers etc., when all they had was a few pictures.

Then the cops and authorities would have to really explain their massive budgets on tackling abuse which amounts to little in return.

I dont even come across CP because my web habits and browser settings make it almost impossible, but not your average household who dont know how to set up a system like mine.

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#84662 - 10/29/06 07:35 PM Re: More research/child pornography
melliferal Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/03/05
Posts: 1159
I'm not so sure I can agree. The fact that there are people out there who wish to procure such photos to aid in their fantasizing is often the primary, if not the sole, reason child pornography is produced for trade. And of course, children must necessarily be abused to create the material. As such, I think the "end user" certainly shares responsibility.

_________________________
Children cannot consent; they can only comply.

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#84663 - 10/29/06 08:30 PM Re: More research/child pornography
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
I totally agree that paying for it, makes you complicit, and so does distribution.
What Ken is looking at, is if there is a connection between fantasy and reality.

Probation services would have better information on whether someone who had CP further went on to abuse, but I have found only a few cases were that became true.

We could use the analogy that anyone who watches snuff movies are future murderers when apparently the millions who do, never go on to murder.

Its a smoke screen for authorities to show they are doing a good job.
I see a serial pedo like Denning get four years, after being found guilty of serious abuse on multiple occasions a joke.

He will be out next year to carry on his reign of terror on kids.
Then you see someone who abuses once and gets life meaning life.

Why are they letting him out along with JK, when they are in their own words 'innocent'!
Authorities should focus their attention on these ppl, because there is no doubt they carry on clandestinely.

Keep these prolific monsters behind bars, they love it,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#84664 - 10/30/06 03:24 AM Re: More research/child pornography
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
I'm replying to the point made by Trish:

Quote:
My point is, unless the possession of those images exist on your computer because they were truly sent unsolicited, then you are guilty of having them, should be charged as such and the authorities are duty bound to look deeper into your activities to ensure that children are safe.
That reminds me of a situation I had a few years ago at the University of Hamburg. I was having PC trouble of various kinds, so I called in our IT guru. Later that day he comes back and asks me if I had downloaded this and that song at 3:00 am, and when I laughed and said no, he asked me if I had recently gone home without turning off my PC. I then remembered that one morning I had come in and was surprised to see my PC still on.

Anyway, what had happened was that someone within the university system had detected that my PC was still on, so he hacked into it and was using it to store music files that he was selling illegally. That is, if a transaction had ever been detected, it would have been traced back to my PC and not his!

Something to think about where porn is concerned. Surely a dealer in illegal porn isn't doing to peddle the stuff from a site or PC that can easily be traced back.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#84665 - 10/30/06 07:07 AM Re: More research/child pornography
healing_inside Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/28/05
Posts: 2005
I would like to chime in here for a moment and mention something that Trish says:

"BTW, if such images are there and you don’t want them, I would fully expect that only a forensic computer guy could find them because as soon as the person who didn't ask for them, got them, they were deleted."

I am studing computer forensic's in college. The software to detect this and other types of evidence is pretty amazing.

It can not only retrieve the deleted files from your hard drive, but it can tell how long after it was downloaded to when it was deleted...

The proof is in the pudding

_________________________
I can't come to the phone right now, I am out living my life

*** WoR Retreat Alumni - Alta 2005 ***

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#84666 - 10/30/06 10:29 AM Re: More research/child pornography
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Larry and all, it is possible for a hacker to store anything on any unprotected computer, anywhere in the world.

Computer related crime is almost impossible to take to a Court, reason being, from the judge to the jury, they could not understand the jargon surrounding such cases.

I have to pose just one question here.
Why? Are the authorities doing nothing to ensnare the members of Nambla?

That is the question I would love to know the answer to, and my guess is that they are largely complicit with this group and others,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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