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#84406 - 09/30/06 09:43 AM "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
In a scandal guaranteed to anger parents, a prominent House Republican has resigned after the revelation that he exchanged raunchy electronic messages with a teenage boy, a former congressional page.

Rep. Mark Foley (news, bio, voting record), R-Fla., who is single, apologized Friday for letting down his family and constituents. Once his resignation letter was read to the House late Friday afternoon, Republicans spent the night trying to explain — six weeks before congressional elections — how this could have happened on their watch.

Near midnight, they engineered a vote to let the House ethics committee decide whether an investigation is needed.

Among the Republican explanations during the night:

_The congressional sponsor of the page, Rep. Rodney Alexander (news, bio, voting record), R-La., said he was asked by the youth's parents not to pursue the matter, so he dropped it.

_Alexander said that before deciding to end his involvement, he passed on what he knew to the chairman of the House Republican campaign organization, Rep. Thomas Reynolds (news, bio, voting record), R-N.Y. Reynolds' spokesman, Carl Forti, said the campaign chairman also took no action in deference to the parents' wishes.

_Rep. John Shimkus, R-Ill., chairman of the Page Board that oversees the congressional work-study program for high schoolers, said he did investigate but Foley falsely assured him he was only mentoring the boy. Pages are high school students who attend classes under congressional supervision and work as messengers.

_The spokesman for Speaker Dennis Hastert, Ron Bonjean, said the top House Republican had not known about the allegations. Shimkus said he learned about them in late 2005.

Just as Shimkus' explanation was released, House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi of California proposed to the House that its ethics committee investigate and make a preliminary report in 10 days. She demanded to know who knew of the messages, whether Foley had other contacts with pages and when the Republican leadership was notified of Foley's conduct.

Instead, majority Republicans engineered a vote to allow the ethics panel to decide whether there should even be an investigation.

Foley's departure sent Republicans scrambling for a replacement candidate.

Foley, 52, had been a shoo-in for a new term until the e-mail correspondence surfaced in recent days. The page was 16 at the time of the correspondence.

Foley's resignation further complicates the political landscape for Republicans, who are fighting to retain control of Congress. Democrats need to win a net of 15 Republican seats to regain the power they lost in 1994.

Florida Republicans planned to meet as soon as Monday to name a replacement in Foley's district, which President Bush won with 55 percent in 2004 and is now in play for November. Though Florida ballots have already been printed with Foley's name and cannot be changed, any votes for Foley will count toward the party's choice.

Hastert said Friday he had asked Shimkus to investigate the page system. "We want to make sure that all our pages are safe and the page system is safe," Hastert said.

ABC News reported Friday that Foley also engaged in a series of sexually explicit instant messages with current and former pages, all male. In one message, ABC said, Foley wrote to one page, "Do I make you a little horny?"

In another message, Foley wrote, "You in your boxers, too? ... Well, strip down and get relaxed."

Foley, as chairman of the Missing and Exploited Children's Caucus, had introduced legislation in July to protect children from exploitation by adults over the Internet. He also sponsored other legislation designed to protect minors from abuse and neglect.

"We track library books better than we do sexual predators," Foley has said.

Foley, who represented an area around Palm Beach County, e-mailed the page in August 2005. Foley asked him how he was doing after Hurricane Katrina and what he wanted for his birthday. The congressman also asked the boy to send a photo of himself, according to excerpts of the e-mails that were originally released by ABC News.

The e-mails were posted Friday on the Web site of Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington after ABC News reported their existence.

Naomi Seligman, a spokeswoman for CREW, said the group also sent a letter to the FBI after it received the e-mails. CREW did not post their copies of the e-mail until ABC News reported them, instead waiting for the investigation.

"The House of Representatives has an obligation to protect the teenagers who come to Congress to learn about the legislative process," the group wrote.

According to the CREW posting, the boy e-mailed a colleague in Alexander's office about Foley's e-mails, saying, "This freaked me out." On the request for a photo, the boy repeated the word "sick" 13 times.

He said Foley asked for his e-mail when the boy gave him a thank-you card. The boy also said Foley wrote that he had e-mailed another page.

"he's such a nice guy," Foley wrote about the other boy. "acts much older than his age...and hes in really great shape...i am just finished riding my bike on a 25 mile journey now heading to the gym...whats school like for you this year?"

In other e-mails, Foley wrote: "I am back in Florida now...its nice here...been raining today...it sounds like you will have some fun over the next few weeks...how old are you now?" and "how are you weathering the hurricane...are you safe...send me an email pic of you as well."

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84407 - 09/30/06 11:05 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
markgreyblue Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/19/03
Posts: 5400
Loc: Pasadena, CA
this is SO FUCKED UP!!! A friend once said to
me - the people who make the rules - are ususally the ones who break them -

what a mother fucker -


here's an artilce below from AOL.
total scum.
--------------------------------------------------

Congressman Resigns Over E-Mails to Page
Florida Republicans to Meet Monday to Name Replacement
By DAVID ESPO and JIM KUHNHENN, AP

WASHINGTON (Sept. 30) - Rep. Mark Foley, R-Fla., abruptly resigned from Congress on Friday in the wake of questions about e-mails he wrote a former teenage male page.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


"I am deeply sorry and I apologize for letting down my family and the people of Florida I have had the privilege to represent," Foley , 52, said in a statement issued by his office.

Six hours after his resignation letter was read to the House by a clerk, the chairman of a panel that oversees the page program issued a one-page written statement that deflected any blame from House leaders.

The statement from Rep. John Shimkus, R-Ill., said the House Page Board he chairs investigated the allegations late last year, but he said Foley "was not honest" in denying improper conduct with the teenager. Pages are high school students who attend classes under congressional supervision and work as messengers.

The House voted to have its ethics committee consider whether to investigate further. The Democratic leader, Rep. Nancy Pelosi of California, said the committee should determine who knew of the messages, whether Foley had other contacts with pages and when the Republican leadership was notified of Foley's conduct.

His departure sent Republicans scrambling for a replacement candidate less than six weeks before midterm elections in which Democrats are making a strong bid to gain control of the House. He had been a shoo-in for a new term.

Foley's two-sentence statement gave no reason for his decision to abandon a flourishing career in Congress. But several officials said the resignation had been prompted by the e-mails, and he took his action as details emerged about electronic messages he had sent.

The resignation further complicates the political landscape for Republicans, who are fighting to retain control of Congress. Democrats need to win a net of 15 Republican seats to regain the power they lost in 1994.

Florida Republicans planned to meet as soon as Monday to name a replacement in Foley's district, an area around Palm Beach County that President Bush won with 55 percent in 2004 and is now in play for November. Though Florida ballots have already been printed with Foley's name and cannot be changed, any votes for Foley will count toward the party's choice.

Campaign aides had previously acknowledged that the Republican congressman e-mailed the former Capitol page five times but had said there was nothing inappropriate about the exchange. The page was 16 at the time.

Rep. Rodney Alexander, R-La., who sponsored the page from his district, told reporters that he learned of the e-mails from a reporter some months ago and passed on the information to Rep. Thomas Reynolds, R-N.Y., chairman of the House Republican campaign organization.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Alexander said he did not pursue the matter further because "his parents said they didn't want me to do anything."

Carl Forti, a spokesman for the GOP campaign organization, said Reynolds learned from Alexander that the parents did not want to pursue the matter. Forti said, however, that the matter did go before the House Page Board - the three lawmakers and two House officials who oversee the pages.

Shimkus, who avoided reporters for hours, worked out his statement with Speaker Dennis Hastert's office. He said he promptly investigated what he thought were non-explicit message exchanges.

"It has become clear to me today, based on information I only now have learned, that Congressman Foley was not honest about his conduct," Shimkus said.

Shimkus said that in late 2005 he learned - through information passed along by Alexander's office - about an e-mail exchange that August in which Foley asked about the youngster's well-being after Hurricane Katrina and what he wanted for his birthday and requested a photograph.

"Congressman Foley told the (House) clerk and me that he was simply acting as a mentor ... and that nothing inappropriate had occurred," Shimkus said.

Foley was ordered to cease all contact with the former page and assured Shimkus he would do so, the statement said. He also was advised to watch his conduct with current and former House pages, and he gave assurance he would do so, Shimkus said. He added that here were no further complaints.

Hastert said Friday he had asked Shimkus to investigate the page system. "We want to make sure that all our pages are safe and the page system is safe," Hastert said.

Hastert said Foley submitted the letter of resignation to Florida Gov. Jeb Bush and submitted a copy to him. A House clerk read Foley's resignation on the House floor.

"He's done the right thing," Hastert said. Asked if the chain of events was disturbing, he said, "None of us are very happy about it."

ABC News reported Friday that Foley also engaged in a series of sexually explicit instant messages with current and former male pages. In one message, ABC said, Foley wrote to one page: "Do I make you a little horny?"

In another message, Foley wrote, "You in your boxers, too? ... Well, strip down and get relaxed."

Foley, as chairman of the Missing and Exploited Children's Caucus, had introduced legislation in July to protect children from exploitation by adults over the Internet. He also sponsored other legislation designed to protect minors from abuse and neglect.



"We track library books better than we do sexual predators," Foley has said.

And he once accused the Supreme Court of "siding with pedophiles over children."

Foley was a member of the Republican leadership, serving as a deputy whip. He also was a member of the House Ways and Means Committee.

Foley's aides initially blamed Democratic rival Tim Mahoney and Democrats with attempting to smear the congressman before the election.

The e-mails were posted Friday on Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington's Web site after ABC News reported their existence. The group asked the House Committee on Standards of Official Conduct to investigate.

Naomi Seligman, a spokeswoman for CREW, said the group also sent a letter to the FBI after the group received the e-mails. CREW did not post their copies of the e-mail until ABC News reported them, instead waiting for the investigation.

"The House of Representatives has an obligation to protect the teenagers who come to Congress to learn about the legislative process," the group wrote, adding that the committee "must investigate any allegation that a page has been subjected to sexual advances by members of the House."

In 2003, Foley faced questions about his sexual orientation as he prepared to run for Sen. Bob Graham's seat. At a news conference in May of that year, he said he would not comment on rumors he was gay. He later decided not to seek the Senate seat to care for his parents.

According to the CREW posting, the boy e-mailed a colleague in Alexander's office about Foley 's e-mails, saying, "This freaked me out." On the request for a photo, the boy repeated the word "sick" 13 times.

He said Foley asked for his e-mail when the boy gave him a thank you card. The boy also said Foley wrote that he e-mailed another page.

"he's such a nice guy," Foley wrote about the other boy. "acts much older than his age...and hes in really great shape...i am just finished riding my bike on a 25 mile journey now heading to the gym...whats school like for you this year?"

In other e-mails, Foley wrote, "I am back in Florida now...its nice here...been raining today...it sounds like you will have some fun over the next few weeks...how old are you now?" and "how are you weathering the hurricane...are you safe...send me an email pic of you as well."

What the boy wrote to Foley, who is single, wasn't available. The e-mails were sent from Foley's personal account, which Foley spokesman Jason Kello says he uses to communicate with many people, including the governor.

Efforts to reach the boy were unsuccessful, but he told the St. Petersburg Times last November, "I thought it was very inappropriate. After the one about the picture, I decided to stop e-mailing him back." The Times didn't publish the comments until Friday.

Alexander said the boy notified a staffer in his office about the e-mails. The congressman said he learned of it from a reporter 10 or 11 months ago and promptly called the boy's parents.

"We weren't trying to protect anybody except the parents," Alexander said Friday. "They told me they were comfortable with it and didn't want to pursue anything, didn't want to talk about it anymore."

Mahoney, a Republican who became a Democrat last year, is chairman and chief operating officer of a $1 billion-a-year financial services company. In his House bid, he has focused on Washington corruption and oversized deficits.

In 1983, the House censured two lawmakers - Daniel Crane of Illinois and Gerry Studds of Massachusetts - for having improper relationships with pages.

Associated Press writers Brendan Farrington in Florida and Larry Margasak and Natasha Metzler in Washington contributed to this report.


09-30-06 00:56 EDT


Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. The information contained in the AP news report may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or otherwise distributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press. All active hyperlinks have been inserted by AOL.

_________________________
"...do not look outside yourself for the leader."
-wisdom of the hopi elders

"...the sign of a true leader is service..." - anonymous



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#84408 - 09/30/06 01:54 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
James_dup1 Offline


Registered: 04/13/02
Posts: 1332
Loc: Wyoming
"I am deeply sorry and I apologize for letting down my family and the people of Florida I have had the privilege to represent,"

????

Yeah right....he should be honest and say "I am deeply sorry and I apologize for GETTING CAUGHT"

I read this and it made me so mad.

James

_________________________
I have more issues than Rolling Stone!


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#84409 - 09/30/06 03:48 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
melliferal Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/03/05
Posts: 1159
Wow, that's kind of unsettling. Makes you wonder exactly how many of our esteemed leaders who talk a good game about how children need protection from sexual predators go home at the end of the day to browse their kiddy porn collection.

_________________________
Children cannot consent; they can only comply.

Oprah's resources for male survivors

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#84410 - 09/30/06 03:51 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
What's good about this is that the kid saw through the bullshit and told someone. He broke the silence right away. I hope his parents are as proud of him as they should be.

L.

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84411 - 09/30/06 04:04 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
markgreyblue Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/19/03
Posts: 5400
Loc: Pasadena, CA
He didn't apologize to the young men at all

only those who would have the power to judge him
and affect his lives.

nor their parents who trusted them

_________________________
"...do not look outside yourself for the leader."
-wisdom of the hopi elders

"...the sign of a true leader is service..." - anonymous



Top
#84412 - 09/30/06 05:17 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
That's it, Mark, and take note of the spin. Here's the reaction at first:

Quote:
Campaign aides had previously acknowledged that the Republican congressman e-mailed the former Capitol page five times but had said there was nothing inappropriate about the exchange. The page was 16 at the time ... "Congressman Foley told the (House) clerk and me that he was simply acting as a mentor ... and that nothing inappropriate had occurred," Shimkus said
And now, all of a sudden, oops!:

Quote:
"It has become clear to me today, based on information I only now have learned, that Congressman Foley was not honest about his conduct," Shimkus said. Hastert said Friday he had asked Shimkus to investigate the page system. "We want to make sure that all our pages are safe and the page system is safe," Hastert said ... "The House of Representatives has an obligation to protect the teenagers who come to Congress to learn about the legislative process," the group wrote, adding that the committee "must investigate any allegation that a page has been subjected to sexual advances by members of the House."
Note also (and this was why I posted it) that this guy was chairman of the Missing and Exploited Children's Caucus. He introduced legislation to protect children from exploitation by adults over the Internet (= exactly what he did to the 16-year-old page) and sponsored other legislation designed to protect minors from abuse and neglect. He also vented about pedophiles and the urgent need to keep our kids safe.

Typically for the American press, however, the fuss isn't about him being a pedophile, but rather whether or not he's gay, as if that's the issue here.

Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84413 - 09/30/06 07:07 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
melliferal Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/03/05
Posts: 1159
On the other hand, pedophilia aside, it should be illegal for someone with a face like that to ask anyone if he makes them horny.

_________________________
Children cannot consent; they can only comply.

Oprah's resources for male survivors

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#84414 - 09/30/06 07:42 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
This stuff goes on more than we think, only its not reported by the 'silent ones'.
You find loads of control freaks in those places,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#84415 - 10/01/06 04:06 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Here's an update. The GOP knew about this guy year ago, but the problem was that he was up for re-election in a district where he was expected to win. Acting to protect the boy would have embarrassed the party and placed Foley's re-election in doubt.

I hope this controversy doesn't sink to become just a matter of inter-party bickering. The real issue is why a teenager can't come to Washington for the thrilling experience of being a page on Capitol Hill without fear of being perved by the guy who's supposed to be his mentor and boss.

L.

______________________________________________

GOP leaders knew of Foley e-mail in '05


GOP leaders admit their offices have known for months that a Florida Republican congressman was sending inappropriate e-mails to a boy who had worked as a page in the House of Representatives.

The office of House Speaker Dennis Hastert, who earlier said he'd learned about the e-mails only last week, acknowledged that aides referred the matter to the authorities last fall. They said they were only told the messages were "over-friendly."

Rep. Thomas Reynolds (news, bio, voting record), who heads the House Republican election effort, said Saturday he told Hastert months ago about concerns that a fellow Republican lawmaker, Rep. Mark Foley (news, bio, voting record), had sent inappropriate messages to a teenage boy.

Reynolds, a Republican from New York, is defending himself from Democrats who say he did too little to protect the boy.

Foley quit Congress on Friday after ABC News questioned him about the e-mails to a former congressional page and about sexually suggestive instant messages to other pages.

"The improper communications between Congressman Mark Foley and former House Congressional pages is unacceptable and abhorrent. It is an obscene breach of trust," Hastert, R-Ill., Majority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio, and Majority Whip Roy Blunt, R-Mo., said Saturday in a written statement.

The Republican leaders said it is their duty to ensure House pages are safe. They said they are creating a toll-free hot line for pages and their families to call to confidentially report any incidents, and will consider adopting new rules on communications between lawmakers and pages.

The boy who received the e-mails was 16 in the summer of 2005 when he worked in Congress as a page. After the boy returned to his Louisiana home, the congressman e-mailed him. The teenager thought the messages were inappropriate, particularly one in which Foley asked the teen to send a picture of himself.

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84416 - 10/01/06 04:10 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Melliferal,

Quote:
On the other hand, pedophilia aside, it should be illegal for someone with a face like that to ask anyone if he makes them horny.
:) Denial issues at work, one must presume. ;\)

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84417 - 10/01/06 05:26 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
melliferal Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/03/05
Posts: 1159
I've been thinking about this for a while, and I must say I'm very concerned about the victim, here. The concerned email he sent to a friend of his ( PDF file ) about Foley seems to indicate that he was extremely uncomfortable with Foley's advances. However, it's been mentioned that the boy's parents were informed and they more or less didn't seem to care about the issue.

I don't know how old this kid is now, but he needs a little support that he did the right thing. Foley's resigned, his career is over for good, and the notion of criminal charges is still up in the air - all because of this kid's email. Without some reassurance, this boy is going to start questioning his judgement. Perhaps he'll go back and start telling himself that the emails weren't really that bad enough to complain about. Eventually, he's going to start hating himself for "ruining somebody's life".

Very worried, indeed, I am.

_________________________
Children cannot consent; they can only comply.

Oprah's resources for male survivors

Top
#84418 - 10/01/06 05:36 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Melliferal,

He's 17 now. I hope he's getting parental support as well, and my guess is that they want to keep him out of the spotlight, which is of course a very good idea.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84419 - 10/01/06 07:03 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
RR and Mel,

My thoughts on this story run along this line, and I must emphasize, these are only my thoughts.

You don't get a page position simply because you want one, so assuming this page was working for a republican senator, it would stand to reason that he was there because his parents have connections. It may also be that they have excellent republican connections because they are excellent republicans. Many of those folk are right wing dogmatics who want to sweep under the carpet anything that disturbs their dogmatic little world. Trust me, I am well acquainted with one or two of them and know whereof I speak.

Again, I could be way off base about the facts here, but why else would a parent not be concerned? I can think of no reason that makes sense other than this or something similar.

And you're right. I certainly commend him for speaking out and I too hope it is the way Larry says above, that he is getting the support he needs from home. It doesn't appear that way to me after reading the story, but we do know that the media gets things so wrong at times that the actual facts don't look anything like the printed story.

Lots of love,

John

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

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#84420 - 10/02/06 12:04 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
John,

I didn't think of that angle, and I must admit I think now you are probably right. But if you are, my God ... poor kid.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84421 - 10/02/06 02:36 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
And now the FBI is in the picture, since soliciting sex from a minor online is a federal crime:

___________________________________________________


FBI investigating Foley e-mail to teens


The FBI is examining former Rep. Mark Foley (news, bio, voting record)'s e-mail exchanges with teenagers to determine if they violated federal law, an agency spokesman said Sunday.

FBI spokesman Richard Kolko said the FBI is "conducting an assessment to see if there's been a violation of federal law." He had no further comment.

House Speaker Dennis Hastert requested Sunday that the Justice Department conduct an investigation into Foley's electronic messages to teenage boys — a lurid scandal that has put House Republicans in political peril.

"As Speaker of the House, I hereby request that the Department of Justice conduct an investigation of Mr. Foley's conduct with current and former House pages to determine to what extent any of his actions violated federal law," Hastert, R-Ill., wrote in a letter to Attorney General Alberto Gonzales.

The White House and Democratic leaders in Congress also called Sunday for a criminal probe. White House counselor Dan Bartlett called the allegations against Foley shocking, but said President Bush hadn't learned of Foley's inappropriate e-mails to a 16-year-old boy and instant messages to other boys before the news broke last week.

"There is going to be, I'm sure, a criminal investigation into the particulars of this case," Bartlett said. "We need to make sure that the page system is one in which children come up here and can work and make sure that they are protected."

Foley, R-Fla., quit Congress on Friday after the disclosure of the e-mails he sent to a former congressional page and sexually suggestive instant messages he sent to other high school pages.

A law enforcement official, who asked for anonymity because the investigation is ongoing, said agents from the FBI's cyber division are looking into the text of some of the messages and checking to see how many e-mails were sent and how many computers were used. They are also looking to see if some of the teens who were sent messages will cooperate with the probe.

Senate Democratic Leader Harry Reid of Nevada called the Foley case "repugnant, but equally as bad is the possibility that Republican leaders in the House of Representatives knew there was a problem and ignored it to preserve a congressional seat this election year."

Reid said the case should be handled outside Congress.

"Under laws that Congressman Foley helped write, soliciting sex from a minor online is a federal crime," Reid said. "The alleged crimes here are far outside the scope of any congressional committee, and the attorney general should open a full-scale investigation immediately."

In his letter to Gonzales on Sunday, Hastert asked the Justice Department to investigate "who had specific knowledge of the content of any sexually explicit communications between Mr. Foley and any former or current House pages and what actions such individuals took, if any, to provide them to law enforcement."

The scope of the investigation, Hastert wrote, should include "any and all individuals who may have been aware of this matter — be they members of Congress, employees of the House of Representatives or anyone outside the Congress."

Hastert also sent a letter to Florida Gov. Jeb Bush on Sunday requesting that he "direct the Florida Department of Law Enforcement to conduct an investigation of Mr. Foley's conduct with current and former House pages."

Hastert maintained at first that he had learned only last week about the e-mails. But Rep. Thomas Reynolds (news, bio, voting record), head of the House Republican election effort, said Saturday he had told Hastert months ago about concerns Foley sent inappropriate messages to a teenage boy. Reynolds, R-N.Y., is under attack from Democrats who say he did too little to protect the boy.

Hastert acknowledged over the weekend that his aides had, in fact, referred the matter to the House clerk and to the congressman who was chairman of the board that oversees the page program. Hastert's office said, however, it had not known the e-mails were anything more than "over-friendly."

Majority Republicans engineered a House vote Friday that refers the Foley matter to the House ethics committee, but lets that panel decide whether there should even be an investigation.

Rep. Nancy Pelosi (news, bio, voting record) of California, the House Democratic leader, pressed the committee on Sunday to begin investigating and make a preliminary report within 10 days. She demanded to know who knew of the messages, whether Foley had other contacts with pages and when the Republican leadership was notified of Foley's conduct.

"Republican leaders have admitted to knowing about Mr. Foley's outrageous behavior for six months to a year, and they chose to cover it up rather than to protect these children," she wrote.

Congressional pages, a staple of Washington politics since the 1820s, are high school students who serve as temporary gofers in the House and Senate. The program nearly ended in the early 1980s due to alleged sexual misconduct and drug use.

Republican leaders say it is their duty to ensure House pages' safety, and are now creating a toll-free hot line for pages and their families to call to confidentially report any incidents. They also will consider adopting new rules on communications between lawmakers and pages.

Foley, who is 52 and single, was co-chairman of the Congressional Missing and Exploited Children's Caucus. In a statement Friday, he said, "I am deeply sorry and I apologize for letting down my family and the people of Florida I have had the privilege to represent."

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84422 - 10/02/06 03:42 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
melliferal Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/03/05
Posts: 1159
Quote:
Originally posted by roadrunner:
"Under laws that Congressman Foley helped write, soliciting sex from a minor online is a federal crime," Reid said. "The alleged crimes here are far outside the scope of any congressional committee, and the attorney general should open a full-scale investigation immediately."
Tragic irony or poetic justice?

_________________________
Children cannot consent; they can only comply.

Oprah's resources for male survivors

Top
#84423 - 10/02/06 03:58 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Melliferal,

Ironic justice, surely, if he gets banged away with his own legislation! It will be interesting to see the arguments over whether or not urging a boy to strip down to his boxers and asking him "Do I make you feel horny?" constitutes solicitation of sex.

L.

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84424 - 10/02/06 05:21 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
Larry,

I don't know if anyone read the tran>
_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

Top
#84425 - 10/02/06 01:47 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
John,

I haven't seen the tran>
_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84426 - 10/02/06 05:29 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Curiosity and suspicion got me, so I googled for the tran>
_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84427 - 10/02/06 07:54 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
And now the SOB has admitted himself to rehab saying he's an alcoholic. Well, maybe he is, but I know several alcoholics, recovering and active, who aren't pedophiles! The tran>
_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

Top
#84428 - 10/02/06 08:04 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Trish,

It looks like the flood gates are opening. The disclosure by that one kid has encouraged several others to come forward, so now the FBI has tran>
_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84429 - 10/02/06 08:11 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
And the latest. Note that nothing is said about helping the page:

______________________________________________________


Hastert denies GOP leaders saw e-mails


House Speaker Dennis Hastert said Monday no Republican leaders saw lurid Internet exchanges from former Rep. Mark Foley (news, bio, voting record) to pages and he would have demanded his ouster if he'd known about them.

"As a parent and speaker of the House, I am disgusted," Hastert, R-Ill., told reporters after holding a meeting at the Capitol in the wake of the disclosure of the e-mails in 2003 to a page, which led to Foley's resignation last Friday. The page's home state was not immediately cited.

The speaker did not mention e-mail exchanges between Foley, a Florida Republican, and another page, from Louisiana, in 2005. Other House Republicans said they told Hastert about those exchanges months ago. Hastert has not disputed those accounts.

"Congressman Foley duped a lot of people," Hastert said. "I've know him for all the years he has worked in this House and he deceived me, too."

Hastert described instant messages that Foley sent to a former page in 2003 as "vile and repulsive."

Hastert and his leadership team have been working through the weekend to contain the fallout from the Foley revelations. He spoke to reporters Monday after meeting with Rep. John Shimkus (news, bio, voting record), R-Ill., who chairs a panel of lawmakers that oversees the House page program.

Asked about the preliminary inquiry under way at the FBI into Foley's actions, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales told reporters Monday afternoon, "We're just beginning to look at it right now. I haven't received a report."

Officials were still trying to decide whether the Washington or Miami offices of the FBI would head the inquiry.

The congressional page program has traditionally been a starting point for young people interested in making a career of politics.

There currently are 72 House pages, 48 selected by Republicans and 24 by Democrats, according to a recent report by the Congressional Research Service. The Senate breakdown is 30 pages, 18 chosen by Republicans and 12 by Democrats.

Hastert, who did not take questions from reporters, called on any person who was aware of the 2003 instant messages to speak to law enforcement authorities. He said no Republican leader in Congress was aware of those exchanges until Friday, when ABC News reported it had questioned Foley about them.

Leadership officials had been aware since last year of the 2005 e-mail exchange, which they described as "overly friendly" but did not include overtly sexual references. They said they did not follow up on them other than to instruct Foley to not communicate with the Louisiana page.

Hastert said the page program has inspired many generations of youths to go into public life and said their safety and protection has been a top priority.

"It is a trust and as a parent and as the speaker of the House I am disgusted that Congressman Foley broke that trust," he said.

Foley, 52, checked himself into an alcohol rehabilitation center over the weekend, his attorney said Monday. In a statement, Foley said: "I strongly believe that I'm an alcoholic and have accepted the need for immediate treatment for alcoholism and other behavioral problems."

Florida Republicans on Monday chose a member of the state legislature, Rep. Joe Negron of Stuart, to replace Foley as the party's candidate for the state's 16th congressional district, which covers an area north and west of Palm Beach.

Hastert and his leadership team have been working through the weekend to contain the fallout from the Foley revelations. In a letter sent Sunday, Hastert asked Gonzales to "conduct an investigation of Mr. Foley's conduct with current and former House pages."

White House spokesman Tony Snow on Monday attempted to deflect the political repercussions of the Foley exchanges with pages, saying, "The House has to clean up the mess, to the extent there is a mess."

"This does not affect every Republican in the United States of America, just as bad behavior on Democrats' part is not a reflection on the entire party," Snow added.

Shimkus, appearing with Hastert, said new measures would be implemented to keep pages safe and said they include a toll-free hotline for pages, former pages and their families to confidentially report any incidents.

Shimkus called Foley's behavior "deplorable."

"The very thought of this behavior made me sick," he said. "Mark Foley should be ashamed."

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84430 - 10/03/06 10:34 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
More along the same lines: interest of course in the larger political aspects of the scandal, but not a word about help for the pages who were approached by Foley and may now need at least someone safe to talk to.

_________________________________________________________

Pressure builds on Republicans in sex scandal


Republican U.S. House leaders faced growing pressure over a congressional sex scandal on Tuesday, with Speaker Dennis Hastert rejecting calls to step down for his handling of sexual messages sent to teen-age boys by Rep. Mark Foley (news, bio, voting record).

The conservative Washington Times newspaper, usually a Republican supporter, accused Hastert of barely pursuing warnings about Foley's messages and said in an editorial he "must do the only right thing, and resign his speakership at once."

Hastert has denied any knowledge of Foley's overtly sexual Internet messages to male congressional pages until they were made public on Friday, and his spokesman rejected calls for his resignation.

"The speaker has and will lead the Republican conference to another majority in the 110th Congress," said spokesman Ron Bonjean.

President George W. Bush did not respond to questions in California over whether Hastert should resign, though he did say the Republican was "a father, teacher, coach who cares about the children of this country."

"I'm confident he will provide whatever leadership he can to law enforcement" in its investigation of Foley, Bush said.

The disclosures were a blow to Republicans as they fight to retain control of Congress in November 7 elections, giving Democrats new ammunition in the battle to pick up the 15 House seats and six Senate seats needed to claim majorities in each chamber.

Bush, on a fund-raising trip in Stockton, told reporters he was "dismayed and shocked" by Foley's behavior and supported calls for an investigation of the incident.

"I was disgusted by the revelation, and disappointed that he would violate the trust of the citizens who placed him in office," Bush said.

Members of both parties, including some leading conservatives, said any congressional leader who had known the content of the messages and had failed to take action should step down.

Conservative activist Richard Viguerie said Hastert should go. "We are not going to get to the political promised land until we have new leaders, and it's time for pretty much all of the leaders to leave," Viguerie told CNN.

TAKING THE FALL

House Republicans held a conference call on Monday to discuss the scandal and its fallout, with a top Republican Party aide calling the next few days crucial.

"There isn't much time to right the ship," the aide said. "Somebody has to take the fall."

Some House Republicans looked into e-mail traffic between Foley and a 16-year-old boy last spring, which was described to them as "over-friendly," but House leaders said they were not made aware of explicit messages sent to other pages.

Conservative and religious leaders expressed unhappiness with the unfolding scandal and Republican strategists worried some conservative voters would wind up sitting home on November 7 out of disgust.

"The big danger for Republicans is they are going to reach a tipping point with the conservative base and they are going to stay home," said Republican consultant Rich Galen.

"It's a very uncomfortable situation right now, and the most uncomfortable person of all is the speaker."

The FBI, Florida state investigators and House ethics investigators are all looking into Foley's communications with pages, who are teenagers assigned to answer telephones, deliver documents and run other errands for members of Congress.

House Republican Leader John Boehner, in an interview with an Ohio radio station, said Hastert had told him the situation "had been taken care of" and "my position is it's in his corner, it's his responsibility."

At least one Republicans rallied to Hastert's defense.

"The speaker has led the Congress through dangerous and important times. His leadership has been steady and consistent, and he has the strong support of the conference," said Rep. Roy Blunt (news, bio, voting record) of Missouri, the third-ranking House Republican.

The scandal created a ripe takeover target in Foley's previously safe district for Democrats, and gave them renewed ammunition for charges Republicans have abused their power.

__________________________________________________________

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84431 - 10/04/06 12:02 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
EGL Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 06/19/04
Posts: 7821
So now Foley says he was abused by a priest from age 13-15. Well, I'm sorry that happened to him, but that's no excuse to become a pervert. I was abused as well and I managed not to become a pervert and so did a lot of other people here.

_________________________
Eddie

Top
#84432 - 10/04/06 12:25 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
Ditto Eddie, only from ages 6 to 11. I'm so sorry that happened to Foley, but so what. As you say it's no excuse, and at least he's not offering excuses. In a statement early today he stated as much, so there's some integrity there. Too bad it's too little, too late!

Lots of love,

John

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

Top
#84433 - 10/04/06 01:04 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Here's the new story: alcoholic, now a victim of abuse by a priest, what next? Does he think that he can argue that abuse "made him gay"? Does he think that abuse (if the story is true) means he's not responsible for what he does as an adult?

Eddie and John, you are so right: we were all abused and managed to fight through and not repeat the cycle of abuse ourselves. But there's even more than that; we have done even more to our credit. ALL of us here talk frankly about whatever acting out we have done, we accept that it's no good for us, and we try to do whatever needs to be done to put an end to it. Never have I seen any guy on this site resort to the abuse he suffered as an excuse for getting cumpulsive about porn, drinking himself nearly to death, losing himself in drugs, acting out with other men or with prostitutes, or anything else. It's incredible the honesty and integrity that we see on this site.

I don't see that in Foley. For him abuse IS an excuse for all the things he knows he will now be blamed for.


________________________________________________________

Foley says he was abused by a clergyman


Disgraced former Rep. Mark Foley (news, bio, voting record) said through his lawyer Tuesday that he was sexually abused by a clergyman as a teenager, but accepts full responsibility for sending salacious computer messages to teenage male pages.

Attorney David Roth said Foley was molested between ages 13 and 15 by a clergyman. He declined to identify the clergyman or the church, but Foley is Roman Catholic.

He also acknowledged for the first time that the former congressman is gay, saying the disclosure was part of his client's "recovery."

"Mark Foley wants you to know he is a gay man," Roth told reporters in Florida as Republicans struggled to avoid election-year fallout from the congressman's behavior and sudden resignation.

Foley represented parts of Palm Beach County for 12 years until he abruptly resigned Friday after being accused of sending lurid Internet messages to teenage boys who served as pages on Capitol Hill. The FBI and Florida law enforcement officials are investigating whether he violated any laws.

The lawyer said Foley, who is now in treatment for alcohol abuse, never had any inappropriate sexual contact with a minor. He said Foley was under the influence of alcohol when he sent the e-mails and instant messages.

Asked why he didn't disclose this information sooner, Roth said, "Shame, shame."

"As is so often the case with victims of abuse, Mark advises that he kept his shame to himself for almost 40 years," Roth said.

Foley announced in a statement Sunday that he had checked into a facility to be treated for "alcoholism and other behavioral problems."

Roth said Foley never had any sexual contact with minors.

"There was absolutely no inappropriate sexual contact with any minor ... and any suggestion that Mark Foley is a pedophile is false," he said, adding that Foley never even attempted to have sexual relations with the teens.

Asked whether Foley was suicidal, Roth said, "I am not concerned about that at all."

"I was advised by his doctor that despite obvious pressure and the trauma of what he has gone through as a result of the revelations that he has determined to be completely inappropriate and inexcusable that he is not in danger of hurting himself," Roth said.

_________________________________________________________

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84434 - 10/04/06 04:33 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
melliferal Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/03/05
Posts: 1159
I won't question that Foley was abused. But I personally resent his "disclosure", which by its very context is obviously intended to be either a justification for his behavior, or some kind of "shield" to keep people from using exceptionally harsh language to describe this scandal.

So, what, now are we not allowed to call his behavior disgusting, sick, reprehensible, because he was abused? It's still all that and more. We try so hard to combat the stereotype of the "vampire syndrome", only to have high-profile smegs like this guy trying to exploit the same stereotype in a bid for mercy. I was having a wonderful day at work until I went on break and watched CNN, only to see the lawyer's statement. It made my blood boil. A friend of me actually asked me if something was wrong - I suppose my anger was obvious, though I wasn't saying anything.

Then CNN brings some talking-head "addiction therapist" on, who explained (at least, it's what I THOUGHT I heard him say) that the apparent fact he was abused essentially "answers some of the questions" about Foley's behavior. This same genius, when asked if Foley could indeed be considered a real pedophile, answered something to the effect that "no, because we only tend to see pedophilic behavior in people who were abused before the age of twelve".

I'm immensely angry. I'm trying very hard to maintain decorum.

_________________________
Children cannot consent; they can only comply.

Oprah's resources for male survivors

Top
#84435 - 10/04/06 05:23 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
EGL Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 06/19/04
Posts: 7821
Hi, Melliferal - I agree with you on this and believe you have stated exactly what everyone here feels as well. When I heard that loser of a lawyer on tv, I just groaned inside, thinking about how people must perceive SA victims. Such idiocy.

_________________________
Eddie

Top
#84436 - 10/04/06 02:11 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
One thought I've had here is that things seem to have changed for the better in the last 20 years.

Back about then one of our national lawmakers (his name escapes me at the moment) wasn't even removed from congress for HAVING SEX with an underage page, let alone having criminal charges filed. The bastard was even re-elected to his seat the next term!

It is getting better guys.

Lots of love,

John

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

Top
#84437 - 10/04/06 03:45 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
John,

It is indeed better - you are right to point that out. Back in the 60s, when I was abused, the "proper" way to deal with things was to hush them up as fast as possible. This case would never have seen the light back then.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84438 - 10/04/06 05:25 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
At Last! Some emphasis on the kids at the center of this issue. It's about time.

_________________________________________________________

Congressional pages can be vulnerable


Before the Internet came along, vodka with cranberry juice and a bet over a six-pack of beer were tools of seduction in the hands of House members with designs on congressional pages.

The bright high school juniors who come to Washington to be pages are wards of Congress, much like orphans were when the House first hired them to run errands in centuries past.

In their gray and navy uniforms, they get a taste of power while doing humdrum jobs, serving at the whim of an institution that shelters, educates and pays them while they are far from home.

The potential for abuse is apparent, as it always is when power and powerlessness are in the same room.

In 1983, an investigation into dozens of reports of sexual misconduct between House members and pages noted the more permissive nature of society at the time, with the age of consent dropping, sexual mores relaxing and people appreciating "an increasing recognition of the frailty of human nature."

Even so, the inquiry stated in so many words: Hands off.

That bottom line is being echoed today after the exposure of Rep. Mark Foley (news, bio, voting record)'s flirtatious e-mails and reports he sent raunchy instant messages to page boys prompted him to quit and check into a center for alcoholism and what he said were behavior problems.

Members of Congress are expected to take special responsibility for the welfare of pages and act in place of their parents. Protections introduced since the early 1980s include an increase in the starting age of pages to 16 from 14, dorms for them to live in, heightened supervision and a board to protect their well-being.

But "the pages are not on a leash 24 hours a day" and the risk always exists of someone in a position of authority preying on them, Joseph A. Califano Jr., who led the 1983 investigation as special counsel to the House Ethics Committee, said Monday.

"There's plenty of opportunity," he said in an interview. "Parties every night ... enough free booze to sink the Capitol.

"Whether it's the House of Representatives, professional sports or the Catholic Church, you're going to have people who are sick."

The 1983 inquiry uncovered repeated trysts with pages on the part of Reps. Daniel B. Crane and Gerry Studds, as well as one senior House employee.

These liaisons were consensual in ways that Foley's come-ons apparently were not — one page described Foley repeatedly as "sick, sick, sick."

The consensual nature of Crane's encounters with a page girl and Studds' encounters with a page boy were considered no defense at the time. Not when powerful men in their 30s and 40s and teenagers of 17 or younger were involved.

The page girl told investigators that in the winter of 1980, when she was 17, she made a friendly bet over a basketball game with the 44-year-old congressman for a six pack and, when she lost, took the Heineken to his office.

They ended up in his apartment for the first of at least several sexual episodes over the course of a succession of Thursdays. "It was my decision just as much as it was his," she stated.

The Republican congressman from Illinois was censured by the House and lost his seat in the 1984 election.

The page boy seduced by Studds, D-Mass., said the congressman invited him to his Georgetown home for dinner, and they talked until 4 a.m., drinking vodka and cranberry juice. "I was told by the congressman that he was too drunk to give me a ride home and so he said, 'Why don't you sleep here?' and I did."

Thus began a sexual relationship that continued over more dinners and a trip together to Europe.

"I was flattered and excited," the page testified. "If I could have had my druthers, I would have had the friendship that I had with the man without the sex."

He said "I was somewhat uncomfortable" with the sex but "I did not think it was that big a deal."

Studds was 36; the page was either 16 or 17 when they first had sex. Studds also was censured but his political career survived until his retirement in the mid-1990s.

Califano, now chairman of the National Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse at Columbia University, credited Congress with adopting the full menu of protections he recommended. Five years later, his daughter became a page.

The investigation looked into rumors that sexual misbehavior and drug use were rampant on Capitol Hill and found most of the reports were "the product of teenage exaggeration, gossip or even out-and-out fabrication." But not all.

At the time, the age of consent for sexual acts had been lowered in most jurisdictions to 16, where it largely remains. But protected ages are higher depending on circumstances, such as when someone of influence entices or coerces the younger person to have sex.

_________________________________________________________

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84439 - 10/04/06 06:47 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Larry,

this stuff starts at the top in Government circles, that is why they look for power, to use it anyway they feel.

It turns out to be yet another coverup.
Funny how these things come up on the eve of elections, but thats as shady as it gets.

Never believe in authority, they cover their own asses like Hell.
Worldwide that is!

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

Top
#84440 - 10/05/06 02:55 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Yet another chapter in the saga. It looks like there might be an investigation of Foley, and there's a lot of consternation at the way the House leadership seems to have put politics ahead of the safety of the kids they bring to Washington for what should be a great experience of a lifetime.

____________________________________________________________

Ethics committee ready to probe Foley case



Speaker Dennis Hastert's job is on the line as members of the House ethics committee decide how to launch a credible investigation of former Rep. Mark Foley (news, bio, voting record)'s salacious computer messages to teenage pages.

An extraordinary political spectacle surrounded the committee's first scheduled meeting Thursday. Republicans publicly blamed Hastert for failing to take action after he was warned about the messages, and a former Foley aide said he told Republican leaders about the Florida congressman's conduct years earlier than they have acknowledged.

With Republicans concerned about maintaining their congressional majority in the Nov. 7 elections, political support for Hastert was ebbing. Republican officials said at least a few disgruntled members of the GOP rank and file had discussed whether to call on the speaker to step aside. The officials spoke on condition of anonymity, citing the sensitivity of the issue.

Hastert told the Chicago Tribune on Wednesday night that he has no thoughts of resigning. He blamed ABC News, which broke the Foley e-mail story, and Democratic operatives for the mushrooming scandal.

The Justice Department, meanwhile, ordered House officials to preserve all records related to Foley's electronic correspondence with teenagers. The request for record preservation is often followed by search warrants and subpoenas, and signal that investigators are moving closer to a criminal investigation.

Kirk Fordham, the former Foley aide, said in an interview with The Associated Press that more than three years ago he had "more than one conversation with senior staff at the highest level of the House of Representatives asking them to intervene." He declined to identify them, but officials said Scott Palmer, Hastert's chief of staff, was one of them. The officials spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the matter.

Palmer said through a spokesman, "What Kirk Fordham said did not happen."

Fordham resigned Wednesday as chief of staff to Rep. Thomas Reynolds (news, bio, voting record), R-N.Y., the House GOP campaign chief who says he alerted Hastert to concerns about Foley last spring.

Fordham disputed allegations that he covered up any misdeeds by Foley. "At no point ever did I ask anyone to block any inquiries," said Fordham, who was Foley's longtime chief of staff until leaving in January 2004.

Rep. Roy Blunt (news, bio, voting record) of Missouri, third-ranking GOP leader, pointedly told reporters he would have handled the Foley matter differently than Hastert, had he known of it.

"I think I could have given some good advice here, which is, you have to be curious, you have to ask all the questions you can think of," Blunt said. "You absolutely can't decide not to look into activities because one individual's parents don't want you to."

House Majority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio, said in a radio interview Tuesday: "I believe I talked to the speaker and he told me it had been taken care of. My position is it's in his corner, it's his responsibility."

Ron Bonjean, Hastert's spokesman, said the issue now rests with the ethics committee.

"We fully expect that the bipartisan panel will do what it needs to do to investigate this matter and protect the integrity of the House," Bonjean said.

House Democratic leader Nancy Pelosi of California said the committee needs to question Hastert and the rest of the Republican leadership under oath.

"The children, their parents, the public, and our colleagues deserve answers and those who covered up Mark Foley's behavior must be held accountable," Pelosi said.

Foley, 52, resigned last Friday after he was confronted with sexually explicit electronic messages he had sent teenage male pages. He has since entered an alcohol rehabilitation facility at an undisclosed location. Through his lawyer, he has said he is gay but denied any sexual contact with minors.

His abrupt departure and the ensuing sex scandal has shaken Republican confidence — and poll numbers — and plunged Hastert and others into an intensive effort to grapple with conflicting claims about what senior lawmakers knew, when they learned it and what they did about it.

The ethics committee had endured a partisan stalemate for 16 months that prevented its members from launching any new investigations. The committee broke the deadlock in May by announcing four separate investigations, including the first congressional probe of a lawmaker linked to convicted lobbyist Jack Abramoff.

Now, the committee, which is equally divided between Republicans and Democrats, has the sensitive job of investigating the House speaker, the top official in the chamber. When the committee investigated Democratic Speaker Jim Wright and Republican Speaker Newt Gingrich, it hired outside counsels.

The ethics panel also hired an outside lawyer to conduct a broad sex-and-drugs investigation in the early 1980s that ended with the censure of two House members for consensual relationships with House pages, who are high school students who work on Capitol Hill delivering messages and running other errands.

The outside counsel in the Wright investigation said the committee must hire an independent investigator to convince the public it can conduct a nonpartisan investigation of congressional leaders.

Richard Phelan, hired to investigate Wright, said an outside counsel was key to a credible investigation.

"The perception outside (Washington) is that Congress and the speaker and those running Congress have screwed this thing up," Phelan said. "I think you probably have to start with Hastert."

___________________________________________________________

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#84441 - 10/05/06 07:18 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
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The latest from the Chicago Tribune. Approaches to pages seem to come after they leave the program. There are calls to eliminate the program entirely now, as if the answer lies in punishing the kids who might benefit from this opportunity, rather than making sure that predators can't abuse the system. Typical.

____________________________________________________________

Ex-pages say they're vulnerable when program ends


WASHINGTON -- Revelations in the past week of sexually explicit e-mails and instant messages from then-Rep. Mark Foley to teenage House pages have sparked calls for reform and even abolition of the page program.

Security at the program already is tight, several ex-pages say. The vulnerable period, they add, follows their semester-long stint in Washington, when lawmakers can still contact the students, who are not afforded the protections they receive while on Capitol Hill.

The electronic messages from Foley that are at the center of the scandal appear to have been sent after the pages completed their time in Washington. Interviews with numerous former pages displayed a consistent pattern in de>
_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84442 - 10/05/06 10:43 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
ForeverFighting Offline
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Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 1058
Loc: New Mexico, USA
This whole thing is so wrong. I shouldn't have, but I read the tran>
_________________________
ForeverFighting

"This search for the truth--it's not for the faint of heart."--Goren on 'Law & Order: CI'
"The former things will not be called to mind, neither will they come up into the heart."--Isaiah 65:17

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#84443 - 10/05/06 11:01 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
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FF,

And the kicker is that it's so plainly obvious that at least some of these kids WERE abused. I just can't imagine that any teenager would give up detailed information about his private parts and sexual life to his congressman boss on the Internet unless his boundaries had already been broken down in some devastating way.

Let's hope that the orange suit in Foley's size is all cleaned, pressed and ready for a new occupant.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84444 - 10/06/06 12:59 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
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Registered: 05/02/05
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Here's another one from today, possums. It turns out that Foley has been up to these tricks for a decade, so from the early years of his service as a Congressman. Surprise, surprise! But the good news is that the dam is cracking and former pages are beginning to speak out.

______________________________________________________________

Ex-page says he got messages from Foley


A former congressional page said Thursday he received sexually suggestive messages from then-Rep. Mark Foley (news, bio, voting record) in 1997.

Tyson Vivyan's account appears to show the earliest exchange of suggestive messages reported so far between Foley and teens who had served in the Capitol page program. Previous accounts placed the earliest contacts in 2003.

Vivyan, 26, told The Associated Press that Foley began sending him instant messages about a month or two after his nine-month stint as a page ended in June 1997.

Vivyan, who gave interviews this week to other media, said he never met Foley personally during his stint as a page, other than brief greetings while working in the cloakroom beside the House chamber where members take breaks.

A few months later, he said, he started getting instant messages via computer from a person with the screen name MAF54, which has been linked in news reports to Foley. He said he wasn't sure who it was, but the person knew his name and physical de>
_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84445 - 10/07/06 12:27 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
WalkingSouth Offline
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Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
Larry,

Quote:
And the kicker is that it's so plainly obvious that at least some of these kids WERE abused. I just can't imagine that any teenager would give up detailed information about his private parts and sexual life to his congressman boss on the Internet unless his boundaries had already been broken down in some devastating way.
I agree totally with that assessment, but would like to add another log to the fire here if I may.

In my opinion, and in the opinion of most mental health professionals who deal with sexual abuse issues, the sexually explicit content of these emails and IM's constitutes sexual abuse in and of itself, and is a gross violation of sexual boundaries that can come back to trouble the victim at some point in the future.

It's just plain sick and abusive, and I hope these young men have help available if and when they need it.

Lots of love,

John

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

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#84446 - 10/07/06 12:37 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
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John,

You are so right. Some of the newly revealed IMs reflect exactly what you are talking about. The kid loves the idea that a congressman wants to talk to him, but he doesn't get the idea he is only being perved and groomed. He keeps trying to bring the subject back to government and politics, and Foley ignores him and continues to corner him with sexually leading questions and comments. In one he even asks the kid for (and gets) an on-screen "kiss".

If thast's not abuse, what is? What a bastard.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84447 - 10/07/06 02:21 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
FormerTexan Offline
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Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 11118
Loc: Denver, CO
John,

Quote:
In my opinion, and in the opinion of most mental health professionals who deal with sexual abuse issues, the sexually explicit content of these emails and IM's constitutes sexual abuse in and of itself, and is a gross violation of sexual boundaries that can come back to trouble the victim at some point in the future.
I agree John. In fact, Dan Allender in his book, The Wounded Heart, lists several types of sexual abuse, among which is intrusive interest in the anatomy and development of a child. If I were the 16yo boy, I would have felt very awkward and intruded upon by such questioning, and would most likely have terminated the conversation early on.

Andy

_________________________
List of things ain't nobody got time for:

1. That


If I could meet myself as a boy...

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#84448 - 10/07/06 11:10 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
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Registered: 05/02/05
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Andy,

Quote:
If I were the 16yo boy, I would have felt very awkward and intruded upon by such questioning, and would most likely have terminated the conversation early on.
That's what's especially alarming about these tran>
_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84449 - 10/08/06 02:20 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
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This one is pretty incredible. Apart from the explicit statement that teenagers aren't safe around Congressman, it proposes the solution of punishing the victims. If kids aren't safe in the program as presently constituted, then the safety aspects of the program need to be improved and their enforcement needs to be more diligent.

If a biridge across a river is damaged and unsafe, what's the way forward? Tear down the bridge and tell people they can't cross the river anymore? Or repair the bridge?


_______________________________________________________________________

Debate Turns to Future of Page Program
Some call for its end, saying lawmakers can't be trusted. Others, including past pages, defend what has long been a Hill institution.

WASHINGTON — When Republican representatives hooked up for a conference call this week to discuss the political crisis over former Rep. Mark Foley's salacious messages to former pages, the most heated discussion was not over House Speaker J. Dennis Hastert's handling of the matter, but over the future of the congressional page program.

"They all supported the speaker," said one participant in the call. "It got tense over whether the entire page program should be abolished."

A few lawmakers, notably Rep. Ray LaHood (R-Ill.), have suggested that the program be scrapped. "Send the pages home," he said, noting at one point that it's "pretty obvious" lawmakers can't be trusted around them.

But after Congress scrubs off the latest tarnish, the venerable program is likely to persevere. For senators and representatives, it's a much-cherished perk that they can bestow on the children of constituents. For former pages, who ardently defend the program, it's an inspirational opportunity to see politicians at work in the cloakrooms of power.

"For every page failed by a congressman, there is a page who turned out to be a congressman," Kevin O'Connor, a Republican page in the summer of 2003, wrote in an e-mail. "I left the page program with a broadened perspective, a wildly diverse array of friends and no regrets."

There are currently 63 House pages and 30 Senate pages, mostly 16-year-olds. They attend high school starting at 6 a.m. and then run errands for Congress — answering phones, taking messages, delivering documents — often late into the night, when they return to secured dorms to finish their homework.

Foley's sexually explicit messages have recalled the program's lowest point, in 1983, when two House members were censured for sexual relationships with pages. A six-member board made up of lawmakers and staffers was then set up to oversee the program. But in this case, only one of the three congressional members was told about Foley's messages.

Hastert has rebuffed calls to suspend or end the program. Instead, he said Thursday that he was looking "for a person of high caliber to advise us." He also set up a tip line to report inappropriate behavior toward pages.

The patronage program has a long history, starting with a 9-year-old appointed by Sen. Daniel Webster of Massachusetts in 1829. It's a favorite of the Capitol's 535 politicians because it allows them to reward promising students — and sometimes the scions of powerful political allies.

For years, Rep. Dan Rostenkowski (D-Ill.), chairman of the powerful Ways and Means Committee, visited Gordon Tech High School in Chicago to select two pages to join him in Washington for the school year. On the Senate side, Sen. Strom Thurmond (R-S.C.), who served the longest in the upper chamber, brought new pages to his office from South Carolina every month.

These days, the page program is more regulated and has strict merit requirements — students can't be appointed unless they have 3.0 grade-point averages and letters of recommendation from community leaders.

But the families of some pages are politically well-connected.

Robert Rose, a Senate page in 2002 and now a senior at Georgetown University, said his mother's cousin was a political memorabilia expert who became friends with an aide to Thurmond, who nominated Rose. "This sort of thing is very typical," he said. "I only knew of one or two people in my page class who did not have some sort of prior connection to somebody in office."

But Shyanna Hughes of Los Angeles said just a few in her class arrived through connections. "It was kind of obvious: 'OK, they have a lot of money. OK, her dad is the governor of a state,' " said Hughes, who was a page in 1997. "You could definitely tell there were some there, but I would say it was a very low percentage."

Most of the pages during the 1992-93 school year had no ties to politicians, said Naomi Wallace, who was appointed by Rep. Henry A. Waxman (D-Los Angeles). "I had one roommate from Michigan who competed against 3,000 applicants and another from West Virginia whose family income was $20,000 a year," said Wallace, who is shopping around a book about her year in Washington.

Mindful of the political calendar, Wallace, now a theater arts student in London, dismissed talk of scrapping the program as rhetoric timed for the midterm elections. "In my opinion, 16-year-olds should not be punished because the Republicans are afraid of losing their majority in the House," she said.

Wallace said pages were warned to be wary. "Sexwise, we were constantly reminded about the scandal from a few years prior," she said.

James Kotecki, of Raleigh, N.C., remembers that the pages at his orientation in 2003 were told to address lawmakers formally. But he said the informal conversations the politicians initiated were among the most rewarding experiences. "They just made us love politics even more, to see it at an up-close level," said Kotecki, now at Georgetown University. "If they feel they can't have informal contact with us, the pages would lose a very valuable experience."

The rules on fraternization are so strict that one page said even his mother had to prove who she was to see him.

"When my mom came, she had to sign me out, show ID and talk to my proctor before she could take me out," said Richard Frohlichstein, who served as a page from Missouri. "When someone asks me about the program, I can never think of a negative thing."

The idea that one congressman's lewd behavior toward male pages could jeopardize the existence of the program has alarmed its graduates.

Zack Hall, a University of Texas sophomore who was a House page in 2004, has launched "Save the Congressional Page Program" on the networking site Facebook.com.

"I think getting rid of the page program would be avoiding the problem," he said. "The problem is, members of Congress are powerful people and we need to protect pages, not just get rid of it."

This view is shared by some powerful ex-pages — members of Congress.

"It's just as good a program now as it was for me in 1938," said Rep. John D. Dingell (D-Mich.), a former page who was first elected in 1955 and is now the most senior member of Congress. "Asking if we should suspend the page program is the wrong question. We should be asking what has happened to Congress that would bring us to even consider ending this terrific opportunity for talented teenagers."

_______________________________________________________________________

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84450 - 10/09/06 10:59 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
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Registered: 05/02/05
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So Foley's activities were known among party heads as early as 2000. Are we surprised? The primacy of political gain over the welfare of our kids is a problem we have seen so many times already.

What seems to emerge from this new story is that the Republican Party is anxious to display a vigorous response to the scandal that will produce results before the elections.


_______________________________________________________________

Report: GOP lawmaker warned Foley in '00


A Republican member of Congress confronted then-Rep. Mark Foley (news, bio, voting record) about his Internet communications with teenagers as early as 2000, according to a newspaper report.

The report in the Washington Post pushes back by at least five years the date when a member of Congress acknowledges learning of the Florida Republican's questionable behavior toward pages.

It came as the Republican leadership attempted to present a united front on the congressional page scandal that has rocked the GOP a month before midterm elections and put House Speaker Dennis Hastert on shaky ground.

Though Rep. Adam Putnam (news, bio, voting record), R-Fla., insisted Sunday that "the dirty laundry in our conference is gone," that claim appeared to be premature.

The Washington Post reported Sunday night that Rep. Jim Kolbe (news, bio, voting record), R-Ariz., confronted Foley about his Internet communications with teenagers as early as 2000.

The Post said that a former page showed Kolbe some Internet messages from Foley that had made the page uncomfortable. Kolbe's press secretary, Korenna Cline, told the Post that a Kolbe staff member advised the page last week to discuss the matter with the clerk of the House.

Hastert and his aides have been criticized for failing to act promptly after receiving warnings about Foley's questionable electronic communications with pages.

Hastert since has insisted he was not aware of the communications until recently. But on the day after Foley resigned, New York Rep. Tom Reynolds said he had told Hastert months ago about concerns that Foley had sent inappropriate messages. Reynolds now says he cannot remember exactly when he learned of Foley's e-mails or when he told Hastert about them.

Putnam sat in Sunday for Reynolds, who canceled an appearance on ABC's "This Week" because, said an aide, he was suffering from a "flu-like" ailment. Reynolds is facing a tough re-election fight against Democrat Jack Davis.

Reynolds has been criticized by Democrats who say he did too little to protect a male teenage page from Foley who resigned Sept. 29 after disclosure of his inappropriate electronic messages to former congressional pages. Foley is now under investigation by federal and Florida authorities.

Putnam, who heads the Republican Policy Committee, sought to make the case that Hastert's office "acted proactively, they acted aggressively, and within hours of the explicit e-mails coming to light, they demanded Foley's resignation."

One Republican lawmaker said Sunday that those who participated in a cover-up would have to resign.

"Anybody that hindered this in any kind of way, tried to step in the way of hiding this, covering it up, is going to have to step down. Whoever that is," said Rep. Tom Davis, R-Va.

The House ethics committee is investigating the matter. If it finds evidence of a cover-up, the punishment could range from a mild rebuke in a committee report to a House vote of censure or expulsion.

Rep. Patrick McHenry, R-N.C., said Democrats should be investigated to see whether they leaked the explicit e-mails to gain a political advantage before the elections, although the lawmaker acknowledged he had no evidence indicating that was the case.

Responded Rep. Charles Rangel (news, bio, voting record), D-N.Y.: "I think it's ridiculous. But if I was in a bind, as the Republicans are now, I guess I would be reaching for straws. But it's sad."

Hastert, R-Ill., last week tried to blame the Democrats and the news media for leaking the story but then accepted responsibility. He's resisted pressure to resign his speaker's post over his handling of the scandal.

"There's been a lot of ducking and dodging and diving and weaving," said Rep. Ray LaHood (news, bio, voting record), R-Ill. "There is a lot of fingerpointing that had gone on earlier in the week, but I do think people are behind the speaker now."

Republicans have mixed views on the upcoming elections.

"This is going to be the most difficult 30 days in the last 12 years that we've been the majority party," LaHood said. The GOP took power after the 1994 election.

Almost half of Americans surveyed in a recent Associated Press-Ipsos poll said recent disclosures of corruption and scandal will be extremely or very important to their vote.

Also, more than half of those surveyed in a Newsweek poll released this weekend believe Hastert tried to cover up news of Foley's messages to the pages. That poll gives Democrats the advantage on handling moral values, normally a Republican strong point.

Reynolds began an ad campaign Saturday in which he apologized for not doing more.

"Nobody's angrier and more disappointed that I didn't catch his lies," Reynolds says. "I trusted that others had investigated. Looking back, more should have been done, and for that, I am sorry."

Putnam was on ABC, McHenry and Rangel appeared on CNN's "Late Edition," Davis and LaHood were on CBS' "Face the Nation."

_______________________________________________________________

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#84451 - 10/11/06 10:52 PM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
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Registered: 05/02/05
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Apparently Foley got drunk and came prowling around the pages' dormitory late one night. Definitely a class act.

_______________________________________________________________

Foley's Reputed Visit to the Page Dormitory

Oct 10, 2006 — House speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Ill., tries to change the subject. But the accusations about Hastert subordinates who were apparently told about Congressman Mark Foley's questionable behavior keep coming.

Hastert spoke to reporters Tuesday, insisting that he and the GOP House leadership had done nothing wrong in the House page scandal involving ex-Rep. Mark Foley, R-Fla. The speaker heralded the economy: "We've lowered people's taxes. They have more money in their pockets to spend," he said.

Meanwhile, ABC News has learned that one former staffer who worked for the GOP leadership will tell the House Ethics Committee Thursday about an incident several years ago in which he was alerted that an apparently inebriated Foley had tried to gain access to the pages' dormitory.

A source with firsthand knowledge of events says that this coming Thursday, Kirk Fordham -- former chief of staff to both Foley and more recently Rep. Tom Reynolds, R-N.Y. -- will testify that a few years ago he was told by then-House clerk Jeff Trandahl that Foley had been stopped while trying to enter the pages' dorm in an apparently intoxicated state. The source said Fordham will testify that he recalls this being the event that convinced both him and Trandahl to warn Hastert's office, with Fordham designated to have the conversation with Hastert's chief of staff, Scott Palmer. The source said that both aides had been watching Foley's behavior with pages and that Fordham had counseled Foley to watch his behavior.

The source tells ABC News that Fordham will testify that he alerted Palmer that Foley had a pattern of displaying inappropriate behavior toward pages. Asked about Fordham's claim that he met with Palmer in approximately 2003 to warn him about Foley's behavior, Palmer said in a statement, "What Kirk Fordham said did not happen."

Last month, before the Foley scandal broke, Rep. Ginny Brown-Waite, R-Fla., also learned about the dormitory incident, which she said she was told about from firsthand sources. After learning about an inappropriate but not sexually charged e-mail Foley sent, which had been posted on ABCNEWS.com's "The Blotter" on Thursday Sept. 28, Brown-Waite decided to launch her own investigation. She said she alerted GOP leadership on Friday Sept. 29 about both the dorm incident and about pages who had been made to feel uncomfortable by Foley. That evening the Foley scandal erupted with news of the lurid Instant Messages Foley had sent former pages.

But in Aurora, Ill., today Hastert told ABC News that he didn't know of any Foley incident other than those conducted via computer. "I understood what my staff has told me, and they've handled it as well as they should have," he said. "In 20/20 hindsight, you could probably do everything a little better."

"If there was a problem, if there was a cover-up then we should find that out through the investigation process," Hastert said. "They'll be under oath, and we'll find out if they did cover up something; then they should not continue to have their jobs."

Across the country, the scandal continued to reverberate. In Oklahoma City, the FBI interviewed former congressional page Jordan Edmund -- and his lawyer -- for 2˝ hours about inappropriate e-mails Foley may have sent him.


McCain Wants an Independent Investigation

In Michigan, Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., broke from the Republican Party line and renewed a call for an independent investigation of the House page scandal. "We cannot tolerate the intolerable," McCain said, adding that congressional leadership should have called for an outside group of highly respected former congressmen to get to the bottom of inappropriate contact Foley may have had with pages and whether anyone in the House leadership erred by not doing something sooner about the problem.

Such a group would need to be selected and "look at this quickly and assign responsibility and recommend measures that need to be taken," McCain said. An independent investigation would restore "credibility" to the leadership, McCain said, because after all, "there's conflicting stories as we all know as to who knew what and when." Evoking the Watergate scandal, McCain said it all invokes former GOP Sen. "Howard Baker's famous comment: 'What did they know and when did they know it?'"

McCain's was not the only voice embattled Hastert may not have been happy to hear Tuesday. The Foley scandal continued to distract from issues the GOP leadership would rather control and has further instilled an impression that the House leadership tried to cover up Foley's behavior. In an ABC News poll released this week, 64 percent of those surveyed said they believed the GOP House leadership tried to cover up the Foley scandal, although 75 percent said they didn't believe the Democrats would have handled it any differently.

Nor was McCain even the only Arizona Republican congressman to add fuel to the fire Tuesday. Tuesday morning Rep. Jim Kolbe, R-Ariz., elucidated a previous report from the Washington Post about an incident Kolbe was told about that involved a former page receiving inappropriate e-mails from Foley.


A Different Account of the Story

"Some time after leaving the page program, an individual I had appointed as a page contacted my office to say he had received e-mails from Rep. Foley that made him uncomfortable," Kolbe said in a statement. Contrary to the Washington Post story, Kolbe said he "was not shown the content of the messages and was not told they were sexually explicit," nor did he "have a personal conversation with Mr. Foley about the matter." Kolbe said he instructed his staff to report this complaint to the clerk of the House, who "supervised the page program. This was done promptly."

"I assume e-mail contact ceased, since the former page never raised the issue again with my office. I believed then, and believe now, that this was the appropriate way to handle this incident, given the information I had and the fact that the young man was no longer a page and not subject to the jurisdiction of the program."

Hastert said that Kolbe "was on the page board" and it was his job to report such an incident. "I don't know anything more about it," he said.

Hastert spent some of the day Tuesday meeting with evangelical leader K.A. Paul, founder of the Global Peace Initiative, who prayed with the speaker at Hastert's Plano, Illinois, home. Paul said he had hoped to convince the speaker to step down, since the Foley scandal had become such a distraction.
__________________________________________________________________

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84452 - 10/19/06 09:41 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
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Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Here's one you guys may not have seen. THIS is the story I have been waiting for!!!

_____________________________________________________________

The Meaning of the Foley Follies

by Debbie Woodell

IT IS, OF COURSE, ladies and gentlemen, a vast left-wing conspiracy that masterminded the fall of Mark Foley. My friends, the liberals conspired to wait until just before this crucial midterm election to spring this sleazy story upon an unsuspecting populace, risking the entire Republican stranglehold, er, leadership.

Yes, it is sometimes imperative to hear what a certain element thinks about important matters of the day. And, of course, there is a vast right-wing spin on the disgraceful conclusion of Foley's political career.

Besides accusing the "liberal media" of sitting on the story until election time, there has been finger-pointing at "liberals" who favor a "homosexual agenda" that would get someone like Foley elected in the first place. Pedophilia is pedophilia, not homosexuality, and, as a colleague noted, this "blame the gays" ploy is what the Catholic Church did when the priest sex abuse scandal broke.

Interesting how some stories come full-circle, since the ex-congressman blames abuse by a priest for his own salacious behavior in soliciting teen pages. So there's the first place where we really should point fingers. There is a special place in hell for the cardinals, bishops, priests and popes who allowed abuse to go unchecked for decades.

There are way more than 435 people to share in the rest of the blame. Start with Foley. How hard is it to keep your hands off children? So you're a power-hungry closet case; there is never an excuse to abuse your position in this way.

Next, there are all of those in Congress who knew about this, apparently as far back as 2000. It is despicable that someone - Arizona Rep. Jim Kolbe, House Speaker Dennis Hastert, Florida Republicans like Gov. Jeb Bush? - thought that a GOP majority in Congress was more important than protecting children. And, yes, the media share blame - not for sitting on the story, but for failing to investigate it vigorously.

And, finally, we are to blame - for sitting out too many elections, for not getting involved with politics, in some cases, not even putting up decent candidates to knock the incumbents out of their comfort zone, or out of office.

Now, with Election Day less than a month away, people in this country have way more than 435 reasons to go to the polls. You know what to do.

_____________________________________________________________

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#84453 - 10/21/06 11:37 AM Re: "You in your boxers?"
roadrunner Offline
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Registered: 05/02/05
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This is worth reading as well. I think the case could have been stated more emphatically, but this guy does hit on the key points of 1) what abuse is all about, and 2) that "mere fondling" and exposure and contact short of actual sex acts are still abusive and can cause tremendous harm to the victim.

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Experts say Foley priest's denial quite typical

SUMMARY: "I've heard (this) time and time again from priests who have been grooming or setting a young boy up for molestation," said one victim advocate.

Experts on sex abuse say the comments of a Roman Catholic priest who acknowledged being naked with Mark Foley when the former congressman was young fit a pattern of distorted thinking that they've seen over and over among offenders.

The Rev. Anthony Mercieca told The Associated Press in a telephone interview that he was naked with Foley in a sauna, and was quoted in other interviews saying he also fondled him. Mercieca told the AP that the encounters weren't sexual, a distinction abuse experts found disturbing.

"The priest is very focused on the legalities here and I think it's important for the rest of us to see the enormous power differential between these two," said David Finkelhor, director of the Crimes Against Children Research Center at the University of New Hampshire.

"There is a tremendous abuse of authority and position involved in these activities whether or not they constitute child molestation."

Foley, 52, resigned from Congress last month after his sexually explicit computer messages to young male pages were released. His lawyer has said that Foley was an alcoholic, gay and had been molested as a youth by a clergyman.

The Archdiocese of Miami confirmed Friday that Mercieca, 69, is the person Foley said abused him as a teen. In phone interviews, the priest, who is retired and lives on the Maltese island of Gozo, has given details about his encounters with Foley four decades ago.

The priest told the Sarasota (Fla.) Herald-Tribune that he and Foley "loved each other like brothers" and that although he taught Foley "some wrong things" related to sex, Mercieca insisted their interactions were innocent.

"It was just fondling," he told WPTV of West Palm Beach, Fla.

From the perspective of people who have worked with abusers and their victims, that thinking is typical of a molester. Offenders, who are sexually immature, commonly view their involvement with their victims as normal and are baffled when others see things differently.

"This is the same type of rationalization that I've heard time and time again from priests who have been grooming or setting a young boy up for molestation," said the Rev. Thomas Doyle, a canon lawyer turned victim advocate.

The Herald-Tribune reported that Mercieca said he could not clearly remember one encounter "that might have gone too far" because he had been taking tranquilizers and drinking at the time.

"It's common that offenders will block out major pieces of the events. I personally believe that it's also part of the denial process, where they just don't, frankly, want to remember," said the Rev. Stephen J. Rossetti, president of Saint Luke Institute, which provides psychological counseling to Catholic priests who suffer from a variety of troubles, including sexual attraction to children.

"Those are typical kinds of statements of offenders who are not in recovery."

Abusers assume that because a young person seems to be enthusiastic around them, that any boundary crossing or sexual activity is OK, Finkelhor said. And if no penetration occurs, molesters convince themselves that the interaction does not hurt the youth, he said.

Mercieca's "basic approach is, 'You're trying to take something good and trying to turn it into something evil,' " said Peter Isely, a clinical social worker who counsels abuse victims and a leader of the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests.

"He literally describes this 12- or 13-year old child as if they're equals in age and in personality and characteristic, as if there's absolutely no power differential," Isely said.

"This is what makes these offenders so dangerous."

States have different legal definitions of what constitutes child molestation, but many consider inappropriate touching a criminal offense. Mike Edmondson, a spokesman for the state attorney's office in West Palm Beach, Fla., said law enforcement action is over in Mercieca's case unless other alleged victims come forward, because Foley says he doesn't want to prosecute.

From a clinical perspective, Mercieca's de>
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