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#83963 - 06/22/06 05:27 PM .
jacobtk Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/08/03
Posts: 527
.



Edited by jacobtk (05/17/07 12:55 PM)
_________________________
Every day I die again, and again I’m reborn/Every day I have to find the courage/To walk out into the street/With arms out/Got a love you can’t defeat/Neither down nor out/There’s nothing you have that I need/I can breathe/Breathe now - U2

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#83964 - 06/22/06 08:49 PM Re: What an idiot
Nobbynobs Offline
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MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/26/05
Posts: 1286
Loc: Toronto
What do you expect from a guy who can only play 3 notes on the guitar? All those decibels have probably knocked what little sense he had right out of his head.

_________________________
When you go up to the bell, ring it! Or don't go up to the bell.

- Mel Brooks

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#83965 - 06/22/06 10:06 PM Re: What an idiot
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Hmmmmm. As a guitar player myself I can confirm that Pete Townshend has been one of the most talented and innovative guitarists that rock has ever produced. Decibels yes...God, when I first heard the Who I thought I would never recover my hearing!

His music is incredible in my own opinion, and while some of his early material was lyrically rather silly, songs like "My Generation" and everything on "Tommy" brilliantly caught something that Townshend has been trying to convey throughout his career: the feelings that youth have that they are lost, alienated and unimportant in an adult world. A lot of that came through in his "Life House" project, parts of which were released as the classical rock album "Who's Next". More of the same in "Quadrophenia".

It was already clear to me as a teenager that Townshend is a survivor himself; in some of his songs it could hardly be more obvious. I could identify with the way he found to cope with this burden: alcohol and drugs. For a long time he was an impossible drunk and he and Keith Moon were the ones responsible for the Who's reputation for demolishing hotel rooms. He also had really bad drug problems and would show up for a gig so drunk that the only way he could perform was for Moon to fix him before the show. A lot of the incredible performance the Who put into their shows was really all about Townshend's need to let loose with pure unadulterated emotion.

Though a wild man himself, he is also a very reflective and intelligent guy and was largely responsible for the fact that Eric Clapton is alive today. Townshend got him into rehab to get him off heroin and alcohol (a bottle of brandy per day).

Like many rock icons, Townshend grew up with the idea that the rules just didn't apply to him. He spent much of his life as a loose cannon on the deck in all sorts of ways, and he has paid a heavy price for that. He has shot himself in the foot many times, but personally (and this is just my opinion) I don't think for a minute that he's a pedophile.

I hope he gets his autobiography out, and I hope this gives him some peace concerning his past. He surely needs it.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#83966 - 06/23/06 12:50 AM Re: What an idiot
Nobbynobs Offline
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MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/26/05
Posts: 1286
Loc: Toronto
I don't know the guy, so all I have to go on is the media reports, which I admit are not the greatest source of truth. However, he seems to keep doing this, from using his credit card to buy pictures of little girls getting raped to writing kiddy porn. I say actions speak louder than words. He's a creep.

You'd think he learned how much the rules do apply to him the last time they caught him at this stuff.

_________________________
When you go up to the bell, ring it! Or don't go up to the bell.

- Mel Brooks

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#83967 - 06/23/06 01:11 AM Re: What an idiot
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Nobby,

Quote:
You'd think he learned how much the rules do apply to him the last time they caught him at this stuff.
I agree with you and I don't mean to be defending this behavior, but in fact many of these people really don't get it at all. Here's an example. When I was in San Francisco in the late sixties a friend of mine, a guitar player in a band famous all over the country, decided he had to get clean off heroin. Great idea, so what does he do? He goes on a canoeing/rafting trip in the mountains with his wife and three yo son, but he takes along lots of drinks and of course his works for shooting up. One night he and his wife are totally drunk and he fixes her; she ODs and dies right there in front of her toddler son. After this catastrophe does he "get it"? Nope. He continued as before and hadn't learned a thing.

It's a mentality I could never understand, but of course we see it all the time.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#83968 - 06/23/06 06:55 AM Re: What an idiot
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
Hmmm,

When I saw what this one was about, I figured there'd be some comments....

Love you guys,

John

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

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#83969 - 06/23/06 11:43 AM Re: What an idiot
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
I do feel sorry that he has been hounded by the media, but it is sad that he had to write stuff like that, he is treading muddy waters for himself and his family.

I used to really like him, but he should have more sense than to try and hang himself,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#83970 - 06/24/06 06:24 PM Re: What an idiot
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Ste,

You are so right. People like this surely know already that the harsh media spotlight on them is going to draw the wolves at any provocation.

Townshend was pushing the envelope when he wrote and sang about "Uncle Earnie" and his "fiddling about" with Tommy in 1970, TWO FULL DECADES before the abuse of boys was taken seriously in our society. But what these iconic figures often don't understand is that these achievements - whether musical, social, political, or whatever - don't give them a pass for whatever they want to say or do in the future.

For the record, and although I didn't see the piece PT wrote about the two sixteen year old, I would be willing to bet that it's autobiographical.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#83971 - 06/25/06 12:40 AM Re: What an idiot
Kirk Wayne Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/05
Posts: 499
Loc: Shrewsbury UK
Having worked in the UK music industry of the early to mid seventies and two of my abusers being executives in the same industry you would be right in thinking I am a a music nut. That said I have followed The Who since the mid sixties and have seen them live more times than I care to remember, but one thing I did hear with regard Mr. Townshend was he went through a spell of that old chestnut the all prevaling "Sexual Identity Crisis".

I always identified with his lyrics especially so with the release of "Quadrophenia":

The Real Me:

I went back to the doctor
To get another shrink.
I sit and tell him about my weekend,
But he never betrays what he thinks.

Can you see the real me, doctor?

I went back to my mother
I said, "I'm crazy ma, help me."
She said, "I know how it feels son,
'Cause it runs in the family."

Can you see the real me, mother?

The cracks between the paving stones
Look like rivers of flowing veins.
Strange people who know me
Peeping from behind every window pane.
The girl I used to love
Lives in this yellow house.
Yesterday she passed me by,
She doesn't want to know me now.

Can you see the real me, can you?

I ended up with the preacher,
Full of lies and hate,
I seemed to scare him a little
So he showed me to the golden gate.

Can you see the real me preacher?
Can you see the real me doctor?
Can you see the real me mother?
Can you see the real me?

And this one especially. I really thought at one time it was about me and I still regard it as my song.

Dr. Jimmy:

Laugh and say I'm green
I've seen things you'll never see.
Talk behind my back
But I'm off the beaten track.
I'll take on anyone
Ain't scared of a bloody nose,
Drink till I drop down
With one eye on my clothes.

What is it? I'll take it.
Who is she? I'll rape it.
Got a bet there? I'll meet it.
Getting High? You can't beat it.

Doctor Jimmy and mister Jim
When I'm pilled you don't notice him,
He only comes out when I drink my gin.

You say she's a virgin.
I'm gonna be the first in.
Her fellah's gonna kill me?
Oh fucking will he.
I'm seeing double
But don't miss me if you can.
There's gonna be trouble
When she choses her man.

What is it? [etc.]

Doctor Jimmy and mister Jim etc.
Is it me? For a moment
The stars are falling.
The heat is rising
The past is calling.

I'm going back soon
Home to get the baboon.
Who cut up my eye,
Messed up my Levis.
I'm feeling restless
Bring another score around
Maybe something stronger
Could really hold me down.

Townshend to me is one of the chief commenators of the 20th Century, but how can a man with his intelligence go into a CP site and pay for images for research? ...... That act was/is beyond my comphrehension, I know what CP is like it happened to me and I dont need reminding by way of looking at stuff like that, I would have thought he had a good enough imagination to figure it out without entering one of those sites he certainly had an insight when he wrote "Uncle Ernie" from Tommy.

However it is now well known that Townshend was abused by his grandmother and that he has only just recently disclosed but he was getting close to that point with the publication of this essay:

A Different Bomb.

It is a pdf document and it can be read here at:

http://www.petetownshend.co.uk/media/020120adifferentbomb.pdf

As to his recent writings on teenage sex I have no desire to read it and wonder why he did publish it on the net is he going through some sort of perverse way of purging himself?

Like Roadrunner I dont think Townshend is a paedophile either as I know he has been supportive of survivor groups in the past.

Kirk
"Lets grab this bull by the horns and swing it about a bit"


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#83972 - 06/25/06 01:46 AM Re: What an idiot
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Kirk,

I don't know if Pete has ever commented on it himself, but when he and the Who were just getting started and were still pretty innocent to the "ways of the world", Kit Lambert had him and Keith Moon staying in his flat with him on various occasions. I often wondered what that was all about, but perhaps it was just Lambert being supportive. Back then the Who were more or less penniless and hardly getting by.

Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#83973 - 06/25/06 10:00 AM Re: What an idiot
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Guys,

I always respected him, even though I did not follow the WHO, but somehow suspected he had been abused.

That is what made me feel sorry for him, that the media turned on him because of his fame.
I never even read his lyrics, so I did not know of those songs.

Paying for CP is indeed part of making money for perps who pay kids to do stuff.
I got a life sentence for being an innocent boy, maybe he did too.

I would not want to read what he wrote about sex stuff, but he was totally misguided in doing it, and it will keep the media and cops going after him all the more.

He is intelligent, he should be given a chance to at least a life, without the media constantly gunning for him, but first he needs to find himself, because sadly he cannot do it,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#83974 - 06/25/06 10:42 AM Re: What an idiot
Kirk Wayne Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/05
Posts: 499
Loc: Shrewsbury UK
"Kit Lambert" ....says it all really.

Kirk
"Lets grab this bull by the horns and swing it about a bit"


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#83975 - 06/25/06 11:16 AM Re: What an idiot
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Kirk,

That's what I was afraid of. So far as I know it was always just the two wild ones: Townshend and Moon.

Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#83976 - 06/25/06 02:35 PM Re: What an idiot
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Kirk,

yes I remember that creep, but I was in no way a Who fan, so I never really got to know what went on.

After reading a few things about him, I can now have a better picture, the music industry seemed to be alive with pervs at the time, probably still is,

ste

Not to mention Radio,TV, and the movie industry!

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#83977 - 06/25/06 03:13 PM Re: What an idiot
Nobbynobs Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/26/05
Posts: 1286
Loc: Toronto
Quote:
Originally posted by reality2k4:
Not to mention Radio,TV, and the movie industry!
What is Roman Polanski up to these days?

For the record, I don't know enough about the story to know if Townshend is a perp or a survivor, but I wonder at his seeming propensity to keep showing up in the news. Although that said, the media will be the 1st in line to rape you if you show even the smallest sign of non-conformity or weakness, especially if you are a celebrity.

I wonder if Teri Hatcher has these problems?

_________________________
When you go up to the bell, ring it! Or don't go up to the bell.

- Mel Brooks

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#83978 - 06/25/06 04:02 PM Re: What an idiot
Kirk Wayne Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/05
Posts: 499
Loc: Shrewsbury UK
Ste

They are still there in the music industry usually in high powered positions. Out of my abusers five were conected to the music industry either by way of the music press, owner of clubs or in the actual industry by working for labels, radio stations or management of some very high profile stars.

Kirk
"Lets grab this bull by the horns and swing it about a bit"


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#83979 - 06/25/06 09:59 PM Re: What an idiot
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Kirk, funnily I worked for a band but only as a small cog in it.
My best friend was the idea behind it, and I got pretty much out of it when he got DJs to work with him.

I have a soundtrack somewhere of the Christians, which never got released because they are a dysfunctional family, and too much in fighting between them.

I did the bass line for brothers and sisters, one day when Dan and his family went shopping.
It was the original soundtrack and is hard to find, but it has been on radio one.

You guessed it, many times schoolgirls would hang around his house, and ask me if I was part of the band, and I would say sort of.
I would not have used those kids in any way, nor would Dan, but the DJs would.

I worked with this guy because he had so many cool friends who could play tom toms the Afro Carribean way, and we just drifted into making music our own way.

I think that Moon and Townsend got into the wrong type of company.
You, or any of us choose the company we want to spend our lives around.

Sadly, to be famous, you must forfeit something of your life to get anywhere.
Maybe Satan works in mysterious ways.

I shunned him out age ten, and I would rather be poor than humiliated, and rich,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#83980 - 06/26/06 12:47 AM Re: What an idiot
Kirk Wayne Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/05
Posts: 499
Loc: Shrewsbury UK
I didnt want to be famous, never wanted to be a rock n roll star just a roadie. I love electrical equipment :-)

Kirk
"Lets grab this bull by the horns and swing it about a bit"


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#83981 - 06/28/06 05:48 PM Re: What an idiot
melliferal Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/03/05
Posts: 1159
Famous people are used to just shrugging things off. One noted film director, Victor Salva, was arrested and served jail time in the late 80's for taping himself molesting a young boy, an actor in a movie he was directing at the time. When he got out of jail, he kept right on keeping on; he's the director of those recent "Jeepers Creepers" movies and is reasonably well off.

Survivor or not, I found Townshend's child porn "research" technique to be very unwise, "call to the police" or not. After having endured that mess, writing erotic fiction involving minors is brainlessness on a truly spectacular level.

_________________________
Children cannot consent; they can only comply.

Oprah's resources for male survivors

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#83982 - 06/28/06 06:18 PM Re: What an idiot
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Melliferal,

I certainly see what you mean and I don't condone this kind of thing, but, well, I don't think it's brainlessness - it really is something else.

I keep thinking of my friend anxious to get clean of heroin years ago. He and his wife take their child on a camping/rafting/canoeing trip, they set up camp, and the little boy snuggles up with Mommy to have a story read to him, and meanwhile here's Daddy shooting up Mommy.

Leave aside the part where the ODed mother is beyond saving a minute later. How can anyone NOT see something wrong with this picture??? But that's what happens and even very intelligent people get caught in this trap, not just with drugs but all kinds of things. I'm really at a loss to explain it.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#83983 - 06/29/06 12:17 AM Re: What an idiot
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
Townsend is one of my heroes, has been since I first saw The Who onstage in 1969, the same tour as the Live at Leeds album came from.

Before that I'd got one of the early albums with "Uncle Ernie" on it, and that track always made me feel uncomfortable, as though 'they knew' all about me.

Signing up for child porn and using a credit card is stupidity beyond my comprehension, who thinks that credit cards are untraceable ?
Well, just look at this list of people who thought they could get away with it, and marvel at the amount of supposedly educated people on it!

http://www.survivorsswindon.com/ore.htm

I believe Townsend is a survivor, and that his excuse of "doing research" might have some truth in it, but whatever the truth is his reputation suffered badly, so why the hell has he made it worse by writing this 'story'? - which I haven't read.

Survivors DO express themselves in strange and mysterious ways at times, and I'm no different.
Some of my early journal entries are very graphic, and when I read them now I can see the progression within a particular piece that goes from being de>
_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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