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#76433 - 02/17/01 10:42 PM Just an observation...
matt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/13/00
Posts: 23
Loc: Perth, Australia
I don't know if the rest of you find this
annoying.... But I do..
Have you noticed that in many Churches they
stress your own sin, how YOUR sin blocks
you from God... how YOUR sin keeps you in
bondage..
Not to deny the truth of these statements
or anything... but why is MY sin stressed
over the sins other have committed against
me !
The sins committed against me keep me from
God just as much as my own sins..
I 'spose I would just like to hear more
about the healing Jesus brings to the
victim then the nessesity for me to
repent of my sins and be healed..
Sometimes I feel like God only heals me
from my sins... and not the sins committed
against me..
Ah well..
The bane of a church filled with falable
people just like myself..
Thanks for listening to my frustrations..
Matt


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#76434 - 02/18/01 07:08 AM Re: Just an observation...
Neil Offline
Member

Registered: 10/17/00
Posts: 81
Loc: Millersville, MD, USA
I think you hit the nail on the head. I'm still looking for a church that doesn't do that. I don't think that's the way God feels.I think He will heal us if we ask Him but that's not what we hear inside the church. "The Church" can do no wrong. My abuser hid behind the pulpit for 30+ years. He stood up there every Sunday and praised God then walked from behind the pulpit and abused little boys. I carried the burden of his sins for many years. The relief came when I finally realized that they were just that, his sins, not mine. "The Church" didn't help much with that, God did though. You can get healing from the sins of others but I think you first have to stop claiming them as your own sins. It took me a very long time to do that. I am very much responsible for what I do now but I'm not responsible, nor will I be held accountable for, what was done to me as a child. I think "The Church" will be though for turning their back on the children of God. This may be completely off of where you were headed with this but it was what came to mind when I read your post. I will pray for your continued healing. Please pray for mine.


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#76435 - 02/18/01 07:08 AM Re: Just an observation...
Neil Offline
Member

Registered: 10/17/00
Posts: 81
Loc: Millersville, MD, USA
I think you hit the nail on the head. I'm still looking for a church that doesn't do that. I don't think that's the way God feels.I think He will heal us if we ask Him but that's not what we hear inside the church. "The Church" can do no wrong. My abuser hid behind the pulpit for 30+ years. He stood up there every Sunday and praised God then walked from behind the pulpit and abused little boys. I carried the burden of his sins for many years. The relief came when I finally realized that they were just that, his sins, not mine. "The Church" didn't help much with that, God did though. You can get healing from the sins of others but I think you first have to stop claiming them as your own sins. It took me a very long time to do that. I am very much responsible for what I do now but I'm not responsible, nor will I be held accountable for, what was done to me as a child. I think "The Church" will be though for turning their back on the children of God. This may be completely off of where you were headed with this but it was what came to mind when I read your post. I will pray for your continued healing. Please pray for mine.


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#76436 - 02/24/01 10:19 AM Re: Just an observation...
wert Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/02/00
Posts: 21
Loc: Ut
Matt,

Being healed is where the true atonement of Jesus Christ comes into play. I know that in the Garden of Gesthemane Jesus personally felt every pain I have been through, going through, and will go through. He understands me better than anyone else on this planet. Not my parents, brother and sisters, friends, therapist, or even myself knows me better than him. It is awesome to think that He has extened us a wonderful invitation to come to him even in our darkest hour. One of the leaders of my church made a profund statement once. He said about how the>

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#76437 - 02/24/01 10:20 AM Re: Just an observation...
wert Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/02/00
Posts: 21
Loc: Ut
Matt,

email me if you like.

bellevuefreak@juno.com


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#76438 - 03/16/01 06:18 PM Re: Just an observation...
alien61 Offline
Member

Registered: 03/16/01
Posts: 17
I've yet to meet a "christian" that was worthy of knowing let alone a church that was worthy of attending. All the christians I've ever known were fake, hypocrits and had no empathy for fellow man. The whole institution of the church is too exclusive of other unlike themselves. It's black or white. "Either we love you, or we hate your kind" mentality. I'm very disapponted in what I looked up to as a child. I would love to give my life to christ but I've never met a Christian that was Christ-like or followed Christ's beliefs. There is just too much bigotry in the people I've known that called themselves Christians. Hopefully someday I'll meet one that I can respect as a person first.


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#76439 - 03/16/01 06:52 PM Re: Just an observation...
matt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/13/00
Posts: 23
Loc: Perth, Australia
Hey Alien61..
I know what you mean... I've told many people my story and have had a number of reactions... some of my closest christian friends shut down when I told them about my abuse.. basically they felt so awkward about it that I could never mention it again...
Now I have the strength to talk about it more often... stuff it if they find it awkward...
I too struggle with church... I actually talked at a youth service the other week about my abuse... and got a very positive response from the audience..
Alien there are some decent christians out there... not all of us are high & mighty bigots that tell you whats wrong with you instead of just loving you..
Jesus came to love and heal us, to bring us back into relationship with God... I'm sorry that you haven't met any christians that have shown you the same love that Jesus did..
If you want please send me an email in the hope that I can give you a better outlook on christians and hopefully on Christ... (not that I'm perfect or anything... but I'll try !) (mattpearse@hotmail.com)
I'd like to hear your story and how you came to be in this forum..
My story is here http://malesurvivor.org/ubb/Forum12/HTML/000008.html

Hope to hear from you soon..
Matt


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#76440 - 03/16/01 07:24 PM Re: Just an observation...
alien61 Offline
Member

Registered: 03/16/01
Posts: 17
well, what lead me to this forum was a combo of the following;

- fisrt of all, being sexually and mentally abused as a child

- spending the majority of my life thinking it was something else

- having the time and energy to face it now

- not getting my new password for another forum I'd registered for.

My reason for feeling the way I do towards christians and the church is a combo of the following;

- b3ing raised in foster homes where I was exposed to all the major western religions

- living with christians(non-catholic) and seeing the hatred first-hand

- finding out my real father was a christian only to discover that he's the biggest, excuse my language, "prick" I've ever met.

- going to a church and listening to a minister confirm my opinion about christians and hatred/bigotry.

- being a victim/witness of the dark side of the church's(posssibly just my biological father's) ability to manipulate people to harass people(I believe it called "the tech")


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#76441 - 03/17/01 12:15 AM Re: Just an observation...
fmighell Offline
Member

Registered: 02/19/01
Posts: 276
Loc: Anchorage,Alaska
I see things of myself like the physical body, and for today,
Then in-side of me is my soul,
were my heart beats and cry's for you,
not for me,
then I see Gods government of love.
Please find the little shinning seed of love,
in-side of you. Don't look to what others say, but what comes out of your mouth.

That's what words, I give birth to, is my voice giving breath to what, is ether in-side of my heart felt feelings not the brain that house's the round table meetings of my inner voice's of advisers and experiences.
My brain my have control OK sometimes,
but my heart is the compassionate inspired leader if practice.
LOVE-fmighell Anc. Ak.


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#76442 - 03/18/01 02:36 PM Re: Just an observation...
alien61 Offline
Member

Registered: 03/16/01
Posts: 17
Quote:
Originally posted by fmighell:
...Don't look to what others say, but what comes out of your mouth...


I don't mean to tkae this thread in a different direct but I can't agree with the simplicity of that statement. What other people say can "completely" ruin the life of an innocent and good person.

There are some "Very" devious people in this world with nothing better to do than destroy a person for doing nothing more than looking at them the wrong way.


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#76443 - 03/18/01 06:29 PM Re: Just an observation...
matt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/13/00
Posts: 23
Loc: Perth, Australia
Hey Alien61,
Just in reply to your post 2 before..
I can see why you have trouble seeing any good in christians when every christian you've come across has been a "prick" *grin*
Not all christians are actually "christians". Many people come to church out of habit, or just to look like they are good members of the community, but they don't personally know Christ and they haven't actually handed over their lives to him..
On the other hand (thinking of this pastor)you can also get christians that do know Christ and have given their lives to him, but just don't get the jist of love...
(I have no idea how a Christian who has accepted the gift of Jesus dying on the cross to forgive their sins, can then turn around with hatred and bigotry to their fellow men.... The Bible talks about true christians loving their fellow men as they love God)
I spose Alien it comes down to you... When you read the Bible (if you read the Bible) how do you see Jesus ? What do you think of what he does ? Do you belive in Him ? Just because Christians have given you a bad impression don't let that stop you from having your own relationship with God...
Maybe you could try some other churches until you find one you like ?
Anyway I hope this gives you some encouragement that there are decent christians out there who do try to practice what they preach...

Catch ya later... Matt


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#76444 - 03/29/01 09:03 PM Re: Just an observation...
michael Joseph Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/11/01
Posts: 2719
Loc: Virginia
It is not in my heart to hurt someone, but poeple still get hurt. I cannot read minds and from time to time I may hurt people.

It is in my heart to Love because I want love back too. Loving means risking hurt.

I need to be loved, and at some point I will be hurt by someone.


Since we all sin, no one is above any other
on earth. There are no sinless people. Let the one without sin through the first stone.

All I know is that when no one else is there
God is. He does not want his children hurt,
it is other people who hurt children.

_________________________
Standing together is so much better than hiding in the dark.
***I am a three time WoR Retreat Alumni***
The Round Table, Men's CSA Group, Monday 7:30pm CST, MaleSurvivor Chat

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#76445 - 04/05/01 09:12 PM Re: Just an observation...
michael Joseph Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/11/01
Posts: 2719
Loc: Virginia
I had this friend, he is a minister.
I ran into him at a funeral of a mutual friend. He did not know I knew him. At the furneral he did not remember me. If this was on purpose I do not know. He used to kiss me on the lips, very inapropriate.
He knew of my abusive background.

A friend of mine told me years later he hit on him, actual asking to go to bed.

I know God is good, but some ministers and priests are messed up.

_________________________
Standing together is so much better than hiding in the dark.
***I am a three time WoR Retreat Alumni***
The Round Table, Men's CSA Group, Monday 7:30pm CST, MaleSurvivor Chat

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