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#71817 - 06/16/03 08:46 AM Male to Male Child Sexual Abuse
dwf Offline
Moderator/BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/24/03
Posts: 1223
Loc: Austin, Texas USA
Male to Male Child Sexual Abuse in the Context of Homophobia by Kali Munro, M.Ed

Thanks to Mike for pointing out to me the great resources, like the article above available to me at MS. (And for the reminder about the healing power of service! Mike, I'd like to know more).

This single article has helped me understand and begin to resolve issues that have absolutely ruined my life for the past 30 years.

What a relief!

Living with the effects of male to male sexual abuse as I have done was like a long, scary nightmare, only I was awake and it lasted about 25 years.

If the abuse is the darkness, the knowledge gained here is light.

Quote:
The very nature of sexual abuse and incest, and its associated stigma causes humiliation, shame, self-blame, fear, and secrecy for survivors. It can be hard for them to speak openly about their experiences.
Survivors of male-to-male sexual abuse have to contend with the additional stigma and impact of homophobia, which increases their shame, isolation, and secrecy.
(Emphasis added.)

Reading the above article by Kali Munro, a catchy, new slogan came to me:

"You don't have to be gay to suffer from homophobia."

Hearing the stories of sexual confusion of other male survivors, gay and straight; confronting at last my own self loathing in regards to my sexuality, have all given me a tremendous source of relief. I no longer feel so alone.

If you are reading this, then I hope you will find your source too.

I think I secretly told myself that the sexual feelings I have for men must be some type of punishment for something I had done, maybe my imagined complicity in the sexual abuse.
I wasn't sure what I had done, but surely it had to be my fault that I was gay, that I had been sexually abused.

Now that I'm starting to let go of some of these unspoken judgements held against myself, the light of the knowledge and experience of my fellow survivors is able to slowly filter in.

I am, thank God, starting to finally begin to accept myself as a gay man and to value my sexuality as a precious gift instead of as a curse or burden. Who says you can't teach an old (48 yr. old) dog new tricks!

Quote:
Equating the abuse with gay sex leaves most survivors confused and conflicted about their sexuality. If they identify as straight, they may experience homophobic fear and panic that maybe they really aren't. They may take desperate measures to prove to themselves that they aren't gay. Some men may behave in a really macho way, for example, have sex with a number of women, try to get a woman pregnant, or harass gay men. They may in fact be gay, but the thought of being the same as their abuser stops them from coming out, or from feeling comfortable with their gay sexuality.
(Emphasis mine.)

Hearing the stories of hetereo, bi and gay men, all survivors of CSA, kicks the legs out from under a lot of the old boogey men that scared me away from myself. As one of my old queeny friends says, "Get down off that gay cross, girl,
wood is not your color!" In other words, it ain't just us homos that's a sufferin' out here.
(No offense intended.Please forgive.)

I cringed for years at the mention of anything gay. Trying to make myself invisible. For several years as a young man, I became vocally anti-homosexual----a faggot homophobe. Boy it's miserable to have to be your own perpetrator to your own victim! No time for coffee breaks! :p

Now I can relax more and enjoy others and myself.

Hearing of the torment of hetereosexual male survivors of male sexual abuse helps me to see that my suffering is not from being gay or straight but from the sexual abuse compounded by the homophobia we are all taught.

Much thanks to all my 'straight' survivor brothers for having the courage to talk out loud about how they feel. I've had so much of the same shame and guilt, and I thought it was because I was gay.

Quote:
It's not uncommon for survivors of abuse to blame themselves, but men blame themselves for different reasons than women. Men often believe, and quite strongly, that they "let it happen" simply because they are men. Men are supposed to be all powerful--never victims--even when they are children. This places an incredible burden on boys and men, often leaving them feeling guilty, ashamed, depressed, self-hating, and conflicted about their gender and sexuality.
(My emphasis)

My heart fills with emotion as I begin to feel compassion and love for the men here who find the courage to survive and recover.

I'm even starting to feel some compassion for the 15 year old kid from Texas who was scared and
needed a place to go so he did the best he could.
Now he's 48 and finally has his own place.

You guys make me want to cry--tears of relief at finally being able to put the burden down, even if just for a while.

Thanks for helping me to begin to see what it means to be a man. To love myself and to love other men.

I've had a lot going on in my life lately; some good, some difficult; some ambivalent.

Your help in focussing on recovery from the CSA in my life, makes it all easier to take.

RECOMENDED for GAY, STRAIGHT and ALL IN BETWEEN:

http://www.kalimunro.com/article_malesurvivors.html
(For some reason (perhaps my computer inadequacy issues) these links aren't coming through. Any help out there?)

My brothers, pack members and wolf family,
I love you all because of the way you make me feel about myself.

Your brother,

_________________________
"Poke salad Annie, 'gators got you granny
Everybody said it was a shame
'Cause her mama was aworkin' on the chain-gang"

-Tony Joe White

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#71818 - 06/16/03 11:03 AM Re: Male to Male Child Sexual Abuse
ScottyTodd Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 02/12/03
Posts: 1561
Loc: Pennsylvania
Danny - I'm am truly happy for you. When that light goes on in our minds; when the shadows of doubt, confusion and shame fade as the light brightens; when that pressure and burden from all those years is finally put down - a most amazing thing happens! The real us begins to get strong enough to emerge. The "real "because of the masks, the hiding, the silent secret sufferings, the pretending is seen for the fake it is. Honesty can begin to let the real us come out and, you know, we are okay!

Thanks for sharing your "birthing" moment! I look forward to seeing/hearing more of the real Danny bursting onto our posts!! Keep moving forward!! I am really happy for you and with you!!

Howard \:D \:D

_________________________
If you think you can or you can't - you're right!.......anon
It's never too late to have a happy childhood!.....anon
You're very normal for the abnormal situation you've been through..............S. Todd

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#71819 - 06/16/03 11:05 AM Re: Male to Male Child Sexual Abuse
Sans Logos Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/03
Posts: 5791
Loc: in my own world in pittsburgh,...
Danny

Thanks for writing what is in my heart of hearts, my very own story:

Quote:
Hearing the stories of sexual confusion of other male survivors, gay and straight; confronting at last my own self loathing in regards to my sexuality, have all given me a tremendous source of relief. I no longer feel so alone.


I think I secretly told myself that the sexual feelings I have for men must be some type of punishment for something I had done, maybe my imagined complicity in the sexual abuse.
I wasn't sure what I had done, but surely it had to be my fault that I was gay, that I had been sexually abused.

Now that I'm starting to let go of some of these unspoken judgements held against myself, the light of the knowledge and experience of my fellow survivors is able to slowly filter in.
I feel totally vindicated \:D when I read these resonances


Ron

_________________________
  1. the past
  2. ReClaiming Now
  3. advocacy


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#71820 - 06/16/03 12:13 PM Re: Male to Male Child Sexual Abuse
Mike Church Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 01/23/03
Posts: 3439
Loc: Toronto, Canada
My Borthers:

See how much MaleSurvivor has to offer. Most of us have barely scratched the surface. We are blessed with an extremely competent board, a super admin and a lot ot really terrific information. And what does it cost to be a member. Well have a look. It is a small price to pay for what is offered.

I mean there are the retreats, the conferences and the committees.

Danny when I said that service helps I mean that we progress by helping others. Having been in AA for 26 years I know thaT what you do comes back to you 1000 fold in returns. We who are here and benefiting from MaleSurvivor have an obligation to ourselves and to MS which is in the forefront of smashing down the GD closet door behind which most of us have hidden for so many years.

Now is it onerous to belong. Well have a look

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Think of the children and young men still out there and what is undeniably happening to them. Think how much we can do by being whole and mentoring as a group. A voice that Governments and the General Population can no longer IGNORE

_________________________
Mikey

IT REALLY IS OK TO STUMBLE. NONE OF US ARE PERFECT.

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#71821 - 06/17/03 01:33 AM Re: Male to Male Child Sexual Abuse
dwf Offline
Moderator/BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/24/03
Posts: 1223
Loc: Austin, Texas USA
More about old dogs and new tricks: I finally

figured out how to do this by repeated errors.

Like they say, even a blind hog will find an acorn

now and then. :rolleyes:

Here's the proper link to the articles page and

the very informative article on Male-to-Male Child

Sexual Abuse in the Context of Homophobia.

http://www.malesurvivor.org/Professionals/index.htm

I'd like to know what some others think about

this subject.

Are straight men afraid to admit that they suffer

as a result of homophobia?

Thanks.

_________________________
"Poke salad Annie, 'gators got you granny
Everybody said it was a shame
'Cause her mama was aworkin' on the chain-gang"

-Tony Joe White

Top
#71822 - 06/18/03 12:26 AM Re: Male to Male Child Sexual Abuse
Stephen_5 Offline
BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 09/12/00
Posts: 667
Loc: Northern California Foothills
My fellow survivors,

This is something that I have struggled with for too many years. I never told anyone about the abuse for 38 years because of the shame and fear that it engendered. Being called 'fag' was the worst thing you could do back in 1958 in the southwest. I was afraid that because I enjoyed some of it and it continued for several years when I was 11, 12 and 13 that I was 'homosexual'. I was married for over 33 years to a wonderful woman and didn't even tell her about the abuse for 28 years. I have always been a very compassionate guy to everyone but myself. I have been very understanding of everyone else's situations dealing with their sexuality issues but I never accepted the fact that I couldn't have done anything other than what I did. I blamed myself for the abuse and perpetuated the feelings of inadequacy and low self-esteem. I viewed myself as damaged and engaged in secretive anonymous sex to re-enforce my feelings of helplessness and worthlessness for years before I finally started dealing with the abuse and started seeing counselors. That was over 5 years ago now and I felt that I've made great progress. The last year has been hell for me physically and mentally but if I hadn't started dealing with the abuse issues when I did I don't think I could have made it through it all.

The only homophobia that I've ever had was directed toward myself.

Take good care of yourselves my friends and fellow survivors,

Steve

_________________________
I want to stay as close to the edge as I can without going over. Out on the edge you see all kinds of things you can't see from the center.
Kurt Vonnegut (1922-2007)

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#71823 - 06/18/03 02:25 AM Re: Male to Male Child Sexual Abuse
dwf Offline
Moderator/BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/24/03
Posts: 1223
Loc: Austin, Texas USA
Steve,

Quote:
The only homophobia that I've ever had was directed toward myself.
Absolutely brilliant. And very succinct.

You said in one sentence what I struggle to say in paragraphs.

Thanks for the lucid insight.

You helped me tonight and I thank you for caring.

Your fellow wolf pack member,

_________________________
"Poke salad Annie, 'gators got you granny
Everybody said it was a shame
'Cause her mama was aworkin' on the chain-gang"

-Tony Joe White

Top
#71824 - 06/25/03 03:36 AM Re: Male to Male Child Sexual Abuse
Stephen_5 Offline
BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 09/12/00
Posts: 667
Loc: Northern California Foothills
This topic has made me think a lot about my feelings. When I first went to see a counselor to start dealing with the CSA one of the first things he kept asking when I'd talk very reluctantly about the abuse was 'How did you feel?' I never felt. I was numb. I went blank. I couldn't talk or say a word, not even 'No!'.

The guy that abused me was a friend of my older sister. The fact that it was male on male abuse was so scary to me. What if anyone found out? What would they think of me? Why did I like some of it? I'm damaged forever! What did I do that attracted him to me? Why did I go back and put myself in the position to get abused some more? All these questions I kept in my mind, churning and churning for years. I hated myself and on more than a few occasions did some pretty stupid dangerous things, fast driving, drinking and other things. I survived all of that and 'forgot' about the abuse for years. When male on male abuse started getting some minimal news coverage a decade or so ago I started acting out again doing dangerous stuff, only sexually this time. The feelings that I had at the time were almost the exact same feelings of numbness and helplessness and worthlessness that I had when I was a kid. Acting out reinforced my low self esteem. It was self loathing, it was homophobia directed at myself.

Danny, I'm glad that what I wrote helped. It helped me too. And that's why we're all here.

Take good care of yourselves my friends, my brothers and my fellow survivors.

Steve

_________________________
I want to stay as close to the edge as I can without going over. Out on the edge you see all kinds of things you can't see from the center.
Kurt Vonnegut (1922-2007)

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