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#70034 - 03/24/06 06:19 AM Celibacy
pbfurm Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/12/06
Posts: 25
Loc: Los Angeles
I wish more friends of Dorothy would post; I feel compelled to put out more stuff about myself in order to read some new material from reply posts.
Anyway, I have been celibate for nearly 26 years. I think it is a combination of the aids crisis and my history of molestation and physical and emotional abuse. I see the situation at this time as knowing it is true, but not owning it as identifying with it. It's just this thing about me, that I don't care if I do anything about. I'm not asking to be fixed, I'm just expressing this as part of who I am. Why does being gay always mean you are defined by your physical relationships or one-night stands?


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#70035 - 03/24/06 12:25 PM Re: Celibacy
hanginon Offline
Member

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 89
Loc: sarasota, fl
PB,
I understand your point; I have been celibate for almost a year now and feel no less gay because of it. I do long for a physical relationship, though. My celibacy is more of a sabbatical from an intense 20+ years of non-stop sex, though. I am enjoying the time off, but really crave a meaningful relationship that leads to intimacy.

Anyway, don't give up on posting. I enjoy reading things from brothers here. Thanks.

_________________________
walker, there is no path, you make a path as you go...

(caminante, no hay camino, se hace camino al andar...)

Antonio Machado

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#70036 - 03/24/06 01:31 PM Re: Celibacy
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
pbfurm,

Celibacy, as all forms of sexual expression, is a matter of choice. If you choose this and are happy with this choice, fine. It doesn't reflect badly on you as a person, as a man, or as a gay man.

But that is of course not what you are saying. You comment that the issue just doesn't matter to you anymore, but can I suggest that in reality you are trying to convince yourself of this, and not all that successfully? There is a lot of dissatisfaction and self-judgment between the lines of your post.

Here's what I mean:

Quote:
I think it is a combination of the aids crisis and my history of molestation and physical and emotional abuse. I see the situation at this time as knowing it is true, but not owning it as identifying with it. It's just this thing about me, that I don't care if I do anything about.
It sounds to me like you feel you are beyond help: you have been put off by the AIDS problem and abuse memories and issues get in the way. You are coping with that feeling by saying it doesn't matter. But it matters a lot! We are all sexual beings, and sex is a healthy and important part of our lives.

If you feel devalidated by sexual dysfunction, you are in a very large club of survivors with me in the front row! I have been sexually non-functional for about six years now, and no, I don't like it. But I do understand that it arises from my abuse history; I just cannot have sex with my wife without my head filling with horrific abuse memories. I have spoken with her about it and she understands and supports me. I work with my T on this, and I now understand that this is a rough issue but not one impossible to resolve. So I work on it, and in the interim life goes on. I used to feel so ashamed about this, but now I find it easier to fight that feeling; I refuse to let it define me.

When I read your post what I see is the idea that if you were to seek sexual fulfillment as a gay man it would have to be through the social dynamics of a scene stressing sexual prowess and repeated "proofs" of an ability to perform in bed. I know how you feel there. If I were ever to be single again I would not be able to function in the straight club scene, where the emphasis is more or less on "who will I bed tonight?".

But again, your means of sexual expression is up to you to decide. There must be gay mens' organizations where you would be able to relate to other gay men just as friends. I mean, things would proceed slowly, at a pace you can handle, and you would not feel cornered into "performing" a role that isn't you.

Above all, don't let this mess up your view of yourself as a person. If being celibate really is something that is okay for you, then fine. But be honest with yourself. We only live once. If you want sex, there's nothing wrong with that. But it sounds like you want sex that's meaningful. All I will say there is great, congratulations. I think that's the best feeling about sex one could have.

If there's a problem because of abuse issues, this CAN be addressed. Okay, this has continued for two and a half decades and yes, that's a long time. But the chronology isn't a judgment against you; a lot of abuse issues take forever for us to bring out and address. You have every right to seek and want sexual fulfillment, and a history of abuse doesn't mean you can't have that.

Like so much else, this issue is a tough one to accept. I'm glad you brought it up and I hope you don't feel |I am trying to scramble what you said. I guess I am just suggesting you might want to look and decide who you are on this issue and what you really want.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#70037 - 03/25/06 05:06 AM Re: Celibacy
pbfurm Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/12/06
Posts: 25
Loc: Los Angeles
Larry,
I don't think I'm sexually dysfunctional, unless I don't understand what that means. I don't want to risk. That is the issue I see. I'm afraid of what monsters my father and brother are, and how they treat their spouses. I can't risk turning into a monster who browbeats and screams, and uses brute force to show dominance.
I realize I am not lovable in the state of mind I perceive my path to be in a potential relationship. I see traces of it in friendships, and have to catch myself from becoming inappropriate. Families have very strong traits, which genetically are hard to overcome. I've seen this behavior all too often growing up with aunts, uncles, and grandparents, on maternal and paternal sides. So when abuse is thrown into the mix, it can be overwhelming and frightening to deal with. No resolve is the usual outcome.


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#70038 - 03/25/06 06:40 PM Re: Celibacy
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
pbfurm,

Apart from the point that there is risk - greater and lesser - in everything we do, I would just say again that it doesn't sound like you are making a choice of your own here. It sounds more like you feel doomed to this option because the alternatives are too perilous for other people.

That's a pretty heavy judgment against yourself isn't it? Even considering the points you raise about other family members. And can it be that you really are unlovable in the context of an adult relationship?

You have to decide all this, of course, but I would just suggest, as a fellow-survivor, that CSA issues aren't just added to the mix here. They sound central to it.

I only comment because it would be so unfortunate to discover years down the road that these are issues that can be resolved and help you reclaim your life in all its aspects.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#70039 - 03/26/06 12:08 AM Re: Celibacy
pbfurm Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/12/06
Posts: 25
Loc: Los Angeles
Larry,
These ARE issues that can be resolved, but one might not find an answer. Spirit always wants to return and have a human experience. Few get it right till perhaps hundreds of lifetimes.


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#70040 - 03/26/06 10:31 AM Re: Celibacy
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
pbfurm,

True enough, there might not be an answer. That is the risk. That would also be why one would want to proceed carefully and slowly, and with the guidance of a therapist.

I hope you understand that I am trying to be encouraging and not critical. I think you nail it when you call what we are talking about a experience for which we yearn just because we are human, and which has a fulfilling purpose as Spirit too. I would just add that if it took hundreds of lifetimes to get it right, it would not be human, would it?

So again I would suggest that abuse issues sound central to the way you are seeing things. That's no surprise of course, and again, I hope I don't sound judgmental. I will just close with the note that our abuse feelings are there and need to be resolved, but many times that resolution shows us that these feelings reflect only our fears, and not the reality about us as people.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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