Newest Members
Xr2, clt, Lumpy, squeekinby, rhyoung
12371 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
drivejoepublic (44), eagle299 (43), H18 (21), JJJ (43), mariposaman (63), SevenTwoTwo76 (39), TexAgMan (37), waiter (44), wgwarch (55)
Who's Online
7 registered (freeze-on, OCN, BraveFalcon, Damian1974, SoccerStar, 1 invisible), 43 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
12371 Members
74 Forums
63591 Topics
444238 Posts

Max Online: 418 @ 07/02/12 07:29 AM
Twitter
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
#66421 - 10/24/06 12:14 PM expressing myself
beccy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 449
Loc: england
I am having major problems expressing myself/feeling things. I realise I am too afraid of rejection and also of feeling like any expression will be portrayed as a threat. Neither of which I can bear. Through the years with bf, I have gradually stopped being myself. I think I did actually believe i was unattractive/disgusting to him and that it was all about me.(to do with my past) Now I'm getting round to understanding I am not horrible and the things I want are ok, but I feel stuck in a place of incredibly low self-esteme and feel like the paranoia of not truly knowing bf's feelings for me are preventing me from being able to move forward. Have any of the other survivor partners experienced anything like this?

Last night, I shared some of this with bf. He said he was sad i felt this way. I also realise I have been numb. I asked him if he wanted me to be more expressive in those ways. He said he did, and that it would be good to have some excitement/fun and a 'vibe' etc. It just seemed so theoretical the way he said it. Like those things would be good for him to experience, but not like he actually wanted them specifically from me. I have been readin bits of the Victims No Longer book and it has refreshed my memory on all the problems associated with feelings/expression of/desiring/entitlement, so I do understand how far away all these things must be for bf. But still, I feel insecure and unsure of what this relationship means to him and will mean in the future. I feel our relationship has been a very co-dependant one, based on both of our dysfunctional pasts and now I don't know where we're at. Everything seems to be so ideally based for him. I just want something real based on reality. It seems like, connection for him is all about everything being happy. like a concept.

I will be seeing my T again soon, so I can go through these things.

Also, I wondered about how much expression of feelings other partners get from their survivors and how much that has improved through the course of their recovery.

peace
Beccy


Top
#66422 - 10/24/06 12:19 PM Re: expressing myself
beccy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 449
Loc: england
I also forgot to say that I just feel like every time I express a lot of these feelings to my bf, it only makes him feel worse and more of a failure. I don't want to make him feel worse, but I feel myself becoming so detached and it worries me. Like I'm losing the energy to get through this......I feel so selfish \:\(


Top
#66423 - 10/24/06 01:25 PM Re: expressing myself
beccy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 449
Loc: england
sorry, I know I'm going on, but the other things I didn't say, is that it feels like, with all the other things missing(he's not doing them/I'm not doing them), what we have is only a friendship, and not even really a good friendship. I feel so inadequate in almost every sense. Not only can I not express myself anymore, but I also don't feel like the support I give him is enough. I feel like half the time, I don't know what to do/say. I know that often, it's just a shoulder to cry on that he needs, but even when i do that, i feel he wanted more/something different, and if i do say anything, it wasn't what he wanted to hear.

Honestly, I feel he is trying to figure out ways to make me happy in order to not lose me, but that that is based on him not wanting to feel a failure as a man, not actually based on the way he feels for me. Could that be possible? I have tried to explain to him, that he can't 'make me happy'. Inside myself i am quite a self sufficient, happy person, but living like this at the moment is making me depressed. It's interraction that I need. Connection.

I know that my own expression is my responsibility. But I don't feel confident with him, and I think i would with other men. Could it be that we're just not right together? If I'm too insecure to battle through the rejection, maybe i'm with the wrong person. And if he needs someone more confident, he's with the wrong person also. I just don't know what's between us anymore....

sorry to go on and on,

peace
Beccy


Top
#66424 - 10/24/06 02:03 PM Re: expressing myself
Brokenhearted Offline
Member

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 644
Loc: TX
B,

WHen you say "Honestly, I feel he is trying to figure out ways to make me happy in order to not lose me, but that that is based on him not wanting to feel a failure as a man, not actually based on the way he feels for me. Could that be possible?" -- I wonder the same thing about my husband. Like if he stays w/ me, will it ever be real because he loves me, or only a way for him to not feel like a failure. It's so hard. I had a hard night last night and think it's continuing this morning. \:\( And yes, I have low esteem too from all the yrs of not having a true connection/RECIPROCITY with him.

_________________________
Brokenhearted

It were better for him that a millstone were hanged around his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.
Luke 17:2

Top
#66425 - 10/24/06 03:22 PM Re: expressing myself
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
Beccy & BH,

I don't have time to give you a really long answer right now, but I want to say one thing that I think is really important.

I know you're both having such a hard time and I sympathize big time and understand 100% but one thing that I think you're both doing is something that survivors do alot of and that is projection.

Beccy, I'll use the same quote from you that BH used:

Quote:
"Honestly, I feel he is trying to figure out ways to make me happy in order to not lose me, but that that is based on him not wanting to feel a failure as a man, not actually based on the way he feels for me. Could that be possible?"
You don't know the answer to this and neither does anyone else. Only your b/f does. You're posts are rife with comments that say how much your b/f is working to help himself and help your relationship but that it's not working for you. Beccy, if it's not working for you, then I understand that, but you need to admit that it's you and not project feelings you think he's having that are making you feel the way you do.

You are both in the midst of a minefield and the last thing you need to do is throw grenades at one another.

We can't figure out and say with any degree of certainty what our guys are thinking any more than they can do that for us.

I have to go to a meeting, but I'll be back.

ROCK ON.......Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

Top
#66426 - 10/24/06 11:50 PM Re: expressing myself
Brokenhearted Offline
Member

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 644
Loc: TX
Trish and Beccy,

I am laughing tonight. I think it is almost an insane laugh. I think I am just w o r n
o u t trying to figure out my husband's feelings and then Trish's comment illustrates how it looks as we're desperately trying to make sense of our current relationships: "You are both in the midst of a minefield and the last thing you need to do is throw grenades at one another."

I just have to laugh now and I think it's just to that "point." I am worn out, possibly going insane, so hopeful but so fearful, sad, and it all came to a head tonight and I don't know why but for some reason I just started laughing out loud and didn't stop for a while. It felt good even though it seemed totally inappropriate.

I see my T tomorrow because she was sick yesterday. She better be all well and back tomorrow!!! I'm feeling dependent upon her for my lifeline, as well as you all.

_________________________
Brokenhearted

It were better for him that a millstone were hanged around his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.
Luke 17:2

Top
#66427 - 10/25/06 01:55 PM Re: expressing myself
beccy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 449
Loc: england
I know what you mean by worn out BH. Although I'm sure this must be ten times harder for you than me at the moment, with getting no affection at all from your husband.

I have been feeling like I'm going crazy for months now. I just want to get off my head all the time(which is what I would have turned to years ago). It feels lonely. I don't feel like anyone understands. I feel so tired all the time at the moment. And all this even though me and bf are communicating, sharing some affection. Really, I realise I just feel destroyed by the fact I havn't known where he'd been at all these years. The fact he told me he was more attracted to men than me, I was just a '5 or 6'. Even though he's now retracted that in the realisation of what it was based on. Even though he's decided to stay.............................................................................................

I just went and broke down crying on bf. Had to tell my 4 year old daughter I have a very bad headache. Couldn't stop crying. It's probably done me good, maybe now I might feel a little less numb.

I wish you some happiness with your husband BH,

peace
beccy


Top
#66428 - 10/25/06 02:31 PM Re: expressing myself
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
I read through all this thread again just now and I feel so deeply for what all you are going through. It just reduces me to tears all over again.

That said, there are important things happening here. You are all struggling to come to terms with your OWN feelings. You are placing solid emphasis on what you yourselves want and need and you are refusing to become new victims of those who harmed your partners.

And not least of all you are TALKING ABOUT IT. It's so important to let out what bothers you, and who cares if it seems irrational. Like, hello? Look at how much else about abuse issues is irrational. Laughing, crying, whatever. These are your feelings and they have to be acknowledged and expressed.

I just someone could push some magic button and guarantee all of you the fulfilling and positive outcomes all of you so richly deserve.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#66429 - 10/25/06 03:47 PM Re: expressing myself
Brokenhearted Offline
Member

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 644
Loc: TX
THanks Larry and Beccy, it seems I have an epiphany (is that the right word?) or insight almost every day (usually after a really low period), and it occurred to me last night that if my husband is attracted to males at the time or for a while now, it is most likely because of the abuse, and really he is attracted to what he thinks he is lacking about his own masculinity, what he wishes he had, rather than because he really wants to BE with a man rather than me. It is just all messed up. And when he said, "If you really knew me...You just don't know," I realize now that at the time I thought (making it about me again) he was saying I didn't know how unattracted he is to me, he doesn't want to hurt my feelings, but he is numb to me, when he was probably REALLY saying I just don't know the ugliness of what HE'S done as a child or now, even though the ugliness is what was done TO HIM not by him, but he'll learn that later.

Also he was saying that I just don't know the pain he's been in all the years I've known him, and how that must have hurt him to be with me and know that I had no idea he was suffering so much, how alone he's been.

It's not about ME. I AM a good wife! I AM attractive! Not perfect, but who is? So let's put our own pride on the side so we can really see what is going on here, it is HIS personal tragedy, not ours.

I feel so grateful that I'm learning and realizing and understanding so much every day. It will only serve my husband and I well as we face this.

AND!!! Yesterday I played with our daughter on the floor with the blocks, made a fire, colored with her, chased her. She needs me and I must be there for her. Life goes on. If I have my way everything's going to be fine. If my husband allows my compassion/understanding to help him and my therapist, and my prayers, we will be fine. And I know it can be rocky on and off. But I am strong. I am raising our daughter alone in our house if I have to. I will take control of that much so he can devote himself to healing if I have to. One of us, the healthy one, has to take care of our daughter and raise her to have security, know she is loved by spending time with her, so SHE won't become someone's victim down the road.

Beccy, I ache for you because you and bf are BOTH recovering from abuse. I hope and pray one of you (I'm sure it's you) can find the strength to be the one to make sure your kids don't get left out. Realize as I did last night that life must continue because we have growing, developing kids whose cores we are helping to form RIGHT NOW.

Thank God for all of you and for all of my support system and I know my prayers are being answered because He is helping me to understand how to help my dear husband. He can decide he may not want to keep me later on, but by God I'm going to do everything I can to help him because I love him, AND take care of our daughter at the same time. It is trying to be like God's love - though still falling short - unconditionally loving someone but expecting nothing in return, at least for now (the "at least for now" is the human part of my love!). I still have high hopes and desire to be with him till I die, but I know more than my desires right now, it is more *important* that he get the help he needs.

_________________________
Brokenhearted

It were better for him that a millstone were hanged around his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.
Luke 17:2

Top
#66430 - 10/25/06 09:35 PM Re: expressing myself
Brokenhearted Offline
Member

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 644
Loc: TX
P.S. I re-read my post and realize I am making some wishful presumptions about whether he might really be gay or not - I just feel there are many reasons - valid ones - why he may NOT be. And of course I pray he is not.

_________________________
Brokenhearted

It were better for him that a millstone were hanged around his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.
Luke 17:2

Top
#66431 - 10/26/06 02:52 AM Re: expressing myself
SAR Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/07/03
Posts: 3310
Loc: USA
Quote:
Everything seems to be so ideally based for him. I just want something real based on reality. It seems like, connection for him is all about everything being happy. like a concept.
Beccy,

I know exactly what you mean. My partner does this too; it is like he's got an idea now about what he'd like from the relationship, but doesn't have enough information about what this stuff looks like in practice so he can't fill in the gaps. He just says, "I wish it could be like THIS" and the "THIS" is always sort of vague and generally something that he's not too good at himself or doesn't have a lot of experience with.

That kind of dialogue comes across as blaming to me and I don't know that he always means it that way. For example, he made a comment about how there is not much non-sexual affection in the relationship... I was sort of surprised by this because I feel like I go out of my way to sit next to him, hold hands, etc. even when he is unable to do more, so I asked him for what specifically he feels is missing.

Long story short-- what he meant was, he wishes that we could share more acts of affection that don't instantly mean "sex" in his mind. Well I can't fix that! He avoids any kind of affectionate contact with me when he's feeling like he's not able to be intimate, because, no matter how many times I say "holding hands is not leading me on" he feels like there is a point of no return after which he will not be able to say no. \:\( I feel terrible about that but there is not much I can do to fix it except keep loving him and respecting his limits.

So what he really meant by "I would like us to have more affection in our relationship" was "I wish I could experience some of this differently"-- maybe this is like where your boyfriend is at with feeling "happy" in the relationship? Not that he wants you to be someone else, but he wants to have a new lens, so to speak.


Top
#66432 - 10/27/06 04:29 PM Re: expressing myself
beccy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 449
Loc: england
Perhaps you are right SAR,

that is a useful way to look at it all. It's just all so confusing :rolleyes: My own feelings about everything seem to keep changing from almost one minute to the next. I wish there was some escape from all this.......

peace
beccy


Top
#66433 - 10/28/06 01:49 PM Re: expressing myself
beccy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/06
Posts: 449
Loc: england
Trish,

I am sorry i didn't reply to your post yet. I just wrote a massive reply and then the computer crashed before I sent it and now I don't have time to rewrite it!

It took a while for me to process what you said, it struck such a sensitive chord in me! So, I'll just say that what you said was most helpful. It forced me to think about what exactly my own feelings are. Some of that was difficult to think about, but it has led me down a very productive path and me and bf have had some very open conversations this week. I realise I've felt so hurt by a lot of his behaviour in this relationship and that coupled with some of the different behaviours which naturally come with the healing process, was beginning to make me feel like i wasn't really sure if i liked him much anymore. Or if I wanted to stay in this relationship/was strong enough to cope. Some of these things mirror stuff from my own background and I think to a degree I have been confusing the two and feeling like escape is the only option.

Anway, thanks again for being so 'to the point' and brave by offering your take on this topic. I just can't begin to think what I would do/where I'd be at now if it wasn't for this discussion board. I've had so much good advice. It continues to be a great source of support \:\)

There's definately a lot to be said for thinking about difficult feelings/working through them. Some of the pain you have to go through to do that is so hard, but on the other side is liberation!!!! I don't know what the future holds for me and bf, but at the very least it could be a journey worth exploring. I do hope the compatability and happiness lies at the end of all this hard work..........

peace
Beccy


Top
#66434 - 10/28/06 03:58 PM Re: expressing myself
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
Beccy,

Don't you hate when that happens!

I'm glad what I said made you think and you feel that it helped. Sometimes, as I said in another post, I still trip over my own tongue in real life and here too, but I try. Posts I've received and read here have made me think alot and given me different perspectives on things that I otherwise would not have thought of, which is a huge part of the beauty here.

I'm glad you and your b/f are talking more, that is the key to so much. If we can express our pain, our limitations, our fears, our successes and our wants/needs, to ourselves and our loved ones, even if its little bits at a time, sooner or later a whole conversation comes out of it and everyone is the better for it.

ROCK ON........Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >


Moderator:  ModTeam, peroperic2009 

I agree that my access and use of the MaleSurvivor discussion forums and chat room is subject to the terms of this Agreement. AND the sole discretion of MaleSurvivor.
I agree that my use of MaleSurvivor resources are AT-WILL, and that my posting privileges may be terminated at any time, and for any reason by MaleSurvivor.