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#6493 - 06/20/05 09:25 AM I am confused?
VN Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 723
With help, I am reading some more here. I am happy, not happy, that people need be here, but happy that I am not alone with what I feel and think some. But something confuse me.

It is needed, that I will forgive these people, my parents and this other person, for me to be better of this? To be true, I am not certain I can do that. I can forgive my mother, of course, she is my mother and I should have forgiveness to her. But, it is right now not certain to me that I can forgive my father and this other man, for the harms they done to me, but also, to others, like my sister and to also another friend of mine.

Is it that I will fail this before even I begin truly? Please, can this be answered? Thank you. I am worried.

I should say, the person who writes here for me tonight, who provides my words, he say no, I do not need to do anything I do not feel I can. But, still, can other people say what they feel of this? It is not I do not trust my friend who sits with me here. But I am thinking, it is emotions, it must be there are different thoughts of it? Thank you.

VN


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#6494 - 06/20/05 11:53 AM Re: I am confused?
Rustam Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/27/04
Posts: 473
Loc: UK
VN,

I donít think that forgiveness is necessary at all, one of the people who abused me is dead the other is alive I donít see any point in forgiving him. He has nothing good in him he has nothing to give to the world but destruction. I need to understand the abuser as that helps me understand why the abuse was about them and not about who I was or am its also useful in understanding the impact they had on me. Our job is to heal and get better we owe no forgiveness to the abusers. If at some point we want to do that thatís fine if it helps in freeing us, but I donít think its necessary for healing. I donít think I will ever want to forgive but that does not mean that I am going to be tied to the abusers by anger or bitterness all my life.

Peter.


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#6495 - 06/20/05 12:49 PM Re: I am confused?
sabooka Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 209
Loc: I would like to know also
Our job here is to heal our selves. For each of us that means different things. For some poeople forgiving thier abuser is part of thier recovery. For others it just is not. There is nothing that you have to do for the people who abused you. Your responsiblity is to your self and your self alone. There are no rules on how to deal SA and each person is different. You should only do what you feel comfortable doing and only when you feel the time is right.

I sometimes think the same way after being here. You read other peple who have been healing for longer and try to compare thier actions to your own. I do not think this is the point. We are all here on the same road but some are further ahead than others. Just because they are further ahead does not mean that the way they got there is right for everyone. Knowing that there are people further ahead gives us hope and helps us to see a light at the end of the tunnel, but it does not mean that they have a monopoly on how to get there.

Each of us has to do what is right for him at that stage in his journey. Take care of yourself and only do what you feel comfortable doing.

Jonathan

_________________________
My happiness is not dependant on other people's misery.

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#6496 - 06/20/05 04:07 PM Re: I am confused?
Andrew Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/25/03
Posts: 1192
VN, Thank you for the posing the question, it is very relevent to all our recoveries. I don't think it is absolutely necessary to forgive your abusers. However, I do think that at some point, deeper into your recovery, you will find that you have let go of some of the anger. And as the anger is released, so will some of the fear disappear to be replaced by a new confidence and assurance. Have a great day. Peace, Andrew

_________________________
there is no courage without anxiety

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#6497 - 06/20/05 04:29 PM Re: I am confused?
Mike Church Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 01/23/03
Posts: 3439
Loc: Toronto, Canada
VN To forgive is not a necessary thing for you to do. Someone told me once that forgiveness involves something that is important to remember. You do it for yourself and not the perp because you can. The important word here is YOU.

_________________________
Mikey

IT REALLY IS OK TO STUMBLE. NONE OF US ARE PERFECT.

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#6498 - 06/24/05 11:19 PM Re: I am confused?
Don-NY Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 546
Loc: Long Island, NY
V,

Every time I think about forgiveness, I remember the times someone else has forgiven me.

I have hurt people deeply, emotionally. I have made them cry. Sometimes I did that deliberately. Most of the time it was an accident. I was always sorry after.

One time, I hit someone. I slapped my sister in the face. She was 20 and I was 27. We had a terrible argument and she called me a filty name. Very bad insult, very bad language.

I was shocked, and insulted, and I got blind angry and I slapped her. That was the only time in my life I ever hit someone

My sister forgave me, right away. She felt terrible about what she said, and she was shocked that she made me so angry because I have never been an angry or violent person.

We both cried. I begged her to forgive me. She asked me to forgive her too. We did.

But I have never done something so bad as the people who hurt us. Never did and never will.

There were two who hurt me. One was a man, when I was a little boy, 3 years old. The other was a 15 year old boy, when I was 12. What the boy did was much worse. Very violent, very mean.

I forgive the boy. I truly do. He was just a boy too. I think someone hurt him too. And hurt his sister also. They both had very sad, very hard lives. They both killed themselves.

I will never forgive the man who did that to me when I was three years old. That is too much wrong, too much evil. That is for God to forgive, not for me.

I believe in God, but my faith is not strong. I want God to punish them, NOW, here on earth, today.

But God is Love and God is forgiveness. Maybe God has already forgiven that man and I have to learn to accept that.

So if God has forgiven him, then I don't have to. And I don't have to be angry at him anymore for what he did. Angry just makes me feel bad, and stops me from doing good and fun things.

I don't have to think about him at all. I don't worry about forgiving him. I think God will forgive ME for this.

VN, you will be fine. You don't have to forgive anyone. Maybe some day you will want to, but maybe you won't.

You will not fail. You are too strong, and too good a man to fail. You have great courage to go to court. You have great Faith and Love inside you.

When I saw your words, that you will "protect the souls" of those boys, it made me cry. And when you told someone here that you will "embrace them in your soul", that made me feel very humble and very lucky to read that.

I wish you well in your life changes. A new life can be scary but it can also be very exciting and positive. I think you will do fine wherever you go, and whatever you do.

I am glad to know you and I hope that you will always write to us, with any kind of translator you can find.

Take care,
Donald


-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
You can be Captain of your Ship, But not of the Sea.

_________________________
If you understand everything, some things are just as they are. If you understand nothing, things are still just as they are.

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#6499 - 06/25/05 05:28 AM Re: I am confused?
sophiesdad Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/30/05
Posts: 462
Loc: Florida
VN:

I remember one time what a T told me about forgiveness. Forgiveness does not necessarily mean what we think of in the traditional sense. It doesn't mean that we sit down with our abusers and drink some General Foods International Coffee and have warm feelings and hugs.

Forgiveness may simply mean that we accept and mourn our childhood and the things that we never had and never will recapture. But, we are determined to continue on the road to health. It can mean that we no longer carry the rage at our abusers - rather we are more concerned about the love that we now have for the important people in our lives. It can mean that we have to absent ourselves from our families because there are too many painful reminders OR that they are still the dysfunctional cesspools of hatred and ignorance and we have moved past that.

In the end, we are victorious over our abusers when we learn how to live a relatively happy and healthy life and let go of the rage and allow it to fade into a memory.

to me, that's forgiveness.

SD

_________________________
There are no unresolved issues - they just didn't resolve themselves the way we would have liked. "Grinder and Bandler - Neuro-Linguistic Programming"

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#6500 - 06/25/05 05:54 AM Re: I am confused?
VN Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 723
Thanks for kind answers, understanding and support. I - without the person to transfer(translate) tonight, I most of all regret how it will sound.

I spoke with the friend of how it(he) feels from a pardon. I understand, how it(he) speaks about it, that it was something, that it(he) felt need(requirement) with one person, but to not feel need(requirement) for another. It has an individual thing. But it should be made of desire to make it for us directly, instead of for a shame which we can feel, whether we participate (whether we are employed) in it, yes?

Sometime I feel rather negative to me directly because I hold negative ideas to my parents. I feel less shame of feeling also to my father than my mother. I am confident, that I shall hold a pardon to it(her) before I do(make) to it(him).

Thanks, all your answers. I rather worried, that already, I am new here, and fulfilment (transfer) of that - that not so. Thanks for display of me, that I yet do not bear(suffer) failure with it.

VN


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