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#63750 - 01/02/05 05:02 AM Re: I love you, I hate you, you' ugly???
Val Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/02/05
Posts: 8
Loc: nc
Hello
This is my first time on this website. It is obvious that most of you have a long history here and hope you don't mind one more participant. I had to write you Sammy and let you know I also have a lot of twisted and tortured feelings. I really don't know any of your background but I thought by sharing my current experience it would make you not feel so alone Sammy.
I have just recently seperated from my husband of almost 8 years. We have been together 14. We have two very small children. The seperation was his idea. I never saw it coming. I found out 2 years ago that he had been sexually abused almost daily from 8yrs old-12yrs old by a neighbor. Up until the last week I was the only person that knew. He hid it for 30 years. After he told me,I remember thinking that explains his behavior on so many aspects. I felt so much pain for him and wanted to do anything I could to help him. He refused. Over the past 2 years, I believe, him telling me created more turmoil in his mind and life. I thought, boy this should be a burden lifted but since I was not the victim I will never know what leaking that "secret" has done to him. It opened a pandora's box.
His depression and lack of coping with stress became more noticeable. He was frustrated easily much more then before. We decided when I gave birth to our first child 4 yrs ago that he would stay home since I made more money and had job stability. He always seemed content with being a stay at home dad but I truly believe he was not really happy doing it and would not admit it.
In Sept. 2004, we got into a fight and I said some terrible statements in front of our four year old ("mommy has to hold daddy's hand", etc...). We did not speak for about 2 days and then he stated he was leaving. He told me he was sick of being demeaned, mistreated, taken for granted and degrated. I truly do not get that.
Anyways, he moved out of the bedroom and 2 months later he is still at the house. When I started pressing the issue he eventually found a place to move to in early Dec. I had an additional lock added the next week to keep him out on the weekends and eves. He insisted on still watching the kids during the day. This sent him over the top. This was a move I found very standard and somewhat insignificant but to him this was monumental.
He has only been able to communicate or rage against me through email. He is almost compulsive about that behavior. Well the day after the locks were added he went on a writing rampage. I got several emails myself, a mutual friend got one and then he topped it of with an email literally assassinating my character with his spin on me and events from our past and sent it to our parents, family and friends. He wanted to publically crucify and humiliate me and he did.
He called several times that evening. The next day there was several conflicting calls to me. He told a good friend he wanted to bring me down to his level and then we could start building our marriage back. He also told her that those new locks would not keep him out. I became very frightened of the man I loved and was in serious emotional distress. I ended up taking out a temporary restraining order. It made and makes me sick. We go to court 01/03/05 to see if an order of protection is needed. I honestly don't want one. I am not sure why. There has been threats of physical violence in emails and definately degrading and humiliating statements to me. I love him and I feel he needs help. I keep blaming all of his actions on his childhood. Is that wrong? If an order of protection is obtained then the court can order mandatory counseling. That would be a good thing, right? Mine is different from yours Sammy because I know I still love my husband but he has not made it easy. It is hard to love someone that loathes themself. My conflict arises if he meant what he said to my friend about wanting to rebuild the marriage. I would love to do that but I can not do that until he makes himself well or atleast attempts too. That will probably kill me because I don't know if he will ever seek help since he has always refused in the past.
I am trying to remain positive and true to my own character. That is all anyone can do.

Thanks for listening.Val


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#63751 - 01/02/05 06:28 AM Re: I love you, I hate you, you' ugly???
niagara Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/26/04
Posts: 10
Welcome Val,

I am new to site, new to BF mother-son incest knowledge in the last month. I have been empowered with a wealth of info & sadly admit found comfort in reading of other partners experiences being so similar to mine, in regards to there being a reason why he reacts the way he does, for 5 years the puzzle pieces have been unable to fit.


I have seen in my BF some relief to be opening up,but also fear in making it known. The battle he has been hiding a lifetime, is out. He goes from talking about detailed situations, to complete avoidance of me. I am well aware he is so uncertain about trusting me, as much as he knows I love him unconditionally, how really can he be expected to trust anyone...when he couldn't trust his own Mom ?

At this particular time, I think he must regain control of what he is doing as far as sharing the SA, analyze the level of pain & uncertainty it is causing him, by talking out loud,he must determine whether it is causing him more pain to bring it to the surface allowing him to gasp for air, or remain as the anchor he continues to have tied to his ankle pulling him to the depths of the Ocean.

Perhaps at this particular stage or time in his life, he wants to be no longer adrift at Sea, has spotted dry land,is heading in to shore.

Regards Niagara \:\)


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#63752 - 01/02/05 08:24 AM Re: I love you, I hate you, you' ugly???
Wifey1 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/03/02
Posts: 380
Val, Niagra & Guize

Its so sad to meet such wonderful people in the fashion we have to meet under. But I am certainly blessed by each of you -- including the men who so openly share with each other and pop over here to the F& F to help us out.
since I have found this site it has certainly been a haven for me during storms and even calm waters --
I know that I care for and about my husband, and even on some level "Love" him. But as far as being "in Love" -- lordy lordy I dont know if that could ever happen again.
The cold vicious attacks from him tear at my very inner core and all I have ever stood for and lived my life for.
to this day if he called me in need of ANYTHING I would be there in a flash to help him, no matter what it is his request would be. Being a survivor of SA and those abuses that go along with it, sadly give me insight not only to his plight, but have also taught me much about my own self and my own behaviors.
Hearing him say he even feels "guilty for your illness" just about kills me -- and I know he could not hear the reality in my response of "thats just Genetics how could you EVER cause this?" I bite my tongue when he says such cruel thinngs to me and wonder -- how much I was and said cruel things to him when I was in the same stage he is in with his healing?
God forgive me if I injured him -- and I have even told him I was sure I was cruel and didnt listen to his needs whenn I was at my poinnt tht he is in. Ive thanked him for taking on raising our daughters during my own shitty time -- Perhaps this is just my paying my dues to a man who did so for me when he himself kept his secret to his self...
he supported me when I confronted my abusers, and denied my parents access to my daughters -- and supported me when I cried buckets of tears when I missed my "mom" so much -- and even supported me to come up with "little white lies" so that evenn the visits now are kept to only a couple hours.
I never knew I could feel jealous that others could reach him now, when I cant.... but at least others are there to fill his needss. And I am grateful and thankful for that, but also carry the anger when I wonder has he "'told the whole story" of his years of acting out.
Sometimes I dream that I get to sit in his sex addicts meetings to have the opportunity to share MY side, and to defend my own actions ....
My youngest daughter and I both cried the other day when I could only muster out the words "I just want my life back" ... she broke into further tears and said that too is exactlyy what she wantss ...
But we cant go back, we must move forward. sso far I am on a path that is rocky , hhilly annd am so unsure of what step to take next, afraid that if I step wrong, it will createe an avalanche thath I can not stop or immpaact -- so I am frozen.
I truly feel for the first time he is feeling power in our relationship in which he has never felt before -- there fore he "creates the chaos" to keep me unstable -- knnowing me so well that when I get even the sligtest hint of information I start research to take action.
I wonder too if some of it is a way to "get back" at me for his lack of involvment in our marriage?
He is hitting me below the belt at my physically weakest time -- I donnt know how much is conciouus and how much is subconcious?
for example this past week he said he called the iinsurance commpany to find out if I can get a homme health aaid -- but he did it without asking ME first, and had the knowledge that I had just had a huge crazy screaming at from my long term GP, and that I am in the process of interviewing Docs who would qualiffy to fill my current GP''s position.... it blew me out of the water --- since my diagnosis of severe heart diseseee & several other problems he has NEVER ONCE gone to a doc appt with me.
whenn I expressed I was not very happy that he had NOT called and asked my perrmission first he blew a gassket -- yet he knew of the problems, -- His "swing behavior" is keeping me off balancee, and I think also he knows that is the only time I talk with him.
He asked to be left alone for awhile, and that MAAYBE he would want to communicatee with me again.... BBUT WHY like thiis?
I suspect it is just repeatinng behavior that his own parents did.

sorry I cant be of much use to help right now -- and have not a guiding word -- I continue to manage as much of my life as I can -- Its certainly hard whenn every family member wants to play Ostrich.....
I just leave the contact up to hiim -- and try my hardest to keep calm cool and collected when he ddoes appprooachh me...
In reality I keep telling him that the divorce he requested is more than in order and fair, that I dont want any "thiing" from him -- assured him that the relationshiip he will have withh the daughters he helped raise will never be sabotaged bby me (he knows this is true i did not do it with my fiirst divorce) --
I truly dont want to die a miseraable death, and know that i will more than likely eend up in some state run nursing home -- he assuredd me he would come visiit, and my only answer back to hiim was "If you have a hard tiime looking at me now and making contact how and WHY should I beliieve that you will come visiit me in some place where I will eventuaally be bedriddenn?
He had no answer just knowing I was speakiing truth ---
I understand he wants a better job, and am happy that he is working so hard to gett it -- but his monsters in the dreams and nightmares thaht he swears he cannot remember -- will conntinue to chaase him, until he faces them downn and deals honestly withh them --
I pray his recovery iis less painfful than my oown....
I want trulyy only the BEST for him, but I am so sorryy that he rarely even callls to "find out how I am " -- I wish I could change 3 freaking words to ALL of his questions.... I DONT KNOW...
Now todayy I am the one who can truly say
I DONT KNOW... tiime wwill ppass and hopefully he will be able to answwerr the questiions asked of him.
Peace for us ALL, Sammy


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#63753 - 01/11/05 03:42 PM Re: I love you, I hate you, you' ugly???
crisispoint Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 2154
Loc: Massachusetts
Sammy,

I offer this not as an excuse for his ansering "I don't know" to everything. I find it very hard, honestly to excuse him ANYTHING as he's so hurtful to you. But sometimes (for me, most of the time), we really DON'T know how to answer anything related to recovery.

I must, however, get back to you, now. I hope, truly, deeply hope, that you are more focused on yourself and your issues these days, because you're worth the effort you give to other people.

We lose sight of this at times with the people who are helping us out the most. And sometimes (not in MY case, believe me! \:D ), people feel they have no right to comment or to take us to task when we're hurtful because we're "dealing with our demons."

Not true. Not true at all. We're humans, and as we deal with each other and reclaim the respect we deserve, so we should give others the respect they deserve.

You are deserving of so much more, Sammy. You've touched many lives here. Certainly, you've touched mine. There's a line in the Talmud that I keep going back to. "One (edited for "Political Correctness" :p ) who saves a life, saves the world entire." You, and others who come to support different people, have saved mine. So whenever you feel down on yourself, you remember that, Sammy. Please remember that.

Peace and love,

Scot

_________________________
There are reasons I'm taking medication. They're called "other people." - Me, displaying my anti-social tendancies

fromacuriousmind.blogspot.com
malehurtandsurvive.blogspot.com

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#63754 - 01/12/05 01:20 AM Re: I love you, I hate you, you' ugly???
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
Sammy,

Quote:
but his monsters in the dreams and nightmares thaht he swears he cannot remember -- will conntinue to chaase him, until he faces them downn and deals honestly withh them --
I pray his recovery iis less painfful than my oown....
I want trulyy only the BEST for him, but I am so sorryy that he rarely even callls to "find out how I am " -- I wish I could change 3 freaking words to ALL of his questions.... I DONT KNOW...
That sums it up, until "WE" do the work the monsters will always be there, and while we're running from them, we truly "don't know" what the hell is going on. I lived through over 25 years of marriage saying those words, even when asked if I "wanted sex?" I wasn't capapble of making my own decisions, I dressed like a vagrant, I'd eat whatever was around at the time, watched TV, got hammered, and never made a decision.
If I say "I don't know" now I'd better mean it, she reacts just like you do Sammy, and I know exactly why.

Quote:
I truly feel for the first time he is feeling power in our relationship in which he has never felt before -- there fore he "creates the chaos" to keep me unstable -- knnowing me so well that when I get even the sligtest hint of information I start research to take action.
I wonder too if some of it is a way to "get back" at me for his lack of involvment in our marriage?
He is hitting me below the belt at my physically weakest time -- I donnt know how much is conciouus and how much is subconcious?
"creating the chaos" that returns everything to the status quo of our old comfort zones.
We start to feel the 'power', but as the old quote says "with power comes responsibility" SEE ABOVE.
How can we do responsibility when we "don't know" anything? That's a bullshit statement to a degree, but with a shred of truth, we don't see ourselves as capable of using the newfound power, and it's responsibilities, because it's new to us and we're used to another old comfort zone, somebody else taking responsibility.

As the survivors we really have to grasp this concept and work at it, we have to accept out mistakes and learn from them. Most people do this as a natural progression as they mature, but I don't think we do in an altogether positive way.
What did we learn about power and responsibility when we were young? We learned that people that have it use it in ways we don't like - or at least ways that we later learn 'fuck us up'.
So our concept of power and responsibility is shot to hell, and it's hard to put it back together again.
Which is why this seemingly small incident stood out for me.

Quote:
for example this past week he said he called the iinsurance commpany to find out if I can get a homme health aaid -- but he did it without asking ME first, and had the knowledge that I had just had a huge crazy screaming at from my long term GP, and that I am in the process of interviewing Docs who would qualiffy to fill my current GP''s position.... it blew me out of the water --- since my diagnosis of severe heart diseseee & several other problems he has NEVER ONCE gone to a doc appt with me.
whenn I expressed I was not very happy that he had NOT called and asked my perrmission first he blew a gassket --
He made a choice to test that newfound power, took a decision on his own in the belief he was right.
And even though it was a small thing, him not asking you first and you saying so, it blew him away.
The normal reaction, which you quite reasonably expected, would have something like - "sorry about that, I'll ask in future"
My reaction a few years ago would have been just like hubby's "Fuck it, why fucking bother!"

And I'm NOT passing criticism here Sammy, it's HIS problem, we seem to overeact to things in a big way, we make mountain RANGES out of molehills! :rolleyes:

I still react like this, certainly not to the degree I once did, or as often. But it's still there.
Yesterday my wife reminded to replace a light bulb that blew at the weekend and I'd forgot about. ( one of six downlighters so the room wasn't in darkness ) but I was offering grovelling apologies as though I'd blown all our money on a losing horse. But not for long, she recognises this behaviour and lets me know in no uncertain terms that I'm in 'victim' mode again. So I start grovelling for that.....aaarrrghhh

Some of us are masters of bringing everything down to 'our level' - why? because it's what we know, we feel comfortable there, and it kept us safe - alive even - for a long time past.
But we NEED to dragged outta there!

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#63755 - 01/15/05 10:55 AM Re: I love you, I hate you, you' ugly???
Wifey1 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/03/02
Posts: 380
All,
I took some advice from your postings -- and a few moments ago finished reading some news articles written about me -- from my pre - life (i'm smilen with a smirk ya'll know that pre - life before disclosure)
Scot, you're RIGHT, I have done SOME good -- and it is in print, I just needed to read it , sure it was some reporter --- but it was just enough to help me recenter some....

AND Dave, you're words .... "I would have just said "Fuck It".... man you nailed it -- how can there be any win in that "little (not little at all) incident" --- he couldnt win, there is no exact science,.... I geuss its far too easy for me to be in "my level" of healing and when you said "Fuck It" --- it slammed me back to the reality, Hubby didnt have a chance in hell when I was closed off in remembering where "HE IS" in his recovery, journey, healing....

currently we remain at some sort of an agreed standstill or "pergatory" -- until I am able to be successfully physically moved to where I can receive the best possible health care he has agreed not to divorce me.

We dont talk, or call -- and my daughter has stepped up to the plate now by coming to pick up my laundry and get grocery's for me. My drivers license is now gone, until I become more physically capable of driving again... I'm not kickboxing yet.... but if I came back all those other times.... you can bet by mid summer... "I" wont just be a dream...


Peace for us All, Sammy


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#63756 - 01/15/05 09:39 PM Re: I love you, I hate you, you' ugly???
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
Sammy

Quote:
I'm not kickboxing yet.... but if I came back all those other times.... you can bet by mid summer... "I" wont just be a dream...
With your sharp mind, and the love for those around you that you give so freely, you bet you'll bounce back.

Give in - you don't know the meaning of that!

Dave ;\)

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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