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#61338 - 08/08/04 09:47 PM forget it-im just a pest anyways
Anonymous
Unregistered


forget it, thanks for all your help, but i was told to leave himt he heck alone, so i am stupid for trying.


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#61339 - 08/09/04 11:33 AM Re: forget it-im just a pest anyways
crisispoint Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 2154
Loc: Massachusetts
Angelina,

I don't know what I can say to you except that I care about you and I want to think of yourself.

What you're talking about, how you're feeling, isn't healthy. It sure as Hell isn't healthy for you, and I hope you can see that.

Please, find someone to talk to about what's going on. A therapist, a friend, a family member who'll understand, SOMEONE!

And if things get worse for you, call a crisis hotline. They're in the phonebook or http://www.superpages.com.

PM me if you need anything. I care about you.

Peace and love,

Scot

_________________________
There are reasons I'm taking medication. They're called "other people." - Me, displaying my anti-social tendancies

fromacuriousmind.blogspot.com
malehurtandsurvive.blogspot.com

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#61340 - 08/09/04 03:32 PM Re: forget it-im just a pest anyways
PAS Offline
Member

Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Angelina.. it sounds like you got caught in the crossfire of a bad breakup and also you are a "secondary victim" to your former partner's abuser/abuse experience. Its not an easy situation to be in and its tough when you KNOW in your heart that you did nothing but try to love and help your partner to be made out to be such an awful person. Remember you did NOTHING wrong by trying to help and love him - he is in a positon where he is so confused and freaked out he sees everything as a threat - kind of like a cornered animal.

I have had a similar experience with some former boyfriends (why I only dated survivors of some kind of abuse I"m not sure.. probably because I come from wicked abusive background myself) and I have had the experience several times of rapidly going from someone's "number one girl" to "public enemy number 1" so fast it made my head spin. It makes no sense, and its bewildering and perplexing and painful as hell.

Remember that when you are dealing with someone who has some very serious issues that you should NOT personalize what happened to the relationship.. there is damn little anyone can do when there are MASSIVE issues such as sexual abuse that are threatening the relationship, particularly if you are the non abused partner. Sometimes there are just things in life that are much bigger than we can do anything about and we have to let things go... This breakup was NOT your fault. It wasn't his fault, it wasn't anyone's fault. It just is. If you want ot put the blame anywhere, put it squarely on your ex's abuser.

Also remember that a lot of the sh** that your ex said to you about how you "were his problem" etc. etc. is NOT true. My own fiance says shit like that to me from time to time when he gets triggered or has flashbacks, etc. What that bull crap is, is NOT the truth but the result of a SERIOUS anxiety attack that he is having when someone is too close OR if he's being triggered.

Surviors have the double edged sword of desperately craving closeness, sometimes to the point of doing a lot of questionable things to get it (diving rapidly into relationships, etc), but then they quickly get freaked out to the point of acting like crazy people when they get close to someone.

At that point, their behavious, actions, emotions and all of that are no longer guided by logic and rationality but by extreme emotionality. It makes NO sense but it is a common symptom of someone under extreme emotional stress. I've heard it called "the wobble" as people waffle rapidly between "I love you I need you" and "I hate you get out of my face" mental states. It tests the patience and groundedness of ALL of us who are involved with abuse survivors on a regular basis to NOT get sucked into that craziness and crap.

With respect to relationship/intimacy anxiety, it takes survivors a LONG time to learn that their problems will not be solved by breaking up, by turning to someone else, by addictions (drugs, alcohol, sex) or by abusing/taking it out on others. My fiance's who is an abuse survivor has been through numerous relationships and 15 years of dating before he realized that hmm.. maybe the problem is in him, and not with ALL the girls (10-15+) he's been involved with. Even now he still finds serious fault with me when he's in one of his insecure, triggered or fearful states, and I have to remind him and me that I'm a damn decent person and a good partner, that I am not his abuser and that I dont deserve his crap and he should lay the (*&()*& off me and put his anger towards someone who actually deserves it. I take a risk each time I say that I know but I refuse to get sucked into that crap one more time.. I have become very depressed being with people who treated me that way on an ongoing basis because I was quick to believe that I was actually the person at fault.. only to have the person eventually leave me for being "depressed"!! Go figure! My only fault was buying into that crap and not standing up for myself.. not exactly the kind of thing I expected to sign up for when I got involved in a romantic relationship!!!

That being said, I am particularly concerned about you right now - you said you have not eaten for 2 weeks - not eating is a key sign of depression, and 2 weeks is the general guideline for doctors to diagnose clinical depression. Depression can be situational and initiated by traumatic incidents such as a breakup (I was treated for 3 years after a similar breakup.. so I can guarantee I DO know what you feel like.. its not fun). Also I am aware that, as I stated previously, sometimes one can get sucked into the trauma and drama of a survivor's life and get depressed by being around that kind of thing. Perhaps you were already stressed and depressed before you broke up, and this just exacerbated the situation.

Please take this advice seriously - depression can be a serious and life threatening situation so it is very important that you take yourself and your current not-eating situation VERY VERY VERY seriously. Please try to get to a doctor and/or a counsellor asap.

Remember - time has a way of healing broken hearts... I guarantee in 1 month you wont be feeling nearly the same amount of pain that you do now. I find that the first 3-4 weeks are the most acute and painful. Broken hearts are NOT fun.. I've had a few nasty ones myself in my 34 years on this planet. Look towards the fall, I guarantee that things wont be as bad for you as they are now. But if you are depressed its hard to see the light at the end of the tunnel.. please take your situation seriously.

I dont know if you have any spiritual interests or beliefs, but I would like to believe that God has a special interest in watching over us when we are in our most pain.. and that he does love you even when you think you've been abandoned here on Earth. And one thing I've also learned is that human love is never perfect, no matter how well intentioned or how grounded/healthy a person is. Only God's love is ever as perfect as we want it to be.. and to focus your attention there when you think there is no other hope.

Meanwhile back here on earth.. keep posting here.. there's lots of people who care and who have been in your shoes. You will get a lot of good advice and support here.


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#61341 - 08/09/04 04:31 PM Re: forget it-im just a pest anyways
SAR Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/07/03
Posts: 3310
Loc: USA
Angelina,

I am so sorry to see you this way-- I know how much of your heart you have put into trying to find some answers about your boyfriend and his situation.

Now that he has started therapy he is probably just starting to *actually* deal with and confront many things that he's been able to keep way in the back of his mind for a long time. This might be the reason for the new stress, embarrasment, fear, etc. and it is totally normal and in my opinion, good, because it means some kind of growth for him.

Think about that as you try to get yourself together here... his path and your path are not nessecarily the same or moving at the same pace. You have been here for years but he has to do it in his own way at his own time--imagine how you were when you first came here-- that must be just some of what he is feeling now. No wonder he wants some time alone to process.

Some time alone to process does not mean that he never wants to see you again. Respect his wishes, but don't expect anything he says right now to be written in stone. It is true that relationships are stressful-- stress does not always equal "bad" though. It just means that being in a relationship takes a toll on you and requires emotional energy and right now if your boyfriend wants to heal, he needs to be selfish with his emotional energy. That has nothing to do with you.

Give him his space, give him what he needs, he will remember it whether you do or you don't. Please, please, take this chance to be selfish with your own emotional energy. If you need to vent we will listen.

SAR


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#61342 - 08/09/04 08:02 PM Re: forget it-im just a pest anyways
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
Angelina
possibly the only real thing left is to let him know that you will be there when he's ready. Tough I know, but a Survivor in distress is never going to be easy to get along with, especially when we're starting therapy and making some heavy decisions about our lives.

Don't feel the slightest bit guilty, you've done whatever you can and more. The important person now is YOU, please take care of yourself, be kind to yourself, get help and counselling if you feel it might help. But don't give up on yourself, you'll be no good to anyone if your in bits as well.

Thanks for caring for a fellow Survivor, one day I hope he'll thank you for it.

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#61343 - 08/11/04 01:16 AM Re: forget it-im just a pest anyways
Anonymous
Unregistered


thanks


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#61344 - 08/11/04 06:43 AM Re: forget it-im just a pest anyways
SAR Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/07/03
Posts: 3310
Loc: USA
Angelina,

As a survivor and a partner, I can understand your desire to do these things, but I don't believe that what you are doing here will help either of you feel better about YOU.

Quote:
I thought it was going better, then I tried to kiss him on the cheek goodbye, and he said, NO. almost digusted by my simple cheek his, so I asked if I could just give a shoulder rub to say goodbye for a month and he told me I better go and started the car ignigtion before I was even done, I crying, him almost laughing at me spilling my guys out, I told him I loved him, but then he said NOTHING, took my little carepackage of things, and told him I loved him and I wanted him as the man in my life. He then told me Id better go, he has things to do.
There is nothing more dismaying and triggering to me than someone I care about wanting physical contact with me, and trying to use their feelings about me as a rationale for why I should do something that I REALLY REALLY do not want for my own body. In that moment I perceive it as a most unkind variety of manipulation way more than a genuine statement of feeling.

As a partner, there is almost nothing more dismaying and triggering than not being able to comfort and be affectionate with my boyfriend for extended periods of time when he is feeling bad. I respect him on this, but the more I focus on my own desires in this situation, the worse I feel about myself and the less I believe that nothing about ME is the cause of his lack of desire. Angelina, the last thing you need right now is any more reason to feel bad about yourself or guilty for any of this.

He is asking you for space, physically and emotionally, because he really needs that space. Do the both of you a favor, and respect his need for space. Don't be the one to break that month-long agreement. He will see that as an enormous act of trust and giving, and honestly I think you deserve a month off of this rollercoaster.

SAR


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#61345 - 08/12/04 12:48 PM Re: forget it-im just a pest anyways
PAS Offline
Member

Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by Angelina:
in any of your advise, do you think he will come back, or why does he act, SCARED around me like Im some crazy person, that tickes me off.
Its not possible to tell if he will come back or not. But SAR is right - you will absolutely positively HAVE to stick to your commitment to NOT talk to him for 1 month. That is absolutely critical for you to earn some trust back with him. YOu need that "currency" to make any possible headway, to have any hope of making this work in the future.

I make no bones about the fact that it is going to be DAMN hard. You loved him. Grief is painful. You'd do anything in the WORLD not to have to go down into that dark and painful place. But you have to go through it. It sucks, bad. It hurts like hell. You feel like you're being punched in the chest, like someone ripped out your heart and stomped all over it. I have been there, and it sucks like nothing else. And to accept that at this time that you have no choice but to go there, is also really hard. We all like to think that we are in charge of our lives, our relationships, but we are not totally ever in "charge". We are involved with another, completely separate human being who has chosen to spend time with us. We HAVE to trust the other person to also be there.. and in those times when we are not sure what he will do, its damn scary. I've been there. Letting go of trying to control everything and just "trusting" that either he'll come back or I'll be ok without him.. is SOOOO scary!!! And its extra important NOT to try to control things when with a survivor - its been the hardest thing for me as I am a total control freak - to have to learn to back down for the sake of not freaking out my partner who is deeply sensitized to being controlled due to his abuse experience (the ultimate act of control) has NOT been easy. But it has been well worth it. I've benefitted in many ways by trying to let go of that control freakiness (for now I am dealing with that excess energy by trying to help others).

With resepect to what you put into the relationship and how you wanted to support him, and how he dismissed you or was so afraid of you... I can attest to the fact that it is VERY hard to be blamed for the sins of another. That happens to me ALL the time in my relationship. You likely have done nothing to destroy his trust, to make him afraid, or to deserve his coolness, or condescending or hurtful behaviour. However, you have to understand that OTHERS destroyed his ability to trust and to feel safe.

Always rememember no matter what he has said ITS NOT your fault that he can't trust or feel safe, but it is something that you have to accept as being part of him right now. He carried that deep within him long before you ever showed up on the scene. What happened to him prevents him from trusting, and made him very scared. He is terrified and traumatized deep down inside and he has not dealt with it yet. Feelings of terror and trauma that he felt when he was raped do NOT just dissipate. They dont just go away. They sit there and fester deep in the pit of his very soul and his existence until he has a safe place and an ability to process the event and the feelings. It can take a lifetime to get through things like he's been through even with a LOT of work.

You do have to look at your own motivations even in your goodbye... please dont look at this with any kind of accusation on my part. I can completely understand your behaviour upon letting him go as I have totally done the exact same things when breaking up with other guys. But it does sound like even in your good bye you were still expecting things from him that he was not able to give. You probably wanted him to say "I love you and I'll be back" or at least "I love you" but he didn't. He just said nothing. And you tried to get a bit more from him by kissing him.. which is totally understandable. And he recoiled. And it hurt. Bad. Been there. It sucks!!!

However, I HIGHLY doubt that he didnt love you despite what he said and did. He would have NOT spent time with you if he didnt have any feelings for you. You have to understand that his rejection, his coldness, his hurtful words are NOT a reflection of you - you are NOT unloveable because of what happened. What really is going on is that he is just not CAPABLE of giving you what you want and need. And the more you push, the scarier it gets for him. And he retreats and pushes you away the only way he knows how - by being aggressive and hurtful.

Too often men and women even who are not traumatized get stuck into these pretty vicious "pursuer-distancer" dances.. and the only way to stop them is for the pursuer (usually the woman) to STOP pursuing and hope to hell that the distancer STOPS distancing and comes back. But that is always up to the distancer. And its a scary thing to STOP pursuing I can for sure admit to that!!

And as far as your coworkers.. girl, its none of their damn business what happens in your personal life! Your work reputation should not reflect what happens in your home life. Your work reputation should be based on what you do at work, how reliable you are, how well you do your job, how pleasant you are in dealing with coworkers and clients. Your relationship status, who you date, what you do when you are not at work is none of your coworkers damn business! If they feel so inclined to comment on it, you have every right to tell them to back off and keep their snoopy old selves out of your personal life. And if your friends dont support you because of what happened or how this relationship went down, then you may need to evaluate why they are your friends, and find people who ARE and CAN be more supportive and understanding and compassionate! I've dumped many a "friend" along the way when they just couldnt stick by me through my whole variety of crappy, unbelievable experiences (I've got a long history of growing up in an alcoholic, abusive home with a verbally aggressive and psychologically abusive, suicidal dad.. and have had a lifetime of pain dealing with it). I quickly found out who my REAL friends were during my really really LOW times!!!

P


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#61346 - 08/12/04 11:37 PM Re: forget it-im just a pest anyways
Anonymous
Unregistered


thanks so much for your comments,


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#61347 - 08/12/04 11:44 PM Re: forget it-im just a pest anyways
Anonymous
Unregistered


.


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