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#59871 - 01/25/06 05:11 PM (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Rayne Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 23
Before we got married, my husband told me that he was abused, but never gave me any specifics, as it was too painful for him. Basically, he has never received help for this. Things were fine before we got married and even right after, but as time went on, he became more depressed and withdrawn. I held back from bringing up the topic b/c he just could not talk about it. The dr. even put him on anti-depressants, for which he never really responded to, and refused to go to a psychiatrist. Anyway, fast forward to a month or so ago, I started school, so we broke down and bought a computer. The first day we got the internet up, I noticed that my husband had visited a gay porn web site. My heart dropped, as I always had this "intuition" that he might be struggling with some sexuality issues. I just shrugged it off thinking that all men are interested in porn. Anyway, I still became curious, and I noticed that when I would go to the internet history, he had cleared it out every time. So, this was a clear indication that he was hiding something.

Of course, I never thought he acted on anything, because we were ALWAYS together. We commute together, we do things together on the weekends, pretty much 99.9 percent of the time. We even went to lunch together practically every day, since we worked only a few bocks away. The last week of the year and the first week of the new year, I was extrememly busy at work, so we had not been going together to lunch. He stated he was busy too, so I thought nothing of it. Then, lately, he was always busy during lunch. He never missed lunch with me unless it was really important. And we we went for a doctor's visit last week, he asked for an HIV test. The last time this was an issue was before we got married and it was clean, so even though he said he wanted to check it out again because it was a "retrovirus", still did not sit well with me. Anyway, I just had a hunch that something was not right. I downloaded this program that would track keystrokes on the internet the other day. To make a long story short, I found out that he had several e-mail accounts stating he was a "represed bi-sexual tired of having sex with his wife" and he was using it to "hook-up" with other men during lunch. It was never a "regular", just different men every day. I broke down at work and everyone was concerened about me. I just tried to make them beleive that I had lost a loved one in death. I can't express the emptiness I felt. I cry and cry, and I feel hollow inside.

Anyway, I did not come out completely and confront him, eventually it came out. He started crying and he told me the whole story of his background, how his brother abused him for years growing up. How his parents would never give him a separate room and the abusive brother that always called him "gay", so he just grew up with such guilt and confusion. He cried all night and asked for my forgiveness and he was willing to get help.

I don't know what to do. I feel so SORRY for him, my heart bleeds that he is in so much pain, but at the same time, I can't see past my own pain. He is afraid that I will leave him, and I told him that I will stay to help him, but I know that if he keeps it up, I can't be with him. What should I do? Is he really gay, and if he is, why would I stay? I can't stop the tears. I stayed home from work because I am so depressed.

_________________________
Rayne

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#59872 - 01/25/06 06:34 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
Rayne,

I'm so sorry. Your hurt and the depth of your pain comes through in your words; I wish I could just hold you and let you cry. A virtual hug is the best I can do {{{{{Rayne}}}}}. Don't try to stop the tears, you are entitled to them for what your are going through.

I don't know if your husband is gay or not. If he is, the abuse didn't make him that way, but it sure as hell confused the hell out of him. That happens a lot as you'll see from reading past posts and the ones that will come your way.

It's admirable that you said you would stay to help him, but right now you need to allow yourself time to heal from the pain he has put you through and the possible danger he obviously thought he placed you in. You sound like a loving, caring woman. Turn some of what you give others to yourself right now. That's not selfish, it's what you need.

Now that your husband has been confronted with the reality that you know how his past has messed him up he will hopefully follow through and get the help he needs and deserves. Unfortunately, he has dragged you into his circle of suffering. You need help to get through this just as he does.

The fact that you're here is a good thing, for both of you.

Stay strong, but let the tears flow; they aren't weak, they are simply an expression of pain.

I'll be thinking of you today.

ROCK ON........Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

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#59873 - 01/25/06 07:21 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Rayne,

Like Trish I am so sorry to see you in this terrible situation. Both you and your husband have now been hurt by the abusing brother.

I think it's quite common for a survivor to find himself in total confusion and pain about his sexuality as a result of the abuse he suffered. As children we are so often led by abusers to think that we wanted the abuse, that we liked it, that we were willing participants, and so on. Even without this, an abused boy will frequently blame himself for what is happening and conclude that everything is his fault. If a boy passes on to adulthood without the opportunity to seek help and resolve all these conflicts, the consequences can be shattering for himself and those he loves.

Your husband desperately needs not just medication for depression but also therapy. This will give him the expert support and guidance he needs to work his way through his problems. The task of recovery is just NOT a do-it-yourself project, so it is a good start if he is saying he is willing to seek help.

That said, and just to back up Trish here, also look out for yourself. Your husband is acting out his abuse issues in a way that places both himself and you in danger. Your right to happiness and fulfillment is not less than his, and the fact that he is an abuse survivor doesn't change that fact.

You might want to consider seeking professional help as well. Basically, you need to decide what your boundaries are and under what terms you are willing to continue with him. Once that is clear in your mind then he needs to know that you mean business. I hate to be alarmist, but if he is seeking HIV tests then his acting out is really just about as irresponsible and dangerous as it gets. It may be that he is so despondent that he doesn't care what happens to him. That kind of self-destructive thinking is already bad enough, but the further problem is that it can drag you down with him.

I really hope you will continue to post and talk here. A lot of people will understand you and try to help you cope with this terrible situation. My heart goes out to you.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#59874 - 01/25/06 07:50 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Rayne Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 23
Thanks all for your kind words. What type of professional should I look for? Before this whole revelation, I made an appointment for him with a psychiatrist(general), but now I am thinking should I get one that specializes in sex addition?

I would NEVER in a million years would have thought that I would be dealing with this. By the way, my husband does not know that i have seen his personal ads. Should I make him take it off, or will that just make him open a new one under another alias?

_________________________
Rayne

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#59875 - 01/25/06 07:57 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Rayne,

I would start by seeing your GP and see what advice you get. What you need and what your husband needs will be very different.

I don't think it would be amiss to demand that your husband remove his personal ads. That is surely a commitment he can be expected to make if he wants to save his relationship with you.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#59876 - 01/25/06 08:53 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
Rayne,

As Larry said, your GP is a good first step. I doubt that your husband needs someone specializing in sex addiction, at least not at this point, but someone who specializes in dealing with adults who have suffered from childhood sexual abuse will be the guy/woman to go to.

Definately demand that he remove the personal ads. You have every right to do this and he has every obligation to do it if the two of you are to stand a chance together. Bad behavior is bad behavior, no matter what the cause and it needs to be changed if things are ever going to improve.

I had an issue with my b/f when I found out that the ad he had posted years ago was still up and active. I told him I wanted it gone. This was before the shit hit the fan. He assured me he would remove it and he did, but sure enough, he opened up another profile. I found out about that one after things blew up. It's definately something you need to be aware of.

It sounds like your husband is in a similar state that my b/f was in when we almost fell apart. He will want to do anything and everything he can to help himself and you and your life together. That's a good thing. I'm not saying that it's a situation to be taken advantage of, but it is one in which a dialog can be opened to things you may never have spoken about before.

ROCK ON........Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

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#59877 - 01/25/06 10:50 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Rayne Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 23
Thanks Trish and Larry. It is wonderful to have support of others. I told my husband that he has to take down all his internet post and disable all his alias e-mails. I told him that if I ever find anymore evidence of "activity", that I will have to leave. I made another appointment with a psychiatrist for next week and he is in agreement. I let him know that I love him, but he would have to comply with my wishes if he wants us to stay together. I am not naive, I know it will be a struggle for him, but I told him that if he leans on me, we can get through it together. I think that maybe we can go to some group counseling also.

_________________________
Rayne

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#59878 - 01/25/06 11:18 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
Rayne,

I can relate to what you describe. I was abused as a young boy, and it devastated my life. I never got the help I needed when I was growing up and carried it all into my adult years and my marriage. I acted out with pornography and was discovered by my wife on several occasions. I hated myself, but was unable to stop.

Thankfully I didn't act out with either women or men. I think I would have at some point but was just too scared.

I think what I would like to share with you is this. Like was said above, you need to spell out with your husband what the ground rules are for you to be able to stay with him. Perhaps more importantly, he needs to know that you are there for him with support and love, as long as those ground rules are adhered to.

He needs professional help in order to bring order to the chaos that was created in his own home by his parents and brother.

Speaking to it from the "other side of the coin" I know that your marriage can become stronger than was ever possible before, if both of you are willing to do the hard work necessary.

After 23 years of marriage, I finally was able to tell my wife of my history. To her it was a relief to finally understand what was "wrong" with me. We've been in counseling since, together and separately. Life is good for us now, better than it ever had been.

There is hope Rayne, there really is. My hope is that it will work our between you guys. You have my thoughts and prayers.

Lots of love,

John

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

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#59879 - 01/26/06 12:42 AM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
Rayne,

Good for you Rayne and good for your husband for agreeing to see a psych. The first steps are hard, and it doesn't get easier fast. My b/f goes through some very, very rough times. He's learning to trust me a bit more with some of it and that causes me pain. Not because he leans on me, I welcome that, but when you think of him being hurt in the worst of ways as a child and the damage it's done to the man that you love, it can rip you up.

Love, understanding and the setting and keeping of boundaries, for both of you, are what will keep you together. A therapist for him will be life saving and a therapist for you will help you keep your sanity; so will this place. If I couldn't come here and learn and get feedback on the things I and we are going through, I'd be floundering around like a lost soul.

The more you learn and understand, the better your life will become.

ROCK ON.........Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

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#59880 - 01/26/06 01:32 AM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
Rayne
the details are different, but the results are much the same. I was abused as a boy then went on to act out with other strange men when I was about 46yo and married since I was 21yo. I'm 53 later this year and still married.

My wife also discovered my acting out when I left a copy of my journal that I was writing for my therapist to read on the pc, and like you she was devastated - and supportive, with conditions!

Which is both understandable from your point of view, and actually very good for us.
There is no way we can change our behaviours without boundaries being set. We can set our own and try to abide by them, but it's easier with love and support. We also have a goal to aim for, which is much more important to us when the boundaries and goals INCLUDE the person we love and so nearly lost.

Acting out is a complex issue, and for many guys it has very little to do with being gay or bi, or even sex.
The reality is often that we are trying to regain control over the sex that was imposed on us as boys. I certainly thought and believed that by repeating those acts as an adult, and on my terms, then I would somehow come to terms with what happened to young David, but the reality was entirely different.

Obviously I didn't seek sex with strange men actually thinking like that, this chain of events and behavioural changes has only become apparent through therapy with someone experienced and skilled in dealing with survivors.
Back when I was acting out I was locked into a fantasy world that had always been with me but had escalated over the years until the inevitable day when I made the fantasy come true - or so I thought. Like I said, the reality was very different, so I carried on in search of my fantasy.

If he's serious about healing then it's possible, but remember that you can's do it for him and neither can you drag him through it, he has to make the effort.
If he does then stand by for a bumpy ride and a lot of tears.
It's time to set boundaries, both of you need to do that, and then things can start to move on.

Acting out is a horrible thing for any partner to have to deal with, and the things you will read here and in books, the things such as I said here, can - and will - sometimes seem like excuses for us getting our jollies. That's hard to come to terms with, but it can be done if BOTH parties are willing to learn and be totally honest with each other.

You've made a start by coming here.

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#59881 - 01/26/06 03:36 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Rayne Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 23
I am crying again, not so much because of myself, but because of your survivor stories. Thanks for sharing. I feel so much better, because I don’t feel like I am alone in this anymore. I am comforted to hear experiences from both sides – the victims and their loved ones.

Dave – it is a relief to hear that you are still married. I want to be there and help my husband, I love him so much, but now (a day later), I am having second thoughts. Images keep coming in my mind about my husband and all these other men. Last night, he wanted to make love, and I hesitated of course – it seems just so soon. But I felt like if I did not give in, he would just run off again, so I did give in. It is crazy. I don’t know what to do or think anymore. Then he asked me what do I think he is, sexually speaking. I wanted to say “gay”, but I could not come to terms with saying it. It just seems like it would make it more of a reality if I verbalized it. So, I asked him what does HE think he is, and he just said that “he did not know” that he was “confused”. I know you said that acting out has nothing to do with being gay or bi, but in the back of my mind, I keep seeing him with these men. I guess it is bad because I read his graphic posts and e-mail as to what he and these men were doing. Yesterday, I found a convenient store receipt of a soda and a condom, the day before we left before our anniversary trip. And then as I was cleaning up the room, I found a whole drawer full of them. I can’t believe that I was so clueless about this when all of the sudden, after 2 years, he wanted to start using them all the time, even though I had always been on the pill. I can’t help but feel betrayed all over again.

Dave, after receiving the help, do you still think of men? I don’t mean to pry and I don’t ask to be nosey, I just keep thinking 10 years down the road, am I still going to get scared when a handsome guy walks in the room or on the t.v./movie screen? I am just so scared that my life will never truly be the same.

My husband’s appt. is next week, and I am counting down the minutes, hours, days. I hope after he starts getting the help he needs, I will let him know about this web site, and I hope he joins. You all are a great bunch of survivors. Thanks.

_________________________
Rayne

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#59882 - 01/26/06 04:22 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Rayne,

Your post above shows all the mixed emotions that one would expect from you in such a situation. Relief that you are not alone and that your feelings are validated. Second thoughts, anger, sadness, betrayal. It's all totally normal and it goes to show what a big problem you are facing.

I can just come back to something John said, and that was how he and his wife are facing these things together. I don't know if that would work for you two right from the start (because you might need the opportunity to unload a lot of volatile and painful feelings at first), but perhaps it is something to aim for.

You said something in particular that got me thinking:

Quote:
Last night, he wanted to make love, and I hesitated of course – it seems just so soon. But I felt like if I did not give in, he would just run off again, so I did give in. It is crazy. I don’t know what to do or think anymore.
You had to make a decision at the spur of the moment and emotionally you were caught off-guard. But do think of your own feelings and safety here. Sex isn't something someone is "owed". It would be entirely justified if you declined sex under the present circumstances, and if he were then to proceed to seek it elsewhere, what would that say about your relationship and his attitude towards you? You have every right to demand his respect for certain basic boundaries, and he should be willing to comply just because they are THAT basic. You are not being arbitrary or difficult if you insist on this.

And please don't start beating yourself up because you didn't see this or that sign of trouble in the past. Hindsight is always 20/20.

I do hope you two can make a start to working things out.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#59883 - 01/26/06 04:57 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Rayne Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 23
Thanks Larry. (yes, I meant to refrence John, I don't know where I get "Dave" from). I really did feel that it was "owed" - I'm his wife and he told me that he really needs it. He said that in his mind, he just "has to have it" and any little thing turns him on. I ended up feeling so cheap and used, esp. because now he seemed to be a totally different man, not because of what I now knew about him, but because he really was acting differently. As if he was in one of his "sessions" with his hook-ups. I ended up feeling sick afterward and I wanted to cry, but I did not want him to see me crying again, so I held it in.

_________________________
Rayne

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#59884 - 01/26/06 05:23 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Rayne,

Please don't think I am being hard on you, because I absolutely don't mean to do that. But have a look at your post. It expresses exactly the sort of conflict that is developing.

On the one hand, his side: you are my wife, I have needs, I "just have to have it". To be honest, that is all very immature and selfish on his part. Sure he has needs and desires, so say we all. But the relationship isn't about satisfying his needs surely.

Then there is your side:

Quote:
I ended up feeling so cheap and used.... As if he was in one of his "sessions" with his hook-ups. I ended up feeling sick afterward and I wanted to cry, but I did not want him to see me crying again, so I held it in.
You have every right to feel this way and I hope you will express your feelings. I really do think that it doesn't help either party when the partner of a survivor is made to feel that her needs and feelings are just going to be trumped all the time because the survivor is in a bad spot.

There really do need to be boundaries that are respected by both sides, and both sides need to feel free to say what they feel about where the boundaries should be.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#59885 - 01/26/06 07:45 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
TX_Space Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/02/05
Posts: 163
Loc: Texas
Rayne,
As a soon-to-be-ex-husband with similar issues that you guys are facing, I want to say, I am sorry for what you are going through. It took me months to admit that I was sorry for what I put my wife through. But, she didn't take the time to stay around.

Like Larry and Trish say...take care of yourself. (BTW, just an aside...you have two of the BEST advisors you could ever find in those two...they're AWESOME!!!!!!!!) Your worries and concerns and fears and emotions are all so valid. Hearing them from you, helps me understand more and more of what my wife must have felt.

Now, as a man who is facing all of this on his own, I am going to ask you to stay with your husband. By all means, set your boundaries and stick to them. But, he needs you there...to know you love him and that he is worth staying for.

He doesn't know what he is sexually right now...gay, bi, straight or some unnamed combination of the the three. But, trying to pigeon-hole him and forcing him to make a decision can be very detrimental to recovery. Not to make this post about me (but I'm hoping it sheds some light)...I didn't disclose my csa to my wife until after she told me she wanted out.

She had determined that I was gay. My first two therapists leaned the questions and pushed me that way. My close friends and family members who I shared with tried to push me that way. Inside, I KNEW/KNOW what I was/am. I'm not gay. I have no desire for a relationship with a man...I love my wife with all my heart...but I seek these activities with men out of compulsion...I can't stop myself. About 4 months ago, it almost became too much...if it weren't for my two beautiful children...I wouldn't be here today.

I am working on it. I am attending sex addicts anonymous. I'm working through my issues with my csa and starting to connect the dots. So far, the picture is only about 1/16th of the way complete. I have the love and support of friends but not my wife...and it's hard.

Okay, so that was a lot about me...sorry. I'm trying to say. Please strongly consider staying with your husband as he works through his issues. His picture may not turn out like either of you can begin to imagine...but if you help him complete it...or at least support him positively while he does...it will be the most beautiful thing you have ever seen. AND, you will be a part of it.

Sorry for the long post. Feel free to do with it as you will. PM me if you want...I am in Houston, too.

God Bless you and your husband.
tx_space


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#59886 - 01/26/06 09:02 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Rayne Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 23
tx_space,

Thanks so much...I sent you a PM.

_________________________
Rayne

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#59887 - 01/26/06 10:01 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
Rayne
I know that I'm not gay because I don't fancy men, I never have. I don't look at any man, young, old handsome or whatever and think "I'd like to have sex with him" - even less do I think about entering into any kind of relationship with a man. And I have no fantasies or desires to be 'intimate' with another man, as in kissing or hugging. But I've had more male sexual 'partners'than female in my life so far.

My focus was always a simple one, I wanted to give other guys bj's. And that's what I did when acting out, I didn't care one bit what they were like, and I never got as far as even asking their name.

But I can't take my eyes off a pretty girl or woman. I have been 100% faithful in not having any kind of affair or even casual sex with another woman since I met my wife, and I have had offers of casual sex ( one very recently) and the almost certain chance of at least two affairs. I can resist that quite easily, although I have to say it does my ego a power of good!

Do I still have the fantasy of giving bj's? Yes - to a ( smaller and controlable ) degree, but it's not the overpowering desire that was driven by the fantasy getting out of hand and resulting in sexual addiction. I still look at
porn sometimes, but gay porn is getting less frequent and straight porn is beginning to sexually excite me. I actually get horny from the straight stuff whereas the gay porn was like some kind of ritual, or duty, that I needed to do,

When I was at my worst about 7 to 10 years ago I would fantasize at every available moment, and I would go to the lengths of avoiding other people and other distractions so I could concentrate on my fantasy. When I look back I am amazed how I could spend so much time and effort thinking about nothing else but giving bj's. The fantasies didn't even include the details of how I would meet the other man, what he looked like or anything, it was purely focused on the act. And the possible consequences NEVER appeared in the fantasy either. I knew the consequences for sure, the possibility of various STD's, the loss of family and friends if I got caught, the possibility of police involvement because I was cruising public toilets.
It could have easily led to the end of my comfortable life as I knew it.
But the fantasies had their own life in a way, I had perfected the whole scenario to the extent that my brain was producing an overload of adreniline and other chemicals that gave me a far better high than cocaine ever did, and in the end I could time all this so that if I knew I had a chance to go cruising at a particular time then I walked into that toilet out of my skull.

I would only think about the negative things after the event, or if I wasn't successful in meeting another man and I masturbated. Then the guilt and shame set in - big time. Guess what I did to cheer myself up?

It's unfair for him to ask you what sexuality you think he is, but it's also understandable because he seems to be very confused, just like I and many other guys are who act out.
But it's up to us to do the soul searching and ask ourselves "do I fancy guys more than women?"
The fact is many men are in denial and marry women as part of that denial, but you probably 'know' who he looks at when walking around the mall.

It's a difficult time for you both, but in different ways. You're both scared of how each other will react to different revelations etc, but in different ways and for different reasons. The only way through it is together, with openness and trust. But trust isn't our strong point, that was wrecked when we were abused. I thought I didn't trust my wife even after 20 - 25 years of marriage, but the reality was I didn't trust MYSELF to make my own judgements about how much I actually did trust her. That's been a steeplearning curve I promise you.

I would say that the big priorities for you now are firstly keeping your sanity and composure, you'll be no good to anyone if you crack up. And secondly figuring out just how serious he is about his healing and future. Unfortunately for us to make any kind of decent recovery we have to make huge committments and efforts, but the fact is it's worth it.

We set ourselves some boundaries and established
a level of trust, that was our first action. Then we began to talk, and I began to learn that she wasn't going to reject me for what I'd done in the past, that was gone and finished with. If I'd have acted out once more I'd be out on my ass, it was that simple. But for the first time in my life I had a set of behavioural boundaries that I wanted to keep, I'd grown up a rebel and always in some kind of trouble and mostly got away with it. This was for real though, and I respected that boundary because I KNEW the consequences. I also believed in the boundaries.

From then on nothing I said or disclosed was judged or criticised by her, not in the respect of her critisizing me directly anyway. Of course she was shocked and disgusted, but my willingness to go to therapy, learn about my problems, and make an effort to deal with them was OUR priority, so she quite possibly refrained from voicing critisism ( I'm still not sure ) and just encouraged me, and praised me for my efforts and results.
That was the way my wife worked though, and I don't presume that it would work for everyone.
Maybe it was a compromise on her part? I don't know. And some people might not be willing to do that either, that's their choice.
But for us the trade, whatever it might have been, was worth it.

Life ain't perfect, but hey - we're still together and in love!

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#59888 - 01/26/06 11:18 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Rayne Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 23
Thanks guys. You are ALL so wonderful. Thanks Dave… your experience was very insightful. I PRAY that our situation will come out the same as yours. Your wife sounds to be very supportive. How long did it take for you to get to where you are now? From the point where you realized that you have a problem to the point of getting help to your present recovery? (I am just asking to anyone in general)

I too have refrained from “going off” and critisizing him. Yes, I wanted to just lay into him how disgusted I was in finding out, how awful I feel, and how absolutly appauling and repulsvie I felt his habits were. I still feel that way, and at some points when when he is trying to hold my hand or kiss me, I seriously want to just push him away and tell him to go kiss whatever guy he was kissing on last week. I truly want to say these things. But I don’t. First of all, I am not that type of person. Second, I know in my heart that he really has a problem. He is not trying to “cheat” on me per se. He is acting and behaving in some way dictated by his abuse. He really is hurting inside, and I know if I say and do nasty things to him, he won’t get better, but it will just push him even further into dispair and he will continue his self-abusive habits.

Were you relieved at having your wife’s boundaries? My husband showed me where he deleted his hotmail accounts, and he even just called me right now to tell me that he had to run an errand. I guess he knew if I called his office and did not answer, I would think he was on one of his little sessions. I called him yesterday during lunch while I was at home, at the time that I found out he regularly went out to his “thing”, and he answered. We went to lunch together today for the first time in a LONG time. I felt very good that so far (even though it has not been that long), that he has been respectful of my wishes. I just hope he feels the same way too, or at least one day he will.

Rayne

_________________________
Rayne

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#59889 - 01/27/06 01:59 AM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
Rayne,

Some of these things are really difficult for me to talk about, but you asked a question a few posts back that I'd like to try to address. You asked of Dave
Quote:
after receiving the help, do you still think of men?
I would have to answer that question in the affirmative. Now before you get discouraged, let me explain. Before I began my recovery I probably could have been referred to as a bisexual. There were both women and men that I considered to be really HOT!

Since I've been on this path called recovery, I find that there are still guys that turn my head. The difference is that now I don't have the lust for them that I once had. Sexual thoughts don't enter into the picture anymore.

The other thing I find different is that I am not conciously looking for hot guys like I used to be. It's more of a thing where I suddenly realize I was looking. My wife will catch me at it sometimes and comment on whether she thinks he's good looking or not. It's her way of being understanding and yet letting me know she saw! I love her for it. I keep telling her that she is in less danger of losing me now than she ever has been, even though there are still guys and gals for that matter that turn my head.

I guess what I would say in relating this to your situation is that he may always have some residual effects from all of the trauma in his life.

It's sort of like the guy at the AA meeting who gets up and says "Hi, my name is John and I'm and alcoholic".

I think the AA folk have it figured out pretty well. I also think what they have can be easily and correctly applied to this situation. These things will always be with us as survivors in some form or another even though we are essentially recovered, or on the recovery path. It's not that we want to, or are in any danger of going back to the old ways. We don't want to. We want to be, and always will be faithful to our spouse, but some of the affects are still there, just as they are with the alcoholic.

I feel like I've muddied the waters here, but it's what I have to offer.

Lots of love,

John

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

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#59890 - 01/27/06 02:45 AM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
Rayne,

My b/f and I didn't make love for several weeks after we got back together. It didn't feel right for me because of the pictures of him with other women that I could not get out of my head. I told him that and he didn't press me. That was very important to me.

We talked a lot, about us and about him and started to re-learn about each other and connect on a level that didn't include sex. We were still very intimate with one another though. What we did as we spoke was always sit close, or lay with each other on the floor, we held hands, caressed each other's arms, legs, or face. We were almost like blind people who needed to "see" without eyes. We kissed, but nothing more. This type of closeness did arouse physical passion, but it was kept in check and not permitted to go further until I was ready.

I found that as my anger and hurt diminished, I wanted our sex life back too. I had decided that for as long as he was doing everything he could to make his and our life better, then I was not going to walk away. I had just as much of a responsibility to our relationship as he did. We had and have a great love affair and just as he had to work to save it, so did I. I haven't forgotten what happened, I never will, but I have forgiven him. I have my moments of dis-trust and fear; that's to be expected and it's perfectly normal. The blind trust I had before is gone, but it has and will continue to get better.

My point is this, if you don't want to have sex with your husband at this point, you have every right to say no. You need to tell him that. A few days, weeks or even months without it is not going to kill him. I have no doubt that when he told you he "needs" it, that it was his way of trying to maintain his hold on you because he knew you almost had one foot out the door. Explain to him that not allowing you the time to heal from what he has done is the surest way to push you out.

You need to find a common ground and work from there. Boundaries. You'll hear the word a lot here because it's very important. Those boundaries need to be respected, by both partners or things fall apart. You both have memories to deal with - his are in the far past and yours are recent, but they are both powerful and hurtful and the have ability to destroy if they are not dealt with. You are working to understand his pain; he has to work to understand yours as well, it’s the right thing to do.

ROCK ON..........Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

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#59891 - 01/27/06 02:08 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
riviera Offline
Member

Registered: 06/01/05
Posts: 59
Loc: Spain
Hi Rayne,

My boyf and I had gone through a lot since he decided to recover. Just like most couples in here...

I totally agree with Dave about the fact that having mutual commitment to communicate, listen and express each other in a safe and trustful environment (non judgmental in both ways) is key to keep the relationship going. There are many things that will unstable your situation as the healing progresses but if there is mutual commitment and understanding your relationship will eventually even get richer and better than before any of this started...
It is a long and painful process but if you both stick together through the storms (always respecting and believing in each other) the rewards will be better than nothing else ever in your life... but commitment is needed ...both ways

This is our experience.
H


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#59892 - 01/27/06 05:37 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
John
far from muddying the waters, you raise a very good point about the comparison between sex addicts and alcoholics.
The 12 step programes seem to be very effective for both as well.
A lot of people misunderstand sex addiction, certainly in the media. When someone famous admits they are sex addicts all we see is lurid headlines and smart-ass quips. So people think that sex addiction is a constant line up of supermodels begging for sex!
It couldn't be further from the truth though, it's more like filling every available second of the day, every day, with sexual obsessive thoughts. Often at the expense of other thoughts. The sex is more likely to be masturbation as well, often many times a day. It doesn't matter one bit if we are married to sexy and willing partners either, because I think that the obsessive thoughts have absolutely nothing to do with 'real sex' as in a relationship. I certainly didn't obsess about that because I knew it was there and available when I wanted it. That is also consensual sex, and in a relationship it should be equal and without one person being in control, but we're looking for sex WITH an element of power and control, we want to regain what we lost as kids.
I firmly believe that's why so many survivors act out.


Quote:
I had just as much of a responsibility to our relationship as he did. We had and have a great love affair and just as he had to work to save it, so did I. I haven't forgotten what happened, I never will, but I have forgiven him. I have my moments of dis-trust and fear; that's to be expected and it's perfectly normal. The blind trust I had before is gone, but it has and will continue to get better.
What Trish say's is, to me, the essence of a loving relationship.
How close did I come to losing that? Very close, and for me it was the biggest wake up call I'll ever have.
And I'm always full of admiration for women like yourselves who make the decision to work with us and not throw us out the door on our ass.
If anyone had asked me when I was acting out what my wife's reaction would be if she found out I would have said "Hell, I'm a dead man!"
It's still hard to appreciate that our relationship was that strong because I was seriously f****d up at that point and we weren't getting along very good.

Riviera has reinforced the point that we HAVE to communicate, there is no other alternative.
For us that's difficult, how can we sit with our wife and talk about having quick sex with unknown men? I have never done anything harder in my life, and I hope I never will.
We fell into a routine of talking, and it suited us so we carried on with it.
Back in 1998 when I started therapy it was on a Wednesday night early on, so she would pick me up and we'd go to a pub for our evening meal.
I found that I could talk when we'd finished the meal, as long as there wasn't anyone sat right alongside me. So that's what we did - we talked.
I also don't like talking about MY abuse in our home, I just don't want that crap in here, but I can sit here and do this. Strange? maybe....
This routine moved on to a Friday night at an Indian restraunt, we're off there shortly \:D ,
I just like the idea of removing 'my crap' from our space. It has some other advantages as well, we're far less likely to throw our toys outta the pram in public for a start, and there are actually less distractions. People aren't knocking at the door and the phone isn't ringing.
It is a strange way of communicating for sure, but it works for us because it has become an established routine, which I think is a very positive thing. If you choose to go for a routine, and it certainly hasn't got to be cast in stone, then of course it can be done at home, but distractions must be avoided. I certainly like the chance to frame my sentences and gather my thoughts, and sitting in a quiet booth in the Indian somehow allows me to do this. I must admit that I'm also very relaxed after a good curry and too much wine as well :rolleyes:

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#59893 - 01/27/06 06:11 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Rayne Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 23
Trish, it is great to know that you know what I am going through. I think “guilty” is the word I feel when I try to say “no” to my husband regarding sex. I want to run away, but I end of feeling so bad for rejecting him. I tried to say “no” again last night, and he said that he just wanted to show me that he still found me desireable and he loved me. But when I said “that’s OK”, or in other words “no” again, he asked me if I would manually do “you know what” to him. That is when a red flag went up in my head. It really had nothing to do with me at that point. Or maybe he truly was thinknig of me, but when I showed I did not want it, he reverted back to him. I am still having a time dealing with that. It is as if in an instance, he could separate the love from the sex. But I do think that is what I will do. I think I need time to heal too… esp. even if I do have sex with him, it is an act. I don’t want to get any pleasure of it. I did it because he wanted it and not because I wanted to.

Dave, you said something interesting…

If anyone had asked me when I was acting out what my wife's reaction would be if she found out I would have said "Hell, I'm a dead man!"

I read in one of his e-mails to a guy where he said that if his wife found out, that I would just “go crazy or be mad as hell” or something to that nature. He was very shocked that I did not. I was hurt, I cried, but I did not rant and rave.

I do like what you said about going to another location to talk about these things. I agree that the home should feel like the “haven”, a protection, where all the other ugly stuff can’t get in. After my husband starts his treatment, I definintely want to do something similar.

Thanks Rivera, I love your comment:

It is a long and painful process but if you both stick together through the storms (always respecting and believing in each other) the rewards will be better than nothing else ever in your life... but commitment is needed ...both ways


Simply and beautifully stated.

Thanks all…

_________________________
Rayne

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#59894 - 01/27/06 06:58 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Rayne,

I usually go on and on when I post on the DB, but here I will keep it brief because I really think you need to think about this:

No one "owes" sex to anyone else. Not under ANY circumstances.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#59895 - 01/27/06 07:40 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Rayne Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 23
Larry, you are right. Thank you very much. \:\)

_________________________
Rayne

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#59896 - 01/28/06 12:44 AM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
Rayne
Maybe he's 'confusing' sex with love at this time?

For most partnerships sex and love are synonomous, but maybe now he's feeling huge amounts of guilt and shame and needs to show you that he's truly sorry and still loves you.
And 'sex' is a way of showing that, it might not be the most appropriate way at this time but possibly it's the only he feels able to express himeself?
Is acting out about sex or expressing ourselves, however badly and dysfunctionally?

findin a 'neutral' taling ground was good for me, and we talked again tonight in a way I just cant do at home.
Wherever or whenever it is I guess what I'm stressing is that it's us ( the survivor ) that has the hard talking to do ( you have the hard listening and replying ) so maybe the comfort zone does need to be in our favour?
Maybe partners need a reciprocal deal? Perhaps I should ask. :rolleyes:

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#59897 - 01/28/06 02:33 AM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Trish4850 Offline
BoD Liaison Emeritus
MaleSurvivor<

Registered: 10/15/05
Posts: 3280
Loc: New Jersey
Rayne,

I think men in general have a much easier time than women in separating love and sex. For survivors it's even more difficult. They were never a part of the learning curve when it was being developed so now, as adults, they have a hard time or may even be totally clueless. I'm dealing with this with my b/f. He believes that sex is sex and love is love. Trying to explain to him that they are not mutually exclusive is very difficult, but he's trying to learn.

Dave nailed it

Quote:
For most partnerships sex and love are synonomous, but maybe now he's feeling huge amounts of guilt and shame and needs to show you that he's truly sorry and still loves you.
And 'sex' is a way of showing that, it might not be the most appropriate way at this time but possibly it's the only he feels able to express himeself?
My b/f was also s/a by a family member, his mother actually and your husband by a brother. Family is supposed to love you. Unfortunately, our partners learned that "love" equals sex and abuse. It's no wonder that they are wrecks when it comes to knowing how to love in a world outside of what they learned. Our world is a scary place because everything they've learned to expect is not what they find, yet they are always looking for it - bad things that is.

In our partner's cases, it took a long time to do the damage and it's going to take a long time to undo it.

ROCK ON........Trish

_________________________
If you fall down 10 times, Stand up 11.

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#59898 - 01/28/06 04:38 AM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
SAR Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/07/03
Posts: 3310
Loc: USA
Hi Rayne,

I apologize for not welcoming you earlier but I wanted to have time to read everything first, and I'm glad I did.

My partner acted out online, never in person. Like you I found evidence of what he'd done and confronted him with *most* of it. At the time I discovered it, he had put a stop to the behaviors on his own long before-- just kept the "souvenirs"-- a lot like the convenience store receipt you mention.

A survivor acting out is coming from a very self-centered place-- I don't mean "selfish" exactly-- but when Dave says that a lot of the explanations for acting out read like excuses for getting off at the expense of loved ones, it's because the acting out is ALL about the survivor and what's going on in his mind... and what's going on in his mind leaves little room for the rest of the world.

My partner was like this most of the time while he was acting out. He was generally withdrawn, careless, and inconsiderate. Instead of expressing what he needed from me in ways that respected my boundaries and choices, he would say manipulative, entitled stuff that sounds a lot like what your husband is saying about "just wanting to show you he loves you". This behavior makes sense to me in retrospect. I think that the only time he DID consider my feelings was after the fact-- as Dave says, in reference to sexual acting out:
Quote:
I would only think about the negative things after the event...Then the guilt and shame set in - big time. Guess what I did to cheer myself up?
The negativity and repressed emotions, and the acting out behaviors, feed off of each other-- they're two sides of the coin.

I'm going on a bit long about this because it was important for me to recognize as a partner, that the bad habits and the inconsiderate, manipulative stuff that crossed my boundaries-- were acting out just as much as the sexual chat. That meant that 1. They had nothing to do with me, and 2. I was not doing him any favors by turning a blind eye.

I see you trying hard to be supportive and give your husband what he is asking for right now. But I hope you know-- even if you do get angry at your husband-- even if you don't feel like you can have sex with him right now-- YOU CAN'T CONTROL his acting out. And if he does it again, it will not be because of you, or your fault, whether you've been nasty and angry or a total doormat, or anything in between.

All you can control is your own behavior and your reactions to him.

In my case, like with Dave's, my partner knew I was serious when I said that I would not stay in a relationship with him unless some things changed-- and both of us were willing and able to make those changes. Some of them, at first glance, don't have much to do with sexual acting out-- but they do-- and they are all important.

SAR


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#59899 - 01/28/06 10:40 AM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
shadowkid Offline
WARNING from ModTeam, September 2013: user "Shadowkid" was exposed as a hoaxer. His entire online persona and stories of sexual abuse were fiction. We encourage you not to become emotionally concerned by anything you see in any of his posts. Thank you
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/18/05
Posts: 2437
i don't think his abuse is an excuse for letting you down and putting you in mortal danger ,he should admit he screwed up ,and decide what he wants from life ,i understand maybe he can't help it but with the danger of aids he is playing russian roulett with your life ,are you gonna get tested for the next ten years just because he acted out?sorry but i think anybody who has someone to support them as you have done for him should thank their lucky stars ,and thank god that at least one person didn't run from his abuse ,i think it is a shame that any of this happened to you .

_________________________
its not hard to fall
when you float like a cannonball - damien rice

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#59900 - 01/28/06 11:15 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
SAR used the word "selfish" - which is a word I have often used here at MS because recovery is a selfish experience from the survivors point of view. It's "all about me".

I don't use the word to describe the kind of selfish behaviours that completly ignore the partners feelings or cause deliberate hurt, I use 'selfish' to describe the sharp focus that we seem to need to recover.
It will almost certainly result in us hurting and frustrating our partners, but I think it's a result of us turning in on ourselves for a period of time at the expense of others. We don't set out to hurt, but we will without a doubt do it unthinkingly. We very often seem to become introverted and self focused.

That's bad news for any partner who's pulling out ALL the stops to help us. I know for a fact that I got the kind of love and support, understanding and patience, that I could not possibly pay back at the time. I honestly wonder how my wife coped with me a few years back when I was in therapy because I became someone who would be silent for very long periods then open up all at once - after I'd 'got my head together'. I still do this a bit.

The fact is, once we disclose and start on our recoveries we become different people to the ones we were before, the genie is out of the bottle and it's NEVER going to go back in.
We, as in 'you and us', then have a choice. We stagnate or move on.

Here's to moving on !

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#59901 - 01/30/06 09:09 AM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
riviera Offline
Member

Registered: 06/01/05
Posts: 59
Loc: Spain
Just wanted to add to Dave and SAR's post that in my boyfriend's case it was him who actually decided that he would finally take care of himself, look into his needs.That is how he started the healing process. That was the first decision he took towards healing though it seemed subconscious at the time. My boyfriend would have never before stopped and looked inside himself. He was too much focused outwards, towards people, trying always to help and satisfy others but when it was about him...nothing. Maybe too scared to look, too lonely, too lost...

Once this happened he needed all the time and attention in the world. For someone who has never done it before I expected it was going to be very confusing and difficult for both of us. This seemed "selfish" so many times to me in many ways but I just knew that it would be necessary for him in order to get to the root of his fears and traumas. I was sure that I would have to "forget" about my needs and put his needs first for a wee while. I was up for the challenge, for the sacrifice if you like. His commitment (as mentioned before in this thread) was the driven force that made me be there for him without any doubt.

I must say that he found his way in and out himself, discover many things in the process and came back out sure of who he was and what he wanted in his life. He faced his own demons and he claimed his personality back. In other words he separated the abuse so that he could deal with it and realized that not everything in his personaliy, in his life, in his world was because of the abuse but pretty much the opposite. As for me, even in the worst moments, I'd try to make it as smooth as I could for him. I still remember quite clear the days that he used to say that he wanted to dissapear and go away for good to an unknown town somewhere and start again from scratch without all the past, without me. We were totally in love. I knew it was that he was scared to move forward, it was too much for him at the time. I knew it was not that he did not love me. So I did not panic. I said Iwould help him to go away if that was what he needed to do but I made clear that he could run away from me and his current situation at the time but he could not run away from himself. He was so surprised that I'd let him go ...in agood way because that meant that I was not thinking about my needs but his needs, although I knew he'd finally find the courage and fight for himself. Just as he did...

An important reason why he never took the time to look inside was the fear that he would push people away bothering them with his problems. SA is not something that everybody could understand or even talk about ...unfortunately.

I must confess that at times was very difficult for me to put his needs first. For a while not sharing my concerns and fears about him with him was very hard but I decided I'd do it with my mum or my friends never with him. This way he could focus on himself...ONLY

This was very important in his healing. Good thing is that he has always appreciated that I left other things aside and let him occupy the space he needed. He still thanks me for that and I still thank him for having the courage and taking the step to face the abuse...

This has not only helped us in the progression of recovery but has definetely reinforced our relationship in many ways .... and has made it much stronger :-)
H


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#59902 - 02/03/06 10:08 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
Rayne Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/25/06
Posts: 23
Thanks all. After this weekend, I started feeling a bit "stupid", for posting last week. Or I guess the better word is embarrased. I don't know, I was desperate when I posted, and for some reason, I started thinking that I would be laughed at, that somebody would know me and I would be shamed. But I am glad I looked back and realized that it was all in my head. You are the best bunch of people.

Rivera, I can relate to your last post. You wrote:

Quote:
Originally posted by riviera:
I still remember quite clear the days that he used to say that he wanted to dissapear and go away for good to an unknown town somewhere and start again from scratch without all the past, without me. We were totally in love. I knew it was that he was scared to move forward, it was too much for him at the time. I knew it was not that he did not love me. So I did not panic. I said Iwould help him to go away if that was what he needed to do but I made clear that he could run away from me and his current situation at the time but he could not run away from himself. He was so surprised that I'd let him go ...in agood way because that meant that I was not thinking about my needs but his needs, although I knew he'd finally find the courage and fight for himself. Just as he did...

H [/QB]
Do you know that is what my husband wants to do? He said he wants to leave, start fresh, but he does want me with him. I told him that we could go wherever he wanted to go, but he has to get the help first. You are right... you can run, but you can't hide from yourself. I still don't know if we will move, but at least he will still be getting help.

Love you guys......

Rayne

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Rayne

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#59903 - 02/04/06 06:53 PM Re: (LONG) The tears won't dry - possible triggers
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Rayne,

Got something to throw out to you....Catch! \:\)

Quote:
After this weekend, I started feeling a bit "stupid", for posting last week. Or I guess the better word is embarrased. I don't know, I was desperate when I posted, and for some reason, I started thinking that I would be laughed at, that somebody would know me and I would be shamed. But I am glad I looked back and realized that it was all in my head.
I think a lot of people think like that when they start out dealing with the heavy issues that sexual abuse involves.

If you look closely, you will see that you are talking about your initial feelings concerning the group here. Sure, they are in your head, but I firmly believe we have to take a more positive approach to our feelings.

Don't dismiss them because you think they are bad or misleading. They are signals flagging an area YOU need to work on. "I am new here. I feel insecure. Will I be believed?" That set of feelings got dealt with pretty fast, but others will be tougher to crack. But the point is you CAN do it! I would say honor your feelings and work with them. That in itself will help you deal with them and not get overwhelmed and emotionally exhausted.

On the other hand, remember that feelings are one thing and the truth they convey is another. "I feel ashamed", okay, that's a feeling: work with it and see what can be done to address that feeling of shame. But don't allow it to trick you into accepting the conclusion "I am a shameful woman".

Just some thoughts from a guy with too much free time on a Saturday evening in cold foggy Germany.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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