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#59811 - 02/10/06 05:15 AM Re: questions about sexual difficulties (TRIGGERS)
SAR Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/07/03
Posts: 3310
Loc: USA
Larry,

For some kids, porn was probably a cool, naughty, forbidden things that they went wild over. I think there are abusive ways to be introduced to pornography that can create very different associations and that's what morganna is talking about when she says that viewing porn is traumatizing and evokes disgust in her partner. This sounds like a form of acting out abuse, not at all like an amusing fantasy.

My boyfriend did this too-- he used porn as a way of accessing/recreating certain aspects of his SA before he was able to process them in a healthier way. He also used sexual chat as a way of recreating some of the dynamics of the abuse-- setting up a scenario that was all about someone else not caring about him, but using him to meet their needs.

I know my partner has trouble connecting sex and love-- I know that it is important to him and to us that he work this out, and I want him to do things that reinforce healthy ideas about sex and love, and not do things that reinforce abusive ideas about sex and his sexuality. I don't think that means that I am deluded about the fantastic elements of porn, or naive about the disparity between what "guys" want from porn and what they want from their partners.

Honestly, this is sort of what I mean when I ask if sometimes partners feel that things get turned around on them when they try to address the acting out issues in a relationship.

SAR


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#59812 - 02/10/06 10:14 AM Re: questions about sexual difficulties (TRIGGERS)
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
SAR,

In my post I don't think I said anything to give the idea I think partners are naive or deluded about porn.

I remember you speaking about the issue of things be turned around on partners, and in many cases I think you are right. But not in this case. What I tried to say here is that I think it would be natural for the two partners to see pornography in different ways. Whether they do or not, and the role that a history of abuse would play in all this, would of course depend on the individuals.

If a man says this to his partner he isn't necessarily turning things around on her, he may just be contributing to the discussion with the aim of solving a problem. If she feels things ARE being turned around on her, she should say so; that's a contribution to the discussion as well. Neither should feel the other is claiming a card that will trump whole domains of feelings.

I think I may have given the wrong idea when I referred to the world of porn as an amusing fantasy. I didn't mean that porn itself amuses me; in fact I have lots of difficulty with it. But the "world" (I can't think of a better word) depicted in porn is definitely a fantasy in the sense that it is unreal: extremes of physical and sexual endowment, the play-acting aspects, depiction of extremely unlikely scenarios, and so on.

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#59813 - 02/11/06 05:28 PM Re: questions about sexual difficulties (TRIGGERS)
Kirk Wayne Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/05
Posts: 499
Loc: Shrewsbury UK
As Dave has said

"Because of all that shit I just find it easier to avouid sex, which is desperately sad because I love my wife".

But sex scares the living daylights out of me, so I resort mainly to masturbation, I am in control, if you know what I mean.

Even talking about it freaks me out.

I know also I have a long way to go in my recovery.

Kirk
"Lets take this bull by the horns and swing it about a bit"


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#59814 - 02/13/06 08:33 PM Re: questions about sexual difficulties (TRIGGERS)
ShellyB Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/13/06
Posts: 3
I've been coming to this site for awhile because my boyfriend of several months was sexually abused when he was young. I was reading this thread and felt the need to respond. I have really been struggling with the physical aspect of our relationship. Often when we're together, I'm left feeling like the time was a means to an end. I scratch your back and you scratch mine and then we're done. If I want us to lay in bed and kiss and hold each other, he calls me high maintenance. A lot of times he'll leave shortly after we're both "satisfied" which can feel very abrupt.

I'm okay with not having sex and not having him ever spend the night. I don't want to add to his anxiety. But I'm starting to feel like any intimacy that was there is starting to disappear. And it's difficult to talk to him about it because he gets frustrated with me and with himself. How does everyone in the equation get their needs met?


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#59815 - 02/14/06 01:08 AM Re: questions about sexual difficulties (TRIGGERS)
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
So many thoughts here .......

What Kirk said is true, masturbation is easy and we do it on our terms with no outside involvement.

Which also makes sense of what many partners have said about making love with a survivor - we perform, and roll over. Thank you and good night!

Much, or maybe all, of this comes from not having the right connections between love and sex.
What we learned as young boys was power and sex, love never entered the equation, and the sources of real love that we might have had at the time are often perceived by us to have NOT protected us from the abuse. I'm convinced that my parents didn't know anything about my abuse, but I still feel as though I wasn't protected properly at the time. The fact is I wasn't protected by anyone, but how do I reconcile the fact that some people loved me and some abused me and sex is the wedge that comes between love and abuse.
I was 'supposed' to have my first sexual experience with some girl I was madly in love with, even if it was only for a few days at 15 or 16 years old - not being beaten into submission by other boys at 11yo.

That wedge is still in place for me, I still can't place kissing, cuddling and making love in the 'loving' context, because the first two lead to the last one which is sex which is all about power.

That's also very true of the porn I have used in the past, but much less recently.
I think that most survivors are very fussy about waht they look at, I certainly had a narrow focus that was gay bj's where the giver looked as though he was submissive, and straight porn was pretty much the same, the woman was submissive.
I related to that submissive role, in my fantasy I knew how that sex act felt because I'd been there, done that.
I have said in the past that I was seeking control over the sex acts I did as a boy by doing them on my terms as an adult, but I'm not so sure now, I think I was just relating to the submissive role I was forced into as a boy.

Perhaps that's why I always had trouble when my wife started sex, or ended up in a dominant position.
But because I was ( am ? ) so conditioned to be submissive I can't do the dominant role either when it comes to sex with my wife because I don't want to put someone I love in that ( horrible ) submissive role!

I know 100% that making love is all about sharing, and there isn't a dom /sub role when it's 'right'.
But try and get that into my head!!

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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