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#57756 - 01/30/04 12:07 PM Re: question for survivors - verbal abuse
outis Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/27/03
Posts: 2260
Loc: Maryland USA
PAS,

I admire you. I hope he does come around.

Now I need to think about what things I don't see in myself.

Thanks,

Joe

_________________________
"Telemachos, your guest is no discredit to you. I wasted no time in stringing the bow, and I did not miss the mark. My strength is yet unbroken…"—The Odyssey, translated by W.H.D. Rouse

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#57757 - 01/31/04 12:27 PM Re: question for survivors - verbal abuse
lindts Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/09/03
Posts: 26
Excuse me if this sounds like a stupid question..but when a survivor says recovery is long term from when they first really start to deal with it, they are talking years not months, right? And at times, is it normal for the bad times to be almost as bad as starting at square one again on the road to recovery?
I think I need reassurance since my bf is going through a hostile time now. I guess after six months, when things got better, my heart wanted to think we were good to go, but I think my mind knew a roller coaster ride was still ahead. For some reason I'm having a hard time now, realizing that lapses (wobbles) are normal and that I need to be patient and ride it out again.


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#57758 - 01/31/04 05:31 PM Re: question for survivors - verbal abuse
kolisha54 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/02/03
Posts: 475
Loc: Brooklyn, NY
Hmmmm. This is a tough one...
For myself, I have had quite enough for now. So many of us are also survivors & sometimes it's hard to know where Love ends & where Enabling begins.

I have determined the line for myself: it is when my OWN triggers begin to trip me up so badly after being ignored & treated like a stranger that I begin to wonder if I am delusional....

We all have to figure out for ourselves how much we are prepared to accept from our SO's.

On another level, we must understand that our partners are now ADULTS! We do them no favor by condescending to them as if they are children. If we become too "parental," we will smother (or sfather for gay men ;\) ???) the most important avenue they have available to help them grow.

Sorry, Love, if this sounds harsh, but life is here to be celebrated. As partners, we have a reciprocal responsibility toward eachother. BOTH individuals must commit to the idea or the "romance" of the partnership. This is not to say that there won't be rough times, but once either one of us begins to feel frustrated to the point of having a vicarious identity crisis - it's time to think about pulling back for a good while, if not about ending the relationship.

I wish you strength!!!

_________________________
If I am not for myself, who will be for me? If I am only for myself, what am I? If not now... when? --Hillel

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#57759 - 01/31/04 10:05 PM Re: question for survivors - verbal abuse
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
PAS
Quote:
During his "remorse" session that night I did say to him "did you ever think that you are just so deeply angry at your mother?" he goes "why??" and I went "because your mother was supposed to protect and love you, and she didn't, that she does not listen to you, she really does NOT give you space, she really was never safe for you, she never taught you about love, about sex, about relationships, that she set you up to be a needy kid who sought comfort and support from someone, and then that person who formed a relationship with you took advantage of you and TOOK whatever he wanted no matter what you wanted.. you spent so many years with peopel who really didnt give two shits about your own needs or wants.. and no wonder you just feel you have to take take take and abuse abuse abuse to get them!!"
Are you talking about me and my mother here ?

Yes, this is where he's got to go - like it or not.

It's 2-00 am here, I'll finish this tomorrow

Dave :rolleyes:

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#57760 - 02/01/04 07:53 PM Re: question for survivors - verbal abuse
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
When my therapist made me go back beyond my abuse to the life I had as a small boy I wondered what the hell he was up to ?

My family didn't abuse me, so why go there ?
But it became clear, my parents - mother in particular - is the woman PAS describes here
Quote:
"because your mother was supposed to protect and love you, and she didn't,
But in my case for certain, how could she protect me ? I was at boarding school and she knew nothing.
But the slight doubt remains within me, because I didn't experience her reactions, and her protection, back then I don't KNOW what they feel like. All I can do is imagine them, and however hard I try it's not enough. And that's hard.
Unfortunately we're in no position to rectify it now either as she has dementia and wouldn't understand.

So, this also makes a lot of sense to me -
Quote:
you spent so many years with peopel who really didnt give two shits about your own needs or wants.. and no wonder you just feel you have to take take take and abuse abuse abuse to get them!!"
Even though I'm 99.999% sure that my parents would have given a shit, I haven't felt it.

But a few years back I didn't think that they gave a shit at all, so it's an improvement. For that I'm grateful.

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#57761 - 02/02/04 01:09 AM Re: question for survivors - verbal abuse
Bill_1965 Offline
Chat Mod Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/29/03
Posts: 1983
Loc: Flint, Michigan
PAS,

I have no idea what could be going through his mind; I, personally, tend to revert inside and would be more distant and quiet. I can only guess that he feels such a lack of control over his life that he is trying to regain it by taking control over yours. This is not a good thing, nor is it an excuse for doing that.

You shouldn't have to go through any abusive situation. You have absolutely no obligation to go through that. You have made him aware of what he is doing and told him to stop, yet he hasn't. You have done what you can for him, he will have to take over from there. Get yourself to a place you feel and are safe, whether it be with or without him. Maybe that will help him see what he is doing, maybe not, but it will not change until he sees it and wants to take care of it.

Take care of yourself,
Bill

_________________________
Pain is Temporary; Quitting lasts Forever. - Lance Armstrong

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#57762 - 02/02/04 10:42 AM Re: question for survivors - verbal abuse
PAS Offline
Member

Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Thanks for all your advice/support...

I guess for me I can handle the distancing, the need for him to be alone, his high needs for "self care time" and all of that, his need to reach out to other survivors, etc. etc.. but what I cannot handle is when he takes it out on me. I can handle distance, i can handle him being stand-offish, I could even handle no sex in our relationship for awhile, but I cannot handle it when he starts freaking out and cursing and swearing at me... I guess that's the line.

Have been in a chronic anxiety attack ever since it happened. I suffer for so long after every verbal attack. This time I have cried myself to sleep and awake (when I sleep that is) every time.

I know something is terribly wrong when I cannot sleep.

P


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#57763 - 02/02/04 05:31 PM Re: question for survivors - verbal abuse
crisispoint Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 2154
Loc: Massachusetts
PAS,

Again, I must reiterate what the other brothers and sisters have said - regardless of the abuse this man has gone through, he doesn't, DOESN'T, have the right to abuse you. That you are standing up to this and for yourself is to be admired.

Ya know, I'm grateful I have relatives who will slap me upside the head when I get too wrapped up in myself and tell me I'm being a grade-A jack@$$. It doens't take the responsability off of me to change, but it's nice to have the folks steering me in that direction.

You are a source of strength here, and I value that. I value you. You have such worth to us.

I hope he gets the help he needs to cope, and I hope you get the peace YOU deserve!

I love you, sister, no strings.

Scot

_________________________
There are reasons I'm taking medication. They're called "other people." - Me, displaying my anti-social tendancies

fromacuriousmind.blogspot.com
malehurtandsurvive.blogspot.com

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#57764 - 02/03/04 04:11 PM Re: question for survivors - verbal abuse
PAS Offline
Member

Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
To everyone: Thanks.

Things still not that great.. I'm still stuck in counter-wobble city. (Counter-wobble = the term given to us in our partners group for the wobble that partners start to suffer when the survivor goes on a wobble).

My fiance went away on a trip since our last fight and when he came back I let him know how much anguish and pain I have been in since he left, on account mostly of how much his verbal assault triggered my own verbal/psychological abuse history. And I told him that although I may not always appear to love myself, that if that level of verbal abuse happens again, then I don't have much choice but to end the relationship. That I have to protect myself and that I cannot proclaim to love myself and then continue to allow myself to be subject to that kind of verbal abuse.

I said it in a very non confrontational way and had tears in my eyes when I said it.. then I started crying and said "please dont make me have to make that decision.. promise me you wont yell at me like that ever again.. I love you and want this relationship, this marriage to work but you have to PROMISE me...".. and I cried.. and cried.... it hurt to be so vulnerable in front of him.

He promised.

We both cried.

He has his group therapy tonight and an appointment with his counsellor this week.

Keep your fingers crossed.

Thanks for all the support on here.

P


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#57765 - 02/03/04 08:18 PM Re: question for survivors - verbal abuse
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
PAS
I hope it goes OK, everyone needs someone to love.

Dave \:\)

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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