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#57280 - 01/08/04 11:35 AM Re: If Love wasn't enough for him.....
PAS Offline
Member

Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by Lloydy:
PAS
Can you imagine a four guys ( it's a small group, some have dropped out ) sitting with a woman therapist talking in the bluntest language possible about all this crap ?

Two of us acted out, and a few weeks ago we were sharing funny acting out stories and we were all sitting there helpless with laughing.
Actually I *can* imagine this. I just finished an 8 week session for partners of survivors and my partner is in a group session for male survivors, the lead therapist for that group (until Xmas as she has moved to another position) was female. The group here makes a point of having one female and one male therapist for each survivors and each partners group.

We had our own MAJOR fits of laughter in our own partners group. We figured as a solution to our woes, we would all pitch in to rent one apartment, and when we needed to get away from our partners we woudl go there.... we had the place all planned out: the "appropriate boundary living room" (this one would have one of those half-doors, painted in red, as if to say "STOP"), the "recipient of too much undeserved anger safe space bathroom" (full of bubble bath, a jacuzzi, etc.) and the "my partner (*&)(*& sexually acted out and I'm in serious pain kitchen" (loaded full of chocolate of course!!).

We laughed till we cried!


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#57281 - 01/08/04 12:33 PM Re: If Love wasn't enough for him.....
PAS Offline
Member

Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by April:

Lloyd, perhaps if men attached some emotion to their discussion (as women do), they would be better equipped to deal with this terrible childhood trauma? Just a thought.

Thansk again for your views.
I may be going out on a limb here responding too when Lloydy was asked (I hate when people do that so why am I doing this...) I guess one thing we as women have to keep in mind that it is scary even at the best of times for guys to "attach emotion" to a lot of things. One thing I learned in my partners group is that we are all very much "cultured" in our own genders. The SA group that both my partner and I are getting therapy though calls this the "cults" - the "cult of masculinity" and the "cult of femininity" - what this means is the fact that there are certain "rules" for men and for women, which are very different that we are taught about how to go through life, what is our expected role, appropriate behaviour for men vs. women, etc.

And the "cult of masculinity" teaches guys they are not to talk about feelings, to do so leaves them weak and vulnerable, they are to be strong, uncaring, rock solid, etc.. I just think that this leaves guys at a major disadvantage when horrible things happen to them like SA, or if someone dies, or they lose their jobs, etc.. I think that it is so much harder for guys to process it. They NEED to talk about their feelings to process this shit, but they are scared to do so.

I asked about the same thing once as my issue with my partner is all about anger/rage and him freaking out on me and I was totally confused as how he could say he loved me one day and the next he'd be ragging out on me all over the place.. and also how he could have sex with so many women before me and how could he just "turn around" and love me now.. I mean I intellectually understood the trauma but knowing his past still hurt and scared me a lot... and that I was confused as to why he couldnt just think of how I would feel when he did this and that...

..and one guy on here wrote me an email that said simply, he'd rather "stand in front of a charging bull or sit in a raging fire than talk about his emotions" about anything, let alone really painful ones that have to do with how much his SA hurt him!!

For most women (there are exceptions) we just go huh?? Talking about our feelings? About anything - PMS, Self esteem, Body Image, Health, ex boyfriends, that annoying fat roll below the belly button, being dumped, hell even gory stuff like childbirth, bikini waxes, its all open season.... not scary at all, doesnt make us feel vulnerable.. but dont forget we have a different reality of life and also a lot of practice talking about our feelings about a LOT of stuff (all those group trips to the bathroom with my girl friends in high school to talk about boys, teachers and our parents was my training ground)!!

(just FYI there ARE advantages to the cult of masculinity and there are drawbacks to the cult of femininity though but I wont go into them here!!)

P


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#57282 - 01/08/04 01:39 PM Re: If Love wasn't enough for him.....
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
I was 46yo when I started to do emotions, and I still have trouble sharing them a bit.

I still try to hide behind the macho image and keep emotions hidden. Sometimes it's because I don't want to add to my wifes troubles, other times it's my old way of thinking getting the better of me.

But I'm winning slowly !

Dave \:D

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#57283 - 01/09/04 05:57 PM Re: If Love wasn't enough for him.....
SAR Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/07/03
Posts: 3310
Loc: USA
Dave,

Quote:
Sometimes it's because I don't want to add to my wifes troubles,
Every time I hear about my boyfriend's emotions, even if what he's saying is hard and "adds" to the communal "troubles" bank, it is actually a reduction in my troubles because the fact that he wants to, and can, share his life with me now makes me happy again every time. It's better than the unidentifiable anxiety that I can sense in him when he doesn't tell me about what's going on with him. THAT adds to my troubles...

Sar


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#57284 - 01/11/04 11:50 AM Re: If Love wasn't enough for him.....
Caetel Offline
Member

Registered: 11/05/03
Posts: 322
Loc: Paris, France
I have experienced the betrayal you are talking about (see "the worse was yet to come".
I am feeling extreme sadness at the moment and as far as I can see, V. looks ashamed but stil he is not saying anything. Something broke inside of me. I don't know how to overcome this terrible feeling of betrayal.
I am asking myself a lot of questions and his silence does not help me at all. I saw him again last night in the group, uneasy, ashamed, unable to sustain a conversation (with me or other people). I left the restaurant before I started crying because I was just ovewhelmed with sadness. I have had also to deal with discovering in therapy that my mother wanted to kill me (thus leaving my father abuse me) and strangely enough I received a letter from her this week too. A typical dyfunctional letter to make me feel guilty about not caring for my parents. I am going through really heavy stuff right now and I need V's support and love more than ever.
I don't have any answers right now. I am trying to protect myself, this is all I can do.
I agree with the fact that V's silence add to my worries and I would just rather know the cause of his pain than just being left on the side of the road. I have the strength to hear the most horrible memories of his abuse but I don't have the strength to wait in the dark not knowing what's happening, whether we have a relationship or not.
Sorry if this doesn't help you and only adds more questions. I feel really helpless right now.
Love
Caro

_________________________
Mitakuye oyasin ! We are all related !

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#57285 - 01/11/04 01:09 PM Re: If Love wasn't enough for him.....
kolisha54 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/02/03
Posts: 475
Loc: Brooklyn, NY
Caro - I will send you a PM...

So many of us here are also Survivors - it's almost unusual on the Site to find Partners who have NOT been victimized themselves. The dynamic is difficult for every one of us. The feelings of helplessness in the face of watching our loved ones suffer is the same for all of us.

_________________________
If I am not for myself, who will be for me? If I am only for myself, what am I? If not now... when? --Hillel

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#57286 - 01/11/04 05:42 PM Re: If Love wasn't enough for him.....
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
SAR
I agree entirely -
Quote:
It's better than the unidentifiable anxiety that I can sense in him when he doesn't tell me about what's going on with him. THAT adds to my troubles...
All I have to do is learn HOW ! No, perhaps what I need to learn is to trust myself.....

Dave :rolleyes:

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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