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#52161 - 12/27/05 12:40 AM Re: The Twelve Steps of Insanity
shadowkid Offline
WARNING from ModTeam, September 2013: user "Shadowkid" was exposed as a hoaxer. His entire online persona and stories of sexual abuse were fiction. We encourage you not to become emotionally concerned by anything you see in any of his posts. Thank you
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/18/05
Posts: 2437
i agree with jtt ,sounds like the survivor is taking the blame .by the way i love switchfoot ,dare you to move ,dare you to move ,dare you to lift yourself up off the floor . switchfoot

_________________________
its not hard to fall
when you float like a cannonball - damien rice

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#52162 - 12/27/05 12:43 AM Re: The Twelve Steps of Insanity
johnsurvived Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/20/05
Posts: 332
Loc: Arlington, Virginia
I'm with jtt & Larry on this one. The Twelve Steps were one of the things I considered in rejecting SIA meetings in favor of a less 'programmatic' group therapy setting. (OK, not the main thing, but one of the things -- the others were that I didn't want to go into a mixed-gender group, and that as far as I know SIA meetings are run without benefit of professional therapists). I just don't get what I'm supposed to be asking my 'higher power' to do in those steps if my issue is incest (and it is).

On the other hand, I *totally* laughed myself silly over the original post at the top of the thread. Nicely composed.

John

_________________________
Take for us the foxes, the little foxes that spoil the vineyards; for our vines have tender grapes. Song of Solomon 2:15

But let justice roll down as waters, and righteousness as a mighty stream. Amos 5:24

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#52163 - 12/27/05 01:26 AM Re: The Twelve Steps of Insanity
OKIE MIKE Offline
Member

Registered: 02/13/04
Posts: 979
Loc: HULBERT OK
I NEEDED A GOOD LAUGH . THANK YOU

_________________________
MICHAEL

"I HAD NO SHOES THEN I SAW A MAN THAT HAD NO FEET"

"All I can do is be me, whoever that is"

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#52164 - 12/27/05 06:34 AM Re: The Twelve Steps of Insanity
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
My difficulty here is that I thought 12-Step programs were originally developed for problems with alcohol - cases of physical addiction in which the victim's life is controlled by his need for drink.

As jtt5254 shows, the transition from that to the case of sexual abuse isn't exactly a straight-forward one. Alcohol is a choice that one makes, and I know because I have been there. I had no power or role, on the other hand, in the decisions that resulted in my abuse as a child.

I'm afraid that for me the absolute innocence of a child is carved in stone; there's not a snowball's chance in hell of me ever returning to any thought that what happened to me was somehow my own doing and now requires that I make some kind of "moral inventory".

But again, maybe I am missing the point?

Much love,
Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#52165 - 12/27/05 12:04 PM Re: The Twelve Steps of Insanity
Lloydy Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 7071
Loc: England Shropshire
Wuamei was, maybe still is, a preacher of some kind, I can't remember what faith anymore, that's probably why there's a religious element to it.

He also battled with alcohol and other problems.

Dave

_________________________
Go confidently in the direction of your dreams! Live the life you've imagined. As you simplify your life, the laws of the universe will be simpler.
Henry David Thoreau

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#52166 - 12/27/05 01:01 PM Re: The Twelve Steps of Insanity
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6838
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
I am glad you brought this topic out of archive.
This guy wrote some powerful stuff, and it makes me wonder where he went,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#52167 - 12/27/05 02:26 PM Re: The Twelve Steps of Insanity
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
It looks like he left well before I arrived here, and he certainly seems to have been very active. It makes you wonder when someone disappears like that.

Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#52168 - 12/27/05 05:10 PM Re: The Twelve Steps of Insanity
Rustam Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/27/04
Posts: 469
Loc: UK
I did attend an SIA group, it is separate from I.S.A, and it can be a very good resource for survivors. I wasn’t at all into the Higher Power etc but it was a good place to meet other survivors for mutual support. The SIA steps are better, but there is no belief in either organisation that a child is in any way to blame. The moral inventory is about being honest with ourselves in our recovery as I understand it.


1. We admitted we were powerless over the abuse, the effects of the abuse and that our lives had become unmanageable.

2. Came to believe that a loving Higher Power, greater than ourselves, could restore hope, healing and sanity.

3. Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of a loving Higher Power, as we understood Her/Him.

4. Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves, the abuse, and its effects on our lives. We have no more secrets.

5. Admitted to a loving Higher Power, to ourselves, and to another human being our strengths and weaknesses.

6. Were entirely ready to have a loving Higher Power help us remove all the debilitating consequences of the abuse and became willing to treat ourselves with respect, compassion and acceptance.

7. Humbly and honestly asked a loving Higher Power to remove the unhealthy and self-defeating consequences stemming from the abuse.

8. Made a list of all the people we may have harmed (of our own free will), especially ourselves and our inner child(ren), and became willing to make amends to them all.

9. Made amends to such persons wherever possible, except when to do so would result in physical, mental, emotional or spiritual harm to ourselves or others.

10. Continued to take responsibility for our own recovery and when we found ourselves behaving in patterns still dictated by the abuse, promptly admitted it. When we succeeded, we promptly enjoy it.

11. Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with a loving Higher Power as we understood Her/Him, asking only for knowledge of Her/His will for us and the power to carry that out.

12. Having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to other survivors and to practice these principles in all our endeavors.


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#52169 - 12/28/05 07:13 AM Re: The Twelve Steps of Insanity
Muldoon Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/30/02
Posts: 1428
Loc: St Paul MN
Victor was one of the guys here every day for a long time. Victor got into a big fire fight with other here back in 2003 and left very agree.

I had hoped that he had come back when I saw his post. Tom

_________________________
Teach the Children to Never Hide in the Silence

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#52170 - 12/28/05 09:32 PM Re: The Twelve Steps of Insanity
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Rustam,

Thanks for the clarifications, but I still have trouble with this. To me it looks too much like an effort to simply repot the 12-Step approach to alcoholism as an approach to abuse issues. I don't see anything, for example, about the crucial importance of the survivor knowing that the abuse was in no way his fault. Instead, there is repeated implicit stress on something that comes very close to being guilt on the survivor's part.

I am not spoiling for a quarrel here, I just really don't see - sorry for being blunt - how anyone would fall for this. But as I have said already, perhaps I just don't understand what is being said here.

Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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