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#445690 - 08/28/13 09:19 AM Politics and CHILD Porn
Still Offline
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Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6571
Loc: Never Sugar Mountain


The very liberal Department of Education, as well as poli-influenced unions throughout the nation, have devised a schematic for a base-line of educational expectations. It effectively is an attempt to pander to the Least-Common Denominator of the nation's students by pulling the minimum performance expectations down into sub-terrain levels.

The Common Core Curriculum is here and expanding. I will be working to kill it at every possible opportunity. <edit>

EXAMPLE: Though she is very racist, Toni Morrison has ALWAYS been one of my favorite poets and authors. No longer! If it were up to me, I'd burn her books in every town square!

[size:14pt](WARNING: Grap...icks


Edited by Still (08/28/13 12:44 PM)
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#445702 - 08/28/13 10:56 AM Re: Politics and CHILD Porn [Re: Still]
Jacob S Offline
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MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/01/13
Posts: 613
Loc: where the shadows lie
From a teacher who has taught the book:

"what most affected me that first semester of teaching this novel was when a student came up to me after class towards the end of the unit and said, “Miss, thank you. My father did that to me.” She was thanking me for not pinning shame and blame on the girl who was abused and raped. She’d never heard the topic discussed openly and honestly before. She’d always blamed herself. From then on, I knew I’d fight to keep teaching The Bluest Eye. From then on, I knew it deserved, needed, must be taught."

http://mutterschwester.wordpress.com/2013/08/25/in-defense-of-the-bluest-eye/
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#445703 - 08/28/13 11:05 AM Re: Politics and CHILD Porn [Re: Still]
SoccerStar Offline
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Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 916
Loc: New York
Even if it was consenting adult behavior, those descriptions are far too graphic and prurient for high school curriculum. The psychology experiment of having kids feel like accomplices will not work; didn't this lady ever see "The Wave," about the successful experimental Nazification of a high school?

I'm used to sneering at people who protest school assignments like "One Fat Summer" (one short and metaphorical masturbation scene in a book about teenaged male loneliness and body image issues) or "Bastard out of Carolina" (a horror show meant to introduce kids to what incest is really like and why the secret is kept).... but even "Bastard" isn't as biologically graphic as "Bluest Eye," and it always spotlights how evil the perps are.

This is a mistake and should be removed from the curriculum.
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#445705 - 08/28/13 11:18 AM Re: Politics and CHILD Porn [Re: SoccerStar]
Jacob S Offline
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Registered: 01/01/13
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Well I think we can at least agree that well-meaning people can come to different opinions on this book. The implication that the book should be burned and that the real motive behind teaching it is to promote perversion are conclusions that need not be drawn.


Edited by Jacob S (08/28/13 11:19 AM)
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#445710 - 08/28/13 12:07 PM Re: Politics and CHILD Porn [Re: Still]
SoccerStar Offline
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Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 916
Loc: New York

I would also point out that it is unfair to ascribe malicious motive to those behind this, let alone to expand that malicious motive out to include many users here ("left-wingers"). Everyone here wants what is best for kids, and it creates an atmosphere better for sustaining trust and safety by granting other users the benefit of the doubt regardless of their political or religious affiliations.

Having been a teacher and curriculum designer, I am comfortable in concluding that the Dept. of Education and school officials at all levels are legitimately trying to help kids, albeit in this case with perhaps not the best tool. You will find nearly identical objections to "Bastard out of Carolina," and since the author was a rape survivor she of all people wasn't trying to "have her way with sick sexual stuff."


Matt
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#445711 - 08/28/13 12:16 PM Re: Politics and CHILD Porn [Re: Still]
Magellan Offline
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Registered: 12/31/10
Posts: 1428
Loc: California
Yes, it IS graphic, and I am also a little bit shocked by the words.

I remember reading Ragtime (an American classic) in high school; and there's a scene where the character is hiding in a woman's closet, unbeknownst to her, and he starts jacking off when she undresses. I won't go any further in describing the scene other than to say it had a remarkable and measurable effect on me. I'd never forgotten how surprised I was to read those words and imagine what I imagined while reading. I was shocked, and a little bit embarrassed while reading it.

In hindsight, I'm very very glad that I did. Reading that was the first ever description of another guy jerking off I ever came across. I had no one else to talk to about my emerging sexuality; I was scared, lonely, frightened and horrendously ashamed of myself.

Reading that felt like it unlocked something in me, released me from an isolated prison of fear because of ignorance and shame. Reading that did make me lose my innocence a bit - but in a good way. They were just words and it was only my own imagination.

When I realized that OTHERS were reading the same words in class and having their own experiences and reactions, I realized that I shared a sexuality with the human race. I wasn't alone, and I didn't have to be ashamed and feeling like the devil's poop.

So yeah, I agree with both sides. I'm also shocked by the words, but I'm reminded by my own reaction when I came across something like that in my naivete. And am immensely glad that I was exposed to it. It released me from my own occluded thinking.

As a 41 year old man, I acknowledge that times have changed, culture has changed. I'm of the age where I think the kids music stinks these days. But every generation goes through this distaste and disgust. Remember when rock and roll was of the devil? Or when the blues represented the decay of civilization?

We'll be shocked. But our kids live in a very different world than we lived in. The human species is evolving blisteringly fast - its a cultural and conscious evolution. And its unstoppable.

I just hope that more people like myself, gain insight about their own emerging sexuality by reading books like this (and Ragtime -an American classic). because it was a VERY good thing for me.



Edited by Magellan (08/28/13 12:35 PM)
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#445717 - 08/28/13 01:04 PM Re: Politics and CHILD Porn [Re: Still]
Still Offline
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Registered: 02/16/07
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Loc: Never Sugar Mountain
I worry greatly about content like this being twisted and leveraged into an example of normalcy and license in order to groom a child.

I'll be interested to see how the parents of the nation and teachers react. But I'm more interested in teachers et al who leverage the content for their CSA goals.
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#445719 - 08/28/13 01:10 PM Re: Politics and CHILD Porn [Re: Still]
Magellan Offline
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Registered: 12/31/10
Posts: 1428
Loc: California
I'd be interested in finding out the context of the book (the story), rather than focusing sharply on some of the graphic text. The book isn't ONLY that graphic language. I'm assuming that it is also a book about self discovery, expression, relating to others, and it sounds like it contains portrayals of abuse as well.

In *that* context, I think it would make it rather difficult for a perpetrator to use the book as a potential leverage to get at one of their students (if that's what you're concerned about). The very fact that the book so openly describes abusive patterns and describes some of the thoughts of perpetrators in the book is rather empowering for the reader - they are taught how to recognize grooming patterns by reading it.

Did you read the linked article that contained all the graphic language? There's mention of a conversation in the book where a perp describes why they're drawn to little girls.

Shocking, but educational. And hence, why it is recommended reading curric. They might be trying to do the very same thing you are. Teaching the younger ones how to identify perpetrators before they become victims.
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#445727 - 08/28/13 01:36 PM Re: Politics and CHILD Porn [Re: Still]
Still Offline
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Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6571
Loc: Never Sugar Mountain
Right. But let me clarify some of the red-lines in the sand:

If I were King for a Day, after eating all the chocolate and lobster in the world, I would not bar Toni M from publishing the book. Her First Amendment rights are without qualifiers!

But for a government and labor union to push this as a "book of focus" for MINOR children, is wrong, wrong, wrong! I cannot find ANY literary or educational reason for an officially and publicly endorsed work like this for school-children under public purview and charge.

I offer public burning of such books as a demonstration of complete rejection of the book's role in children's lives.

The culture that affords pedos-n-perps power to more-easily claim their prey is ever shifting in their favor. Seriously here people! I don't see ANY cultural shifts in telling perps "NO FKG WAY PAL" or telling parents to "get your head outta yer ass and pay attention" or hey children....watch-out for these turds."

All I see is incrementalism in accommodating the perps' path. Show me ONE book of Common Core blessing that sends the perps to an eternity in Hell, or children how fkd-up some adults are, or "What's Wrong With Jimmy," or "Mr Jones Sure Like Me!"
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#445728 - 08/28/13 01:41 PM Re: Politics and CHILD Porn [Re: Still]
Magellan Offline
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MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/31/10
Posts: 1428
Loc: California
We'll just have to agree to disagree.

I think its a GREAT thing. As I said before - the book contains what seems to be markers of perpetrators, so that youngsters can identify them before becoming victims. I value the context of the story above the snippets of graphic writing.

This is based on my personal experience reading an American classic novel which also contains VERY graphic language. That was a good thing for me to experience.

And likewise, I think its a great thing for youngsters to read as well. 11th grade is about 16-18 years old - hardly "children". They're teenagers, horny, insecure teenagers.

So, I disagree with your stance, and I invite you to actually read the book yourself to find out the context and context of the writing. You might be surprised.
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