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#428075 - 03/14/13 09:01 PM Re: Question for the guys...... [Re: sugarbaby]
DavoSwim Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/06/13
Posts: 301
Loc: Iowa, USA
@ThisMan - Thank you for your opinion. I hadn't looked at it like that. I just thought that because it felt good, and I reacted physiologically it had to mean something and that something was I was gay. I wish someone had said that a physiological reaction is in no way related to sexual orientation. Thanks Dave

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#428094 - 03/14/13 11:47 PM Re: Question for the guys...... [Re: sugarbaby]
KMCINVA Offline
Greeter
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 1433
I think the times in the 1960's were so different than today. At least my life, lived in a community of immigrants or 1st generation Irish and Italian and the Wasp's which generally did not move in our circles. The church was the center of life--school, parent social activities, children activities, and the priest and nuns were revered beyond all others. They were part of our life. We feared, respected and loved them. What they said from the pulpit was God's word. So when in the cellar he spoke we bowed and said we said yes. I was a silent compliant child. So when he said I would be taken away if I told because my parents would not believe me (and I did not want to know otherwise that they did would not believe me). So how could I tell----today I still believe I did it so I could stay with my family and not be taken away as he told me--the police would not believe me and take me away and my parents would believe I was an ungrateful son. I was around 10/11---could I have done differently. Some say I was old enough to defend myself but I did not--so am I the guilty one. I do not want to believe I allowed it to happen but maybe I let it happened. It was not my parents that denied it, it was me.


Edited by KMCINVA (03/14/13 11:47 PM)

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#428095 - 03/14/13 11:48 PM Re: Question for the guys...... [Re: whome]
Candu Offline


Registered: 06/30/12
Posts: 312
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: whome
Simple
Parents that cared enough to notice that the once outgoing young boy became a recluse and never had any friends. Cared enough to talk to me and find out what was wrong, and told me that it was ok, that they loved me and wanted to fix things.s
MMM parents that were not so preocupied with their own lives and their own crap.
Fairly simple I would think

Martin


My youngest niece was sexually abused by the father of one of her girlfriends that had a sleepover. My sister noticed something wrong the next day when her daugter got home. And she asked, and found out. She confronted the perp who turned himself in to the police. She supported and got help for my niece. All the way it should be when something like this happens.

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#428097 - 03/15/13 12:08 AM Re: Question for the guys...... [Re: sugarbaby]
pufferfish Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/08
Posts: 6712
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sugarbaby
If you kept your abuse a secret. What would have helped you to pursue treatment/seeking help at different developmental points?

What would have helped:

Prior to age 10?

from 10 - 15?

from 15 - 20?

from 20 - 30?

from 30 - 40?

etc....

Think about it. What would have/could have/might have pulled you out of the soul crushing weight of silence? Where could the process have started?

I'm curious because for me, being female, I have options. I have a local abuse place, OB/GYNs ask about it as standard practice, there are hotline posters on restroom walls.

I don't see this type of support for the guys....for the teen boys who are struggling.....or for the little guys.... and to be quite honest it pisses me off.

The best connection for males and help that I can think of is doctors. My son saw his Dr a little while back and they talked to him about sex in general(he is 16). BUT not abuse. Why? Probably because they don't know that they are (IMHO) probably the best possible link for male victims and help. OB/GYNs obviously know this so I looked at the Amer. Med. Assoc. web site for a while but I didn't find much about specific policy.

Since I am a Nursing student (career change) I have Physician professors. I'd like to bring it up to them and ask about policy but I need to know the consensus about what would be helpful. Maybe I am totally off base with the Dr link.

Tell me what you think and ask other guys on here to also tell me.



That's a good question.

I was abused at a bunch of ages. At a very young age I had no capacity to separate what happened to me (csa) from the normal routines of life. If for example, at age 7, you had been abused for half of your brief life, how would you know how to see the abuse as something out of the ordinary.

So, young children have to be helped to understand the context of the abuse and why it was not a good thing. They have to be encouraged by wise counseling to understand and express anger. They don't have words for it, and so they must even be given the vocabulary. They could use dolls and stuff to act it out. That sounds good.

I have been told that I was very outgoing before abuse at a young age. Then I became very quiet. I was very much like the boy described in the book: Dibs In Search of Self. In my case a kind grandmother and 2nd grade teacher helped me a lot.

When I was horrifically abused at age 12, I had a number of symptoms, including social impairment, and communication impairment. These got worse and worse until I received counseling when I was 15. Even though the counselors didn't know what to say to me then, it somehow relieved the pressure and I started improving.

A book I've been reading, Psychological Trauma and the Developing Brain, by Stein, talks about how young children who receive abuse must be given positive training in overcoming the social problems resulting from abuse. This book makes a lot of sense to me. It describes what I had as complex PTSD with a lot of effects.

http://www.amazon.com/Psychological-Trauma-Developing-Brain-Neurologically/dp/0789017881/

Puffer



Edited by pufferfish (03/15/13 12:21 AM)

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#428112 - 03/15/13 02:02 AM Re: Question for the guys...... [Re: DavoSwim]
crazy gecko Offline


Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 309
Originally Posted By: DavoSwim
I wish someone had said that a physiological reaction is in no way related to sexual orientation. Thanks Dave

This is exactly what I meant when I said I wished someone could have explained my body's reaction to me...

If someone only explained to me that the body is programmed to respond to physical stimulation, I would not have lived half my childhood thinking that 1) I was gay*, and 2) I enjoyed/wanted to be abused. It would have seriously diminished the amount of shame and guilt I felt.

* Please don't see this as a homophobic statement. This is simply about the fear and confusion of a young (straight) boy growing up in an extremely homophobic society...
_________________________
I guess what I'm trying to say
Is whose life is it anyway because livin'
Living is the best revenge
You can play
-- Def Leppard

My Story, Part 2

My blog

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#428191 - 03/15/13 09:38 PM Re: Question for the guys...... [Re: sugarbaby]
ThisMan Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/22/13
Posts: 758
Loc: upper south
Davo, C G-

I understand completely what you say and felt the same sexual confusion growing up. Am I ? Am I not ? -use either gay or straight or bi... all of us have had the question. Actually thought it was settled until I found myself single at 46.

Appreciate you, guys.
_________________________
For now we see through a glass, darkly.



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#430813 - 04/10/13 10:45 PM Re: Question for the guys...... [Re: sugarbaby]
sugarbaby Offline


Registered: 08/17/08
Posts: 306
Wow! Thank you for all the responses! I will have to come back to read them more thoroughly. It's late and I just popped in to see what was going on on the F&F board.

My 'mission' .....even when I don't express it clearly.....is to make the societal conversation about the abuse of males the same as it is for women.

I have choices my H did not .....well he DID but they were not nearly as front and center.

ABUSE is ABUSE is ABUSE.....it makes no difference who the victim is.

FYI - I skip over parents and teachers for many reasons but mainly:
- parents, in some cases like with H, need education
- teachers/administrators are in a work culture that hides perps and to me a culture like that is a perp unto itself

More at a later date........


Edited by sugarbaby (04/10/13 10:50 PM)

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#430846 - 04/11/13 03:11 AM " [Re: sugarbaby]
lbcali1978 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/12
Posts: 217
"


Edited by lbcali1978 (04/29/13 12:02 AM)
_________________________
They said

Come home

I said

I'm confused and alone

They said

We understand

I found out they don't

I'll walk the path exactly how I've always done it

Alone

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#431938 - 04/21/13 11:04 AM Re: Question for the guys...... [Re: sugarbaby]
dark empathy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 1866
Loc: durham, north england
Hi.

I'm afraid reading this topic, I find the confidence in "education in school" really worrying. i understand that for people (of both genders), who were abused at home, school was a haven and the thought of education there or seeing a counseller was a good one, I'm sorry to say however that is not the case.

In my school, the teachers were so afraid the school was threatened with closure, they contributed to the bullying that turned into full on gang rape by essentially paying no attention, indeed I was frequently told it was my fault and "they are a very nice year" as for s/x education, well since i have just had lunch I will not describe some of the s/xual humiliations that I experienced in those classes when the teacher gave all the pupils leaflets to read then walked out of the room.

the problem with giving the power to teachers and educators is they have too much vested interest, even when they are not actually perpetrators themselves, there are still too many teachers who just see schools as a factory and just walk in and out of work each day not giving a dam about the kids, or worse, what the kids do to each other.

just as Obi said, the first thing is to educate people that boys can! be the victims of abuse (especially boys themselves). Particularly in terms of abuse by other kids, including that much protected group in our society, teenaged girls. Abusers are not all creepy old men in parks, and the sooner that is understood, the better.

another key point as well as the point of keeping silent, is people's understanding that "rape" doesn't just mean the legal deffinition. I never used the word to describe my experiences, indeed I found bullying hard enough to mention. Even though I was extremely close to my parents and still am, actually talking about what had been done to me at school was just inconceivable since it was so alien as to be in another language. For example, i remember when I was 14 mentioning that a girl at school said she liked me. My mum loved this, and asked me many questions about her, did I like her etc. I couldn't have explained to my mum at that point what! said girl had been doing at the time, it just would've been clearly wrong.

doctors might be a good point for this, though equally there is the problem that you only see the doctor when your ill. Myself, i'd love to see a formal contact system for men. After all, if a girl had been gang raped at school, she could always go to a center, talk to a medical professional etc, not to mention the fact the school would likely have a major investigation on their hands. not so boys unfortunately.

Another thing that would've helped me in my late teens to early twenties, was some relationship advice. One of the biggest and most irritating things about being male is the expectations about finding relationships. I gave it time, I waited, and nothing happened, and still I found my genophobia so much at odds with those around me. i wouldn't make s/xual jokes, i'd become embarrassed, I'd dislike touch, and this felt alien, wrong, completely out of context. Even though my friends were not the sort of men who talked about relationships in crude terms, I still couldn't shake the feeling there was something wrong with me, and the universal "give it time" attitude didn't help.

if a woman showed such genophobia, society cuts her a break, indeed I remember one of the old James bond books in which one of the girls has similar symtoms that Bond is understanding over, but because she is a woman he sees it as acceptable, and the relationship works because he! is prepared to go at her pace.

not so a man with genophobia, your seen as outdated and weerd, or having some ridiculous religious prejudice or other, and often people (especially women actually), see this as a situation for mockery.

Again, I have no idea what would help hear, other than perhaps an understanding professional of some sort. it took a severe shock, unrequited love and a lot of pain to force me to deal with my abuse at 25, and I'm still doing it five years later, but I wouldn't recommend that method to anyone.

Luke.

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#431940 - 04/21/13 11:48 AM Re: Question for the guys...... [Re: sugarbaby]
Lancer Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/13/12
Posts: 901
Loc: Florida
Originally Posted By: sugarbaby
FYI - I skip over parents and teachers for many reasons but mainly:
- parents, in some cases like with H, need education
- teachers/administrators are in a work culture that hides perps and to me a culture like that is a perp unto itself


Haven't been on this thread in a while, but I'm glad you brought up the work culture. Particularly interesting - and discouraging - you've found it prevalent 40 years after my high school CSA.

The understanding I've achieved is that, like the CSA, much of it was about power. The perp had been one of the charter teachers and eventually became the head of the guidance dept. No underling would challenge his "activities" until it became so indiscreet and outrageous they had no choice but to fire him.

But, in that culture, there was no follow up with his victims. It was more like relief they could finally sweep it under the rug.

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