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#430519 - 04/08/13 01:12 PM MIND ISSUES - Part Two
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
I am cracking up with laughter to keep from getting mad.

In a conversation with my mom last night, she was REALLY trying to figure out "what it would take to make me heal from this".

Here is the comment that got me .... BRACE YOURSELF!

"I guess it would have been easier if you had gotten an apology letter from your uncle like the one your sister got. She says it really helped her to move on and let go."

WAIT...SHE GOT A LETTER AND AN APOLOGY FROM THE SAME DUDE WHO SENT AN E-MAIL TO THE ENTIRE FAMILY CALLING ME A LIAR WHO IS EVIL AND DEMONIC! WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!

When I asked "what letter", mama said "maybe I shouldn't have told you that..."

Yep....laughing the day away. Woo-sah.

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#430527 - 04/08/13 02:36 PM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
lapchinj Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/07/11
Posts: 1250
Loc: New York
Hey 4life,

My parents don't know of my 9 years of abuse but both my father and mother suck and my mother is the bitch of the family. I am an only child so my mother could not say something like that but you would always use the same tactic that yours did to you to just upset me. She would say something and then back off by saying maybe I shouldn't have told you that. It's easier than physically slapping you in the face. Not only that she would always say something embarrassing and in front of people or within earshot of them. And when I would make a remark she would apologize to me but she already told everyone in the room so the I'm sorry shit really doesn't work.

Sound like she doesn't give 2 shits about you and your issues. She is using the abuse by your uncle to get her jollies.

Peace, Rainbows, Love & Healing
<3 XOXO
Jeff
_________________________
Stick around, It will get better....

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#430528 - 04/08/13 02:46 PM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
Farmer Boy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/23/12
Posts: 442
Loc: Australia
Wow

Overcomer I am so sorry. You deserved better then and you deserve better now.

I'm sorry but I'm not laughing.

I guess it highlights the way society still doesn't accept that this stuff can happen to boys and affect them as much as girls.

Boys will be boys.... (NOT)

Take care of yourself man.

Lee
_________________________
More than meets the eye!

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#430535 - 04/08/13 03:53 PM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
Thanks. This twist of events just confirms my decision to not go to the funeral. I'd rather not be around any of that.

Now what I'll do in the midst????? Well, that we'll have to think about really hard...because if I said that there was no void for some level of affection, I'd be lying through my teeth. I withheld this weekend...not sure how much longer I can or will. We'll see.

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#430559 - 04/08/13 07:52 PM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
bodyguard8367 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/16/12
Posts: 1159
Loc: ""
""


Edited by bodyguard8367 (02/26/14 10:44 PM)

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#430575 - 04/08/13 10:07 PM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
csasurvivor1992 Offline


Registered: 03/25/13
Posts: 132
Loc: Texas
Overcomer, I am sorry to hear that you are experiencing that kind of response. It's sad. I understand your need to suppress anger with laughter as you are in disbelief.

Thank you for sharing this. It helps puts my own family's messed up response in context. My mom and sister still talk to the asshole who abused me. I'm like, seriously?! My sister lets him around her kids!

I'm fully invested in therapy and recovery. I'm telling people at work, my friends, and now I want to tell my family. All I get in response is, no. You'll hurt them, they're dealing with their own stuff. REALLY NOW?! I DON'T GIVE TWO FLYING FUCKS! It's time for ME to get some damn love. I didn't ask for this and it is not ME bringing them anything. There is blame to be had, but it's not mine.

My T explained to me cognitive distortions... I am altering their firmly held beliefs. They may think one thing about my abuser and I am turning it on its head. Same thing with my family.

It's sad, but the people in our lives, especially those closest to us and those who hurt us, just don't have enough experience, context, or understanding to help us through this. Compassion only goes so far. I've learned to temper what I can expect from them. It has helped me tremendously.

I still ask if my mom is ready to tell family yet or if she's working on it... she's working on it, still. But I am not relenting. There is a balance and I am working on it.
_________________________
May your past be the sound of your feet upon the ground, carry on. ~Fun.

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#430590 - 04/09/13 01:06 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
genedebs Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/09/12
Posts: 288
Loc: MO
Dear 4Life

I am sorry for you loss and continued betrayal by your mother. I do not know how important family is in your life. If it isn't a big deal, then the suggestion by bodyguard to get what you need elsewhere is excellent.

If family is important I will share with you what my rabbi said.

"To care for them as they never cared for you is the highest form of revenge, and a mitzvot (a good and Godly act) to boot.

It is a horror, that we live where there is constant betrayal and violations. And then, we are confronted with expectations of "get over it." So they can absolve themselves.

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#430600 - 04/09/13 01:48 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: csasurvivor1992]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
LOL! Thanks!!! You reached right into my brain and pulled out words that I wouldn't have been strong enough to say!!! WHO GIVES TWO FLYING....YES!!!! That's exactly how I feel about trying to make someone else feel "at ease" while I live in emotional hell and turmoil. YOU HIT IT ON THE HEAD!!!!

Whew....thanks! I needed that!


Edited by overcomer4life (04/10/13 11:55 AM)

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#430601 - 04/09/13 01:52 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: genedebs]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
The "nice dude" in me believes strongly in "loving the HELL out of people by doing what they would never expect".

In THIS case (going to the funeral and being in the same room with my first 3 pervs)...hmmmmm....I think that one surpasses my threshold. LOL! Not ready to do that just yet.

The entire situation is funny to me because I've been the PERFECT employee at work. One person at my job (who is also a close friend) knows what's going on and he told me "boy...you are GOOD" because with all I'm going through emotionally, it does not show ONE BIT!

I should be in Hollywood.

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#430602 - 04/09/13 01:54 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: bodyguard8367]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
Geoff where have you been all of my life? LOL! Are you my T and maybe we just don't know it yet???

You have a way of saying things that really gets through to me. I appreciate you.

"A choice rather than a necessity..." YOU SAID A MOUTHFUL! Thanks!

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#430625 - 04/09/13 08:54 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
lapchinj Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/07/11
Posts: 1250
Loc: New York
Hey 4life,

I'm sorry I didn't read part 1 which cleared up a lot of what you're going through.

Genedebs - This is one reason I cannot believe in religion and why god was left in bed with the johns. People will alway bring up that our religion, and any religion for that matter, tells us to forgive is like you say a mitzvoh. What I say to that is "bullshit". If someone didn't have the decency to acknowledge that anything even happened it's not even worth pissing on their grave. I left my parents when I was 12 (I am 62 now). I felt bad for them 6 years ago because of their failing health. So I built and extension to my house for an apartment for them and moved them up to NY from FL five years ago.My mother is the same ways as when I was 12. It was one of the worst things that happened in my life. I have to relive my childhood every day, the childhood that I had run away from. She has never changed and she never will.

That goes the same for 4life. I'm stuck with my parents who are 98 and 93. 4life or anyone else should not have to go through that or go to any funerals that will put him in contact with his abusers. He has a life and it doesn't include anything that will put him in an uncomfortable position. Fuck'm!!!

I will not make comments about anyone's religion and especially if they are religious people, I respect them even though I don't agree with them always. But I think that 4life has a choice and that choice shouldn't cause any more grief by pulling the forgive and forget card on him with some religion.

My parents never knew what happened to me since the age of 9 till 18 so I cannot feel the pain 4life is going through but me personally would not show up for any of their funerals. Like bodyguard said that at this point it should be a choice and not a necessity especially for csa non-believers.

I will go to my mother's funeral just to watch them bury someone who has tormented me and my family. I will ask them to dig the grave an extra foot down just to make sure that she is finally out of my life. I will watch every shovel of dirt thrown on her box and say amen smile. I always said that I would piss on her grave but I don't think I have the balls to do that frown.

4life - Do not go to the funeral, they all don't deserve your presence especially the one in the hole mad.

good luck

Peace, Rainbows, Love & Healing
Jeff
_________________________
Stick around, It will get better....

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#430632 - 04/09/13 09:53 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
Thanks Jeff! Somebody understands how I feel. That means a LOT!

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#430661 - 04/09/13 05:32 PM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
The single most profound movie line ever written...

"...and all the while, I feel I'm standing in the middle of a crowded room screaming at the top of my lungs, and no one even looks up." (-Rose in the movie "Titanic")

*whew*

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#430677 - 04/09/13 08:19 PM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
lapchinj Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/07/11
Posts: 1250
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: overcomer4life
The single most profound movie line ever written...

"...and all the while, I feel I'm standing in the middle of a crowded room screaming at the top of my lungs, and no one even looks up." (-Rose in the movie "Titanic")

*whew*


That's because they think of you as a none entity, you don't matter to them, etc., that's why they treat you like this. Not believing you is one thing but calling you a liar is totally different, it means that that you don't exist in their world. When my mother would call me a liar (even today) it hurt more than when she beat me. If someone says they don't believe you there is a chance that you can show them that your telling them the truth. If you are a liar no matter what you say you will never convince them otherwise.

Your sister is in the same position as me. She knows how you feel but is afraid to break away. I don't know why. I guess I'm also afraid to tell them all to go to hell and get out of my life. This is the chance you need to make that break and not live a tortured life. By you not going to the funeral you are making a statement that what goes around comes around. If something changes in the future then you can assess the situation.

I will tell you what my T told me when we talked about bringing my parents up to me. He said simply "you thought she would change?". Maybe I was hoping she had changed but I found out that after not being with them for 48 years they have not changed at all and I'm being tortured once more. My T says that I'm afraid to stand up to her.

She called you a liar? Then piss on her grave, but come after the funeral is over when people are leaving. Those people will never change. I am proof of that and I know others in the same boat. I can't see you being tortured for life. At least I had 48 years of sanity and freedom but I forgot how I was treated and fucked up by bringing my parents up here. Nothing but nothing at all has changed. I am that young child again being yelled at, screamed at, being called a liar, worthless and I didn't amount to anything. And now my family, my kids and their families are going through the same thing with me.

You are a liar to them, you don't exist. You are not worthy of even being not believed.

I'm sorry that I'm so biased on this subject but I fucked up, don't make the same mistake as me.

I wish you all the luck and magic in the world to heal.

Peace, Rainbows, Love & Healing
Jeff
_________________________
Stick around, It will get better....

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#430706 - 04/10/13 12:33 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
I appreciate those words more than you know!

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#430713 - 04/10/13 01:38 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
lapchinj Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/07/11
Posts: 1250
Loc: New York
It makes me feel really good knowing that I can do something to help someone.

Thanks for the kind words.

Peace, Rainbows, Love & Healing
Jeff
_________________________
Stick around, It will get better....

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#430715 - 04/10/13 02:11 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
peroperic2009 Offline
Moderator
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/09/11
Posts: 3621
Loc: South-East Europe
It feels sooo good seeing you guys sharing peace, rainbows, love, healing and helping each other wink

Hang on overcomer4life, and don't give up your stance to their tries. You know how much you were hurt and you didn't get support. Denial is many time used by families which don't live in realities, it is toxic and beyond words hurtful for children raised in such families.
Sending my hugs!

Pero
_________________________
My story

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#430719 - 04/10/13 03:49 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
crazy gecko Offline


Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 309
OC4L - I've started several replies to this thread, but I always end up deleting it.

I didn't go to my father's funeral. When my aunt told me he had died, I was surprised that he had still been alive until a few days before. I told her I'd come if I can tell everyone exactly who and what he was. I ended up not going, and my aunt still hasn't spoken to me again.

Quite frankly, I don't miss her. The only members of my family I have contact with is my brother, and for the last few months my cousin, who is also a survivor (he was molested by my father). I've been much happier since I've stopped trying to win over my family or convince them that it's true that my father abused us. It's not as if they ever were a real family. I get support elsewhere.

Originally Posted By: overcomer4life
The single most profound movie line ever written...

"...and all the while, I feel I'm standing in the middle of a crowded room screaming at the top of my lungs, and no one even looks up." (-Rose in the movie "Titanic")

*whew*

whew indeed. That was me as a kid, a teenager, a young man. Until I gave up and decided to spend my time with people who WOULD look up if I screamed.

Walk out of that room. The only thing you will find in there, is more hurt. They will probably never respect you. You deserve better than that. Respect yourself enough to not expose yourself to their toxicity. And if they get hurt, or angry, well, then that is their problem. They brought it on themselves with they way they treated you. You don't have to be loyal to someone just because you share some genes. "Family" is about so much more than biology...
_________________________
I guess what I'm trying to say
Is whose life is it anyway because livin'
Living is the best revenge
You can play
-- Def Leppard

My Story, Part 2

My blog

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#430738 - 04/10/13 09:12 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: crazy gecko]
KMCINVA Offline
Greeter
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 1790
I am sorry your father abused you, but I am happy you have found peace even though it separates you from your family. I understand your reasons, I was not abused by a family member but the reaction and treatment once they learned of the abuse has been hurtful and dismissive. I am at a point, I will love them. Like the abuser I have let their treatment effect me as a person and how I view myself, very similar to how I let my abuser control me all these years. I think once abused we have a tendency to let others treat us poorly. Only once we free ourselves of their selfish actions can we truly be free to love ourselves. The abuser is difficult to deal with but family members who act the like the abuser, (but do not sexually abuse us) only serve to reinforce the pain and harm the abuser did to us.

I am glad you found the courage to free yourself from a family so in denial. You deserve the life you have found--you earned the right to feel whole. Good luck.

Kevin

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#430741 - 04/10/13 09:52 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
"Family" is about so much more than biology...

YOU SAID A MOUTHFUL AND I ALMOST SCREAMED IN THIS OFFICE!!!!

Today, it feels as if you guys are in the office with me guarding me against what would surely be a disaster. I appreciate it SO MUCH!!!

The visitation is this evening and the funeral is tomorrow.

I can't lie....about 20% of me feels like the "bad grandson" or the "tainted black sheep" for not going to either. As much as my dad is in denial and disbelief about what happened, that 20% feels a bit uneasy about not being there for him at the time of his mother's death.

The other 80% keeps asking the 20%, "when are you going to realize that at some point you have to stop doing what will make everyone else happy and pursue your own happiness and freedom?"

So my emotions are still A BIT torn, but not as much as they have been.

I owe that to my brothers at MS, and don't take any of you for granted.

Thanks!!!

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#430742 - 04/10/13 09:54 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: KMCINVA]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
Thanks Kevin.

The "right to feel whole" is a thing I still struggle with...just being honest. The struggle isn't normally this intense, but I KNEW that the death of my grandmother would bring some things back to the surface that I didn't want to face or deal with.

It feels weird (in a good way)to know that I have a team of people who feel what I've been through and don't see me as a "tainted villain" in the situation.

I am humbled by the support. Seriously.

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#430752 - 04/10/13 11:44 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
KMCINVA Offline
Greeter
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 1790
In time and surrounding ourselves with kind and compassionate people and forgiving ourselves for what happened seems to be the one way to feeling whole. At times I feel discombobulated,and other times not being in the here and now and some part of me taking over leaving me in the dark. Then there are days when I am with people who make me laugh, people I respect and those that respect me and then I feel whole. I am trying to become the latter person. We will get there someday. The MS people, therapy and support groups have been my saviors. Sometimes I look back and ask myself why am I still here and not like some of our fellow survivors who sadly fell to terminal consequences. I do not know the answer but somehow believe there must be a purpose for me being here.

I survived the abuse, a life of distrust and self loathing, being dismissed by members of my family but I seem to find the people who give me hope--they appear at the times I am in most in need. For them I am forever grateful and to those who have made my life a living hell--my abuser and those who dismiss me and CSA I am learning to say--you will no longer take me down to your level of immorality, your lack of humanity, your lack of compassion and understanding. I am getting there but I still harbor guilt and shame, but I believe I am on the road to healing.



Edited by KMCINVA (04/10/13 11:54 AM)

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#430753 - 04/10/13 11:49 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
We all are. I thought I was a lot further along the road until I got the news that my dad's mom was passing away. As soon as I read the message that she was "in her final hours" a lot of emotions resurfaced that made me realize that I hadn't gone as far down that road as I had thought.

Today, however, I am content with the fact that I am past the starting point...even if not at the finish line.

That's all I have, so...it's all I have.

I admire your courage in this fight.

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#430824 - 04/11/13 12:05 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
lapchinj Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/07/11
Posts: 1250
Loc: New York
hey 4life,

This is a democratic society and the majority rules. I think that Kevin hit it on the head that once we've been abused we have a tendency to let others not only treat us poorly but take advantage of that tendency. I was lucky that I divorced my parents at 12 years of age and I haven't been living with them until 5 years ago. That was 50 years ago, but then I let that 20% take hold of me andI thought that I should be the good son. I moved them up from Florida 5 years ago. Now I feel like that pre 12 year old kid and I'm not free anymore. But now they are torturing not only me but my family and my kids families. My 7 year old grandson will not go into my parents apartment because he doesn't like my mother. So she treats everyone badly once again. Now I cannot forgive myself for what I did to my family.

In the end I was not able to, like Kevin says, free myself from their selfish actions. Make the break now you are already 80% there, go all the way to the finish line and you will finally be free of the abuse. You will have a life, but never look back or change your mind about what you did. Nobody deserves to be treated like a piece of shit.

Good luck

Peace, Rainbows, Love & Healing
Jeff
_________________________
Stick around, It will get better....

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#430871 - 04/11/13 11:02 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
I hear you! So far, this morning has been okay.

I sat in staff meeting with the big, professional smile on my face. I took EXCELLENT notes like the Admin Assistant of the Year and never missed a beat.

INSIDE, I can't help but wonder what people think of me because I am not heading to my own grandmother's funeral. Wondering who will really understand why and/or who just won't give a damn either way.

But on the outside....this smile belongs in a magazine!!! I could put the world's most popular supermodel to SHAME!

IF only they knew...

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#430988 - 04/12/13 08:33 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
lapchinj Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/07/11
Posts: 1250
Loc: New York
Hey 4life,

My T heard me talking on the telephone to my shop foreman and he asked me afterwards that I sounded much different and I told him that's the fake me, the me I should sound like but the real me is what you know.

I think a lot, maybe too much, about what people would say about me if they knew I was a prostitute at the age of 12 and did that until I went into the USAF at 18. I hide a lot not wanting to show my face. Like you say "I only they knew...".

It hasn't worked yet but I try and say we aren't responsible for what we did or what was done to us. And as the general thinking goes we aren't. It is the people that used us, it's the people that caused us to think this way and to be all fucked up over what happened. We are not the bad guys. We shouldn't have to hide from anyone.

People have a hard time believing that a coach or close relative would do such a thing (sandusky comes to mind) to a child. These are the bad people. But when parents relatives or other people call you a liar that in itself is a crime. The same way I want to piss on my mother's grave I wouldn't give your relatives the decency to attend that funeral. These people assisted in a crime by calling you a liar. Go to the grave afterwards and tell her why your going to piss on her grave. Don't give anyone that attends the satisfaction of you attending. We all have to make a break at some point. We have to make a statement with our actions. We have to have them start thinking why we are not attending the funeral.

They just simply don't want to know about your pain. FUCK THEM ALL mad.

Peace, Rainbows, Love & Healing
Jeff
_________________________
Stick around, It will get better....

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#430996 - 04/12/13 09:50 AM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
Very well said. I didn't go. I was at work all day yesterday...

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#431046 - 04/12/13 07:05 PM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
lapchinj Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/07/11
Posts: 1250
Loc: New York
Hey 4life,

That was a very big step in your recovery. You don't need any more triggers than you already have. Shit that was brave of you. I think that was a very brave thing to do. That was a statement heard around your family.

I always wish people well but I really want to wish you a new beginning. I don't think that anyone would want to walk into a bad neighborhood so why go to a funeral with bad people.

I really hope that you were able to work OK instead of wondering why you didn't go or what people would say. Shit, that's a whole lot better than I can do towards my parents.

Good luck, let us know what happens when the shit hits the fan. I'm sure you will do a lot better know with that first big step.

Peace, Rainbows, Love & Healing
Jeff
_________________________
Stick around, It will get better....

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#431143 - 04/13/13 06:56 PM Re: MIND ISSUES - Part Two [Re: overcomer4life]
overcomer4life Offline


Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 198
I wondered a little bit, but overall it was an okay work day.

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