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#426499 - 02/25/13 10:53 PM Some Non-Survivors Should Just STFU Already
jls Offline


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 1142
I was with friends today who were watching Dr. Phil (I personally hate Dr. Phil, but anyway...)which was about a 15 year old girl sexually involved with numerous grown men. On the show she disclosed being molested at the age of 12 in a park by a man in his 20's, and that this happened several times as she kept returning to the park where this person continued to molest her. 2 of the friends I was with began making comments that she must have liked it or wanted it to keep returning there, and that she was probably lying about it altogether to illicit sympathy for her present behaviour, as if adults having sex with a 15 year old isn't still sexual abuse but I digress. In any case, their comments made me so upset and angry that I found an excuse to leave. Who the f*ck are they anyway to define a survivor's experience, and to pass judgement on what survivors have gone through? I, for example, beat myself up for years for not leaving my perpetrator sooner, and spent a great deal of time in therapy working through why many kids feel they can't leave an abuser. In light of this, what right do non-survivors such as the people I was with today have to define my reality for me? Alternatively, what's wrong with just keeping one's mouth shut about stuff they know nothing about? Some people just need to fu*k off already.

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#426504 - 02/25/13 11:28 PM Re: Some Non-Survivors Should Just STFU Already [Re: jls]
ThisMan Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/22/13
Posts: 758
Loc: upper south
Hey, jls. I saw the show today. I understand how upset you are. The show was pretty cruel to the girl. Her stories were questioned, she was accused of lying, even the Dr asked her why she continued to return to the park. And like you, I returned to my abuser over and over. Gee, maybe it was the candy???? lol... yep, the show pissed me off too. Hope you feel better and sorry you had to hear dumb comments that triggered those negative feelings.

bill.
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#426508 - 02/26/13 12:02 AM Re: Some Non-Survivors Should Just STFU Already [Re: jls]
Publius Offline
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MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/13/12
Posts: 396
Loc: OH
Awhile back I read an "Ask Me Anything" on Reddit.com where a male escort opened the forum up to questions. Many questions came and went, about his lifestyle and clientele, but eventually one person finally asked about his first sexual experience. In a very matter of fact manner he informed the readers that his first sexual experience had been with an 18 year old when he was only 12. I remember the immediate and top remark after his response was "ummm dude you were molested." He didn't see it that way or at least did not see how it was relevant to his present situation.

I bring this story up because it took a long time for that question to be brought up in a forum generally regarded as informed and insightful. The fact of the matter is despite the relatively recent media attention on CSA there is not only widespread ignorance on the subject thereto but an ongoing resistance to that knowledge in the general public. I feel like your experience is symptomatic of this problem. That being said let me just join you in saying "STFU" to all those dismiss our pain in such an egregious manner as you described.

It's 2013, post-Church scandal, post-Sandusky, post-Oprah, etc. and we still have people who flirt with and even embrace the myth of the "seductive child." We have people who say, or more frightfully I should say people who actually believe survivors "just need to let it go." My own experience has been with the latter of these two in that some of my male friends have made insensitive remarks around me thinking it was funny or quite probably, macho.

I share your sentiment that these sorts of reactions from non-survivors (especially friends) are both angering and hurtful. I hate the fact that CSA, despite its prevalence in society and the scope of its negative impact is not as well recognized or gently treated as other health issues. In short, some people do need to just STFU already, LISTEN, and LEARN. From awareness will come understanding and from that knowledge hopefully some empathy and lastly from there stronger support. I genuinely believe the higher society moves up this ladder the easier it will be for us survivors to move through recovery.
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#426520 - 02/26/13 12:57 AM Re: Some Non-Survivors Should Just STFU Already [Re: jls]
crazy gecko Offline


Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 309
Yup, there is a reason why Dr Phil lost his license to practise as a psychologist...

As for ignorant non-survivors, yes. They piss me off too, so here's another vote for STFU. Seriously.
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#426637 - 02/27/13 01:03 AM Re: Some Non-Survivors Should Just STFU Already [Re: crazy gecko]
jls Offline


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 1142
I have no use for Dr. Phil. I don't even have cable, but had the misfortune of being at a friend's place when the show was airing. Its pretty obvious that he doesn't have the best interest of those who are on his show at heart. Its for entertainment purposes, which if adults wish to go on there and humiliate themselves for other people's entertainment then I suppose that's their prerogative, but I couldn't believe he would do that to a minor child on national television. How is she going to feel about her participation in something so salacious (and that's what it is) when she grows up? If it were a criminal trial in which she was giving evidence of men molesting her then her identity would be protected, so why then is it allowed on television? There is something seriously wrong with how our youth are disrespected this way for the sake of entertainment. Talk about a fine way to re-victimize a kid. .

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#426639 - 02/27/13 01:14 AM Re: Some Non-Survivors Should Just STFU Already [Re: jls]
Tyler845 Offline


Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 276
Loc: U.S.A.
So fucked-up.
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#426651 - 02/27/13 08:00 AM Re: Some Non-Survivors Should Just STFU Already [Re: jls]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6317
Loc: 2 NATO Nations
Originally Posted By: jls
I was with friends today who were watching Dr. Phil (I personally hate Dr. Phil, but anyway...)which was about a 15 year old girl sexually involved with numerous grown men. On the show she disclosed being molested at the age of 12 in a park by a man in his 20's, and that this happened several times as she kept returning to the park where this person continued to molest her. 2 of the friends I was with began making comments that she must have liked it or wanted it to keep returning there, and that she was probably lying about it altogether to illicit sympathy for her present behaviour, as if adults having sex with a 15 year old isn't still sexual abuse but I digress. In any case, their comments made me so upset and angry that I found an excuse to leave. Who the f*ck are they anyway to define a survivor's experience, and to pass judgement on what survivors have gone through? I, for example, beat myself up for years for not leaving my perpetrator sooner, and spent a great deal of time in therapy working through why many kids feel they can't leave an abuser. In light of this, what right do non-survivors such as the people I was with today have to define my reality for me? Alternatively, what's wrong with just keeping one's mouth shut about stuff they know nothing about? Some people just need to fu*k off already.


See this??? See this, people who know me???? I'm not the only one who writes with a degree of due-agression.

This topic in action, as in the Dr Pill show, keeps kids from disclosing, makes them feel culpable and about 129 additional horrid factors that will fk them up in the heart and soul; make them hate themselves and seek help and pain relief in all the wrong places.

BTW: I RARELY (ok...never so far) have seen Dr Pill set the fk-tards in the audience straight regarding myths and other stupid spouting-about.

Anyway...WELL STATED jls!!!

I love it when people are not afraid to speak and act the way men use to. i'm sick and tired of "mamby-pamby" dances around important topics so that we don't appear too .... too......something. fk if I know....

But to all the people out there who are unfit to judge:


Edited by Still (02/27/13 08:26 AM)
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#426673 - 02/27/13 01:00 PM Re: Some Non-Survivors Should Just STFU Already [Re: jls]
cant_remember Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/05
Posts: 997
Sometimes the normals just don't get it. Often they don't. OK, they usually don't get it.

The normals rarely get it, if at all.

It's a miracle when one does get it, actually.

Cant
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#426685 - 02/27/13 01:46 PM Re: Some Non-Survivors Should Just STFU Already [Re: jls]
txb Offline


Registered: 02/03/13
Posts: 159
Originally Posted By: jls
I have no use for Dr. Phil. I don't even have cable, but had the misfortune of being at a friend's place when the show was airing. Its pretty obvious that he doesn't have the best interest of those who are on his show at heart. Its for entertainment purposes, which if adults wish to go on there and humiliate themselves for other people's entertainment then I suppose that's their prerogative, but I couldn't believe he would do that to a minor child on national television. How is she going to feel about her participation in something so salacious (and that's what it is) when she grows up? If it were a criminal trial in which she was giving evidence of men molesting her then her identity would be protected, so why then is it allowed on television? There is something seriously wrong with how our youth are disrespected this way for the sake of entertainment. Talk about a fine way to re-victimize a kid. .


You should email exactly this to whoever produces the show. And if there's some kind of tv regulator agency in the US email it to them as well because it sounds terrible.

I agree other people should just STFU about stuff they know nothing about. I find no one seems to be able to say the right thing to me. I don't know what the RIGHT thing is anyway, but just not what they are saying - like "you should have told someone." Really??? You think i never thought of that? All that does is make me feel worse. And really is it so hard to get your head round why a kid wouldn't tell or would keep going back? Especially if you are supposed to be a so-called psychologist, you'd have thought he should have understood. But I guess that would have made boring tv.

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#426727 - 02/28/13 02:44 AM Re: Some Non-Survivors Should Just STFU Already [Re: jls]
Jacob S Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/01/13
Posts: 550
To be fair, how many of us if we hadn't lived through it would have the strength or inclination to do anything other than squirm and mock? Of course we don't know, we did live through it. But most people who have not been to the depths of hell don't really want to stare into those fires. In a perfect world, they would look and reach out a hand and pull someone else out of the flames. But we see have the strength to look at the inferno because we lived through it. Would we be sensitive to CSA if our experiences had not forced us to be? We cannot know and we can never know if those who mock are putting up defenses to not deal with their own past. So while I hate it too and it makes me angry, I try not to judge them too harshly for being ignorant. If I were in their place, I hope I would be intuitively more sensitive . . . but I can't really know that for sure.

edit: I'm specifically talking about the attitudes of the general public and the friends jls was with. People who claim to be experts, of course, should be held to a different standard.


Edited by Jacob S (02/28/13 02:47 AM)
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