Newest Members
The Wife Of, smusab, whiteflag, North101, JCEldrid
12286 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
DruidWolf (39), Harry (33), knigh50 (53), mike54 (56)
Who's Online
3 registered (Mr. Malaise, 2 invisible), 31 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
12286 Members
73 Forums
63207 Topics
441969 Posts

Max Online: 418 @ 07/02/12 07:29 AM
Twitter
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2
Topic Options
#42594 - 02/12/03 03:11 PM Re: Anybody seen this?
RJD Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/01
Posts: 326
Loc: jefferson City, Mo,usa
I had my doubts reading the article. Then when I went to the branch articles it really felt overwhelming, I had to stop reading and go talk to my wife for a while. It seemed to get convoluted in its thinking and I began to wonder what point they were trying to make. It seemed like the baby was getting thrown out in the bathwater. Including Planned Parenthood in the seedyness sent up the red flags to me. At that point it seemed to have an agenda I had problems with. Thanks Don-NY for your extensive research. What's wrong with sex education. Why shouldn't it be taught. My mother tried to teach me in bed with her. School sounds like a much more appropriate setting to me.


Top
#42595 - 02/12/03 10:16 PM Re: Anybody seen this?
Don-NY Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 546
Loc: Long Island, NY
You make a very good point, Les.

Right after I read what you said, I went to the library. Unfortunately, they closed early today in honor of Lincoln's birthday.

So after dinner, I went to the Barne's & Noble bookstore. They are sold out of "Sexual Behavior in the Human Male".

I can't get to the library tomorrow, but I will look on Friday.

I am really curious now. But I wonder what exactly would make you discount her arguments.

Look at this passage again:
Quote:
She points to pages 160-161 of Kinsey's 1948 book "Sexual Behavior in the Human Male," in which the children's "screams," their "convulsions," their "hysterical weeping," "fighting" and "striking the partner (adult)" are judged by Kinsey as reflecting "definite pleasure from the situation."
This is not a quoted paragraph from the book. There is not even a sentence. At the most, there are 6 phrases, three of which are single words.

I say six at the most, because I suspect that the last quote may be the author of this passage quoting Judith's opinion of what Kinsey judged. I also doubt that I will find the word "adult", in parentheses in the original text, so if it isn't there, I'm not going to count it as a quote. Just my opinion, but would that be enough to make you discount her arguments? What about context?

There is no context to the quotes in the above, other than what the author of this passage and/or Judith imply. The word "children's" is not from a quote, indeed, I can't even tell if that word is from Judith or the author.

I will look. I'll let you know what I find. But I also suggest you look for yourself. Because unless I scan the pages and post them, why should you believe me?

Overall, this passage reminds me of when a critic describes a work as "a smashing bore and an incredible waste of time", but the advertisement for that same work will quote the critic like this "...Smashing...Incredible..."

_________________________
If you understand everything, some things are just as they are. If you understand nothing, things are still just as they are.

Top
#42596 - 02/13/03 04:13 PM Re: Anybody seen this?
Wuamei Offline
Member

Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 2700
Loc: The left turn I should have ta...
This part of the post I'm leaving:

Men, I respect the beliefs & opinions of everyone here, and the right to those beliefs, whether I agree with them or not.

But let's not miss the point here, at least my point in putting some personal emphasis on what Mr.Edd brot out from WorldNet.com.

This is not about homosexuality, sex education, or Planned Parenthood. It's about the sexual abuse of children! Period. I meant to make no other point, and if I made some other point to anyone I'm sorry. No offense intended.

This I have just added:

I have researched Kinsey, Reisman, and others on both, or more accurately on the many sides of these issues. There is enuf questionable research and faulty conclusions by all to go around from what I can see. As well as the preconceived ideas & personal or social agendas that tend to go with such studies & research.

I will not put much stock in what any of them say. I will add nothing else as far as my opinion.

It is not that crucial to the issues we face as male survivors of sexual abuse. It is not worth even the hint of any division here.

Thus I have saved for documentation, but I have deleted the rest of this post, with apologies for any offense I may have caused anyone.

Victor

_________________________
"I can't stand pain. It hurts me."
--Daffy Duck

Top
#42597 - 02/13/03 05:12 PM Re: Anybody seen this?
RJD Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/01
Posts: 326
Loc: jefferson City, Mo,usa
I have no respect for fundamentalism and what it represents. My mistrust is for the source, not MrEdd. With fundamentalism it is a package deal by its nature, that is it's definition. It is more about the letter of the word, and less about its spirit. No if's ands or buts. My experience with fundamentalism is that it is judgemental. I do not need that. This brings up crap for me about the age of reason, which is seven years old. I'm supposed to know the difference between right and wrong and thus I am responsible for feeling pleasure with my abuse, and I went back for more. The law says I was seven yrs old. I would be stoned for what happened to me. Jerry Falwell doesn't miss a beat when it comes to being judjemental. He is not alone, look at the source we are looking at here. This paper is not about love, it is about witch hunts. It is about devide and conquer. Look at the division that is occuring here.

Fundamentalism is about black and white kind of thinking. You do it the way they interpret it or you are going to hell.

For as cruel as that kind of thinking is I know I will see them there.


Top
#42598 - 02/13/03 05:29 PM Re: Anybody seen this?
Jess Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 107
Loc: California
As a Survivor of child sexual abuse and a fairly new member of National Organization Against Male Sexual Victimization, I am particularly sensitive about the damage to children caused by sexual predators of the young. I have received such help and comfort here, especially on this public forum. I hope that newcomers to this forum will likewise receive the kind of help, support and caring from the Survivors who post here, as I have. For the most part, stories posted here are by survivors of male sexual abuse who have struggled through the lifelong confusion, torment and depression caused by perpetrators of child sexual abuse. Many of you have courageously and honestly shared your experiences so that others who read them can relate what has happened to them to these experiences. One of the greatest realizations for me from these posts by understanding Brothers was that I AM NOT ALONE in my suffering. Through that realization I gained hope. And as a direct result I am now in therapy and I am finding that healing which will lead to recovery. To paraphrase a quote from Richard ... There is a significant amount of healing that comes from the psychological support provided by the sharing of posts in both the public forum and the private member forum... Yes, I agree because I have experienced that same support on many occasions. There are some very good articles posted here. I have not read them all yet, but the ones I have, like the one by Dr. O'Dea, have been particularly enlightening. I want to encourage any visitors reading these posts to read the articles by other professionals who have dedicated their time and practice to stopping the continuing sexual abuse of boys and men (actually of anyone) and to the healing and recovery of survivors of sexual abuse like myself and others here. I am glad to recommend reading of Dr. O'Dea's article. Many thanks to Richard and Ksinger and Don and Victor and Mo and Mark and all the Members here who have helped me so much and to those Members who are dedicated to helping the victims of child/adult male sexual abuse. I believe Dr. Reisman is also a Member. Sincerely, Jess.


Top
#42599 - 02/14/03 11:31 PM Re: Anybody seen this?
Don-NY Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 546
Loc: Long Island, NY
From Victor:
Quote:
I have researched Kinsey, Reisman, and others on both, or more accurately on the many sides of these issues. There is enuf questionable research and faulty conclusions by all to go around from what I can see. As well as the preconceived ideas & personal or social agendas that tend to go with such studies & research.

I will not put much stock in what any of them say. I will add nothing else as far as my opinion.

It is not that crucial to the issues we face as male survivors of sexual abuse. It is not worth even the hint of any division here.
I agree with this. Accordingly, I am not going to get Kinsey's book and post what I might find there. I apologize for not doing what I said I would.

Donald

_________________________
If you understand everything, some things are just as they are. If you understand nothing, things are still just as they are.

Top
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2


Moderator:  ModTeam, TJ jeff 

I agree that my access and use of the MaleSurvivor discussion forums and chat room is subject to the terms of this Agreement. AND the sole discretion of MaleSurvivor.
I agree that my use of MaleSurvivor resources are AT-WILL, and that my posting privileges may be terminated at any time, and for any reason by MaleSurvivor.