What makes me sad is that the Word Of God has been watered down, Society today says that there are many different religions all worshiping the same God. This is all part of the big lie. This is part of the complacency that is developing around Christianity. I mean there are churches that have so changed the word of God that the bible means nothing to them, Mormon and Jehovah's witnesses are some of those, then you get the Anglican and Catholic Church who don't even encourage their members to buy a bible, you use one of their books that does the same thing year in and year out.

We can get into the discussion of whether Jesus is or isn't the messiah, my answer is then why is the entire western worlds time based on the birth of this "fictitious" Messiah, why do the Muslims call him a prophet but deny that he is the Savior. Why does the entire world embrace any wacky religion and shun True Christianity. why is everyone trying to prove that God doesn't exist and that this is all an elaborate lie. Why???

Truth is that most of us are afraid to face the truth, we would rather debate till we are crazy, but refuse to serve a awesome living forgiving loving God. Its easier to to bemoan and d=cry about the hand that we have been dealt, to cry because its "Hard" to live a righteous life.
Who said being righteous was easy. One thing that we need to remember is that this Life on earth is but a vapor, but the life here after is for eternity.
This is a dress rehearsal for eternity, so a little suffering now is worth the effort.

Its been fun Guys

Martin

Why I don't believe in Jesus or God is because no human can comprehend or know God. Everything written about him is written by humans, therefore I am agnostic, I neither believe nor disbelieve in the existence of a God, for more information on agnosticism here's a link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnosticism

I don't trust human intentions, I personally think most religion is tainted by human kind. Much of it is contradictory, much of it does not coincide with history or facts. Therefore with an open heart I let fate decide where I end up in my faith in God, be there one or not. I will not fear a loving & forgiving God either, it sounds ridiculous to me. So with that in mind, and since this is in the spirituality forum now, just try and respect my beliefs and have faith your God will forgive me, as I do. If you can't then just don't tell me I'm going to hell. Hell does not scare me, because I don't believe in hell, yet it hurts my feelings to think someone thinks I deserve to burn in eternity. Enough to make me ambivalent towards you.

On a side note, wasn't one of Jesus's apostles a nonbeliever after Jesus died until Jesus was resurrected and asked to see the holes in his hands? He didn't go to hell did he? He had to see to believe. That is how I am.

And if you wonder why I care so much about Christianity it's simply because even though I don't believe in it, I am surrounded by a world majority (as in largest world religion) of Christians and their denominations.

As I respect your right. It is a right given by God - part of that "free will" thing that gets us in so much trouble.

I will end on my thougths of the Romans 1 passage:

"Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts.

Because of what? Let's look to the earlier passage to find out:

21) For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22) Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23) and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles. .... and in 25) They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator--who is forever praised.

I do my best to glorify God and give thanks to him constantly (especially when I work out a bad piece of code at work). I do not worship images made to look like men or birds or reptiles ... And I am **positive** I had done none of that before I knew I was gay at age 9. (I knew I was "different as early as age 5 - I just couldn't put a "label" on it until later) So I'm also certain Romans 1 does not pertain to me. I don't fit the "because" reasons. Also, because of the limited scope (non-glorifying God) - my faith says God's punishment was to give them lusts unnatural TO THEM so THEY would be shamed. Not that the act itself is "shameful". The passage is not about same-gender sex - it's about not glorifying God. Just like Sodom's sin wasn't homosexuality - it was lack of compassion to strangers.

Again - in love ... I just think we try too hard to put a box around God's love - and it's too big and keeps pushing down the sides. It has in the past, and I believe it is doing so now on the issue of same-gender love. Man is just, as is typical of man, many many years (centuries) behind God.

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Gentlemen and fellow survivors,

Please be careful with the feelings and beliefs of your peers. On the one hand we have the exact translation of the Holy Scriptures, on the other we have the belief in interpretation. It is imperative that BOTH of these perspectives be held in the highest regard here in this healing place. Be assertive without being aggressive. Please remember that when replying to a post, respond in support or offer your thoughts as your own, not in contradiction to the perceptions of other survivors. While we may not agree, we agree that this place is positive, encouraging and supportive of each other. When it becomes more important to attempt to contend than to empathize, it may be time to step back from this topic.

I am encouraged personally as I have witnessed careful wording and special care not to offend here in the replies. Please continue to care for your fellow survivors and for yourselves.

Sam

The Moderator Team

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i'm just glad my salvation is in my Lord's hands.
.... exit - stage left.

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