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#423531 - 01/29/13 07:05 AM Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert
EdfromNYC Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/18/10
Posts: 233
Loc: New York City
The thing about my sexual abuse that has always confused me (probably intended by my abuser) was that it felt good and that I orgasmed. That led me down a path of sexual acting out and seeking that good feeling of touch. I desperately needed to be touched and seen by a man and this first man took advantage of that void in my life and left me right after.

The thing is, I now realize that my orgasm covered up the fact that he was taking from me and I didn't know it and on top of that, I thought he was in fact GIVING something to me. That is the insidiousness of some abusers. Since I was a boy in need and he recognized that need, he moved in for the kill and took my innocence under the guise of being gentle and feel-good touch. It was sickness personified. And I've felt guilty about it ever since.

I am getting out from under this self-blame. I am understanding that there is evil in this world. I am understanding that my orgasm was a cover under which one (and then others) could perpetrate a crime against me and allow my shame to cover their tracks. Insidious. Evil.

This is me getting better to recognize this and to stop blaming myself for having an orgasm. That was part of the crime. It was used against me and it was evil disguised as comfort and care.


Edited by EdfromNYC (01/29/13 08:07 AM)
_________________________
And more, much more, the heart may feel,
Than the pen may write or the lip reveal.
Winthrop Mackworth Praed

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#423538 - 01/29/13 07:51 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: EdfromNYC]
Mountainous Buck Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/15/09
Posts: 1626
Loc: Minnesota
Hey Ed

Good post!

Siunds like you are Untangling the messages u received from the abuse and all that was going on in your life back then.

I relate to much of what you wrote - acting out, shame, confused bonding of sex with intimacy- I think you hit upon. A major truth for many of us: when you said u "desperately needed to be touched and seen by a man"

I have a theory that those who grew up in supportive environments and didn't hide the abuse started out on a path of healing and have had fewer self destructive behaviors - while others (including me) had to repress what happens and internalized the abuse and made some key assumptions about ourselves and the world at a young age.

There is male touch and intimacy that is neither sexual nor abusive- that is part of the healing truth I am discovering.
_________________________
We have to take responsibility for what we're not responsible for.

“It doesn't matter where you've come from,
It matters where you go" Frank Turner

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#423539 - 01/29/13 07:57 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: Mountainous Buck]
Jacob S Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/01/13
Posts: 617
Loc: where the shadows lie
Originally Posted By: Mountainous Buck

I have a theory that those who grew up in supportive environments and didn't hide the abuse started out on a path of healing and have had fewer self destructive behaviors - while others (including me) had to repress what happens and internalized the abuse and made some key assumptions about ourselves and the world at a young age.


I think that's probably very true.
_________________________
I come here now, and I see lots of anger.
I don't blame anyone for that. It is perfectly understandable.
But it is not healthy for me.
So I'm going somewhere else.

Goodbye and good healing.

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#423541 - 01/29/13 08:10 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: Mountainous Buck]
Suwanee Offline
Moderator
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/30/12
Posts: 844
Loc: Southeast USA
Ed's post touches on a subject that we often talk about obliquely...that an errection and especially an orgasm in the CSA context is "taking" and not "giving."

I was especially confused because my body reacted a certain way that didn't totally square with what my mind was processing.

As far as a supportive environment...I had that, but chose to keep the secret to myself. I was a plucky independent little kid...I thought I'd handle it myself. I should have told my parents...but instead I walked around with it for years. Then again, the energy I devoted to forgetting it was on balance productive.

Will
_________________________
I ask you to judge me by the enemies I have made. --FDR

I remember redwood trees, bumper cars and wolverines
The ocean's Trident submarines
Lemons, limes and tangerines
I remember this… R.E.M. 1988

Cruel Summer
My Journal

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#423542 - 01/29/13 08:12 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: EdfromNYC]
Chase Eric Offline
Moderator
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/25/10
Posts: 1600
Hi, Ed!

Great topic!

In my own case, my abuser was not so much interested in stimulating me - much less do I suspect he possessed the manipulative skills and political mind to do so. Yet I still responded sexually. It took a long time for me to understand that I was wired that way - we all are, I suppose. It didn't mean I was gay or I liked it - even though I may have been gay anyways, and even though I may have found the feelings pleasurable. Those nuances are tough enough for an intelligent adult to sort through, much less a child of 12 or 13 - much less alone in secrecy. Every time before we started I would try to talk him out of it. His will was never thwarted - ever. I never once succeeded in keeping him off me. And at some point in any given session he initiated, I surrendered to the sexual tide that inexorably swept over me, and thus fully owned the guilt and shame afterwards.

So I guess in my case that doesn't make him "evil" - just selfish and short-sighted. A pig.
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#423547 - 01/29/13 09:11 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: EdfromNYC]
EdfromNYC Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/18/10
Posts: 233
Loc: New York City
Great replies everyone! I feel something from everyone. Regardless of supportive or nonsupportive environment, the keeping of the secret of the abuser is the root of my continued "illness". The reason I kept the secret (besides the fact that my parents would have gotten mad at me): my shame and guilt due to my orgasm. Since I obviously enjoyed it, somehow I was culpable.

Surrender to the sexual tide - wow. Understood and experienced. The manipulation of that tide is a big thing for some/many abusers. Right now, I think of it as evil. Maybe I will progress to sickness, selfishness, etc. but right now I am at evil and good with that.
_________________________
And more, much more, the heart may feel,
Than the pen may write or the lip reveal.
Winthrop Mackworth Praed

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#423549 - 01/29/13 09:14 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: EdfromNYC]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6764
Loc: FEMA Region 1
Besides years of physical reaction as "proof he likes it! what a homo!!!" They also used my silence against me...or my inaction: "how do you keep letting us do this to you?"

I should be an extra in The Walking Dead, as I lived it for so so long.
_________________________
PEDOPHILES: Providing heating fuel for Hell for centuries...
and I'll be happy to fill the order!

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#423555 - 01/29/13 09:57 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: EdfromNYC]
Jude Offline


Registered: 08/09/12
Posts: 1600
Loc: New England
Originally Posted By: EdfromNYC
I am getting out from under this self-blame. I am understanding that there is evil in this world. I am understanding that my orgasm was a cover under which one (and then others) could perpetrate a crime against me and allow my shame to cover their tracks. Insidious. Evil.

This is me getting better to recognize this and to stop blaming myself for having an orgasm. That was part of the crime. It was used against me and it was evil disguised as comfort and care.


BRAVO Well Done Ed
_________________________
I will remember you
Will you remember me?
Don't let your life pass you by
Weep not for the memories
Sarah McLachlan

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#423684 - 01/30/13 01:04 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: EdfromNYC]
crazy gecko Offline


Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 309
The first time I ever ejaculated was while my father was raping me. And he used it against me - confirmation that I'm a "fucking faggot" who enjoys being raped.

It took me years to understand that it was a purely mechanical reaction and had nothing to do with pleasure. And even when I understood that, it took me many more years to accept it. The thought of getting an orgasm from being raped still disgusts me...
_________________________
I guess what I'm trying to say
Is whose life is it anyway because livin'
Living is the best revenge
You can play
-- Def Leppard

My Story, Part 2

My blog

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#423699 - 01/30/13 01:44 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: crazy gecko]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6764
Loc: FEMA Region 1
Originally Posted By: crazy gecko
The first time I ever ejaculated was while my father was raping me. And he used it against me - confirmation that I'm a "fucking faggot" who enjoys being raped.

It took me years to understand that it was a purely mechanical reaction and had nothing to do with pleasure. And even when I understood that, it took me many more years to accept it. The thought of getting an orgasm from being raped still disgusts me...


I'm Still wondering if it was "prostate pressure" that pushed semen out or if they were actual orgasms. At least early-on I could say there was noting but erectile reaction, which I did not even know was "a reaction" or even anything that was gonna be used against me.

I was an erection and habitual, masturbation-intense little kid. I learned that its not normal. I guess ALL SORTS of normal discovery about ourselves was twisted.
_________________________
PEDOPHILES: Providing heating fuel for Hell for centuries...
and I'll be happy to fill the order!

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#423700 - 01/30/13 02:31 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: Still]
crazy gecko Offline


Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 309
Originally Posted By: Still
I'm Still wondering if it was "prostate pressure" that pushed semen out or if they were actual orgasms. At least early-on I could say there was noting but erectile reaction, which I did not even know was "a reaction" or even anything that was gonna be used against me.

I was an erection and habitual, masturbation-intense little kid. I learned that its not normal. I guess ALL SORTS of normal discovery about ourselves was twisted.

The way I understand it, any direct stimulation of the prostate will cause an erection, and eventually ejaculation. I'm not sure if ejaculation=orgasm, but anyway...

I remember getting an erection the first time he fondled me, when I was about 4, maybe 5, but no older. Also when he first raped me... I think I was about 6, and it was excruciatingly painful, but I had an erection...

Sometimes I feel like my first orgasm was stolen from me. Most guys get it while masturbating or even with girls, but I got mine with my father's dick up my ass... sick

Sorry. Triggering. But I guess the thread title already contains a warning.
_________________________
I guess what I'm trying to say
Is whose life is it anyway because livin'
Living is the best revenge
You can play
-- Def Leppard

My Story, Part 2

My blog

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#423711 - 01/30/13 07:28 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: EdfromNYC]
Suwanee Offline
Moderator
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/30/12
Posts: 844
Loc: Southeast USA
You're right on the money. Erection and even orgasm are natural responses to stimulation. The mind can either be engaged---or not---especially at a younger age.

The perp who molested me was/is an obvious hebephile---that is, one who targets kids in early-mid puberty (11-14) as opposed to young children or older teens. What this means is that the victim is biologically able to orgasm/ejaculate, but the emotional development is still incomplete and incompatible with that type of behavior.

What I'm saying is that by 12 I was fully functioning down "there", so ejaculating during an assault was inevitable at the time. It took a long time for me to see it this way. The intervening years were guilt-ridden and full of shame and embarrassment....until I happened on an academic textbook of human sexuality at the library. There I found my answer in cold, clinical, non-sexual terminology.

Will
_________________________
I ask you to judge me by the enemies I have made. --FDR

I remember redwood trees, bumper cars and wolverines
The ocean's Trident submarines
Lemons, limes and tangerines
I remember this… R.E.M. 1988

Cruel Summer
My Journal

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#423720 - 01/30/13 09:06 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: Suwanee]
Farmer Boy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/23/12
Posts: 442
Loc: Australia
Originally Posted By: Suwanee
The intervening years were guilt-ridden and full of shame and embarrassment....until I happened on an academic textbook of human sexuality at the library. There I found my answer in cold, clinical, non-sexual terminology.


Wow I wish I had found that textbook. I feel like such and idiot.....I am finally getting this.

I 'knew' it wasn't my fault......Now I KNOW it (erection & orgasm) wasn't my fault either.

Will - thanks for the lesson on ......philes. I didn't know there was different sorts. They really should give you a manual or something when they decide to do nasty things to you.
So I guess the guy who did me at 15 was a ephebophilia (mid-to-late adolescents).

I've learnt more in this thread than I have in years.

Lee

PS that wasn't my first orgasm - another perp 'took' that at 10.


Edited by Farmer Boy (01/30/13 09:55 AM)
Edit Reason: add
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More than meets the eye!

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#423790 - 01/30/13 06:39 PM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: crazy gecko]
traveler Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 3644
Loc: somewhere in Africa
Originally Posted By: crazy gecko
Sometimes I feel like my first orgasm was stolen from me. Most guys get it while masturbating or even with girls, but I got mine with ...


sorry, CG - that's bad. but even on your own isn't a guarantee that it is going to be good. my 1st O was solitary - exploring and trying to figure out what was happening to me. my parents were no help in the seks ed department. she literally told me about "birds and bees" (tweet and buzz!) and my friends weren't as far along as i was and were not a help either. when IT happened - i was terrified. i didn't know about M or Os and didn't know what was happening. i was sure i had done something incredibly wrong - everything else i did seemed to be wrong - and this was obviously something BIG! and the whole atmosphere in the house was so permeated with sekual repression and the conviction that it was all bad, dirty and evil - that IT was an incredibly traumatic experience. i felt like i'd been turned inside out - physically and emotionally. there was an element of exquisite pleasure in it - but far overshadowed by the negative feelings of fear and guilt and self-condemnation. this was at age 11? and i'd been experiencing abuse since 5 1/5 with big Es but never the O before. i was so horrified that even after learning what M was all about, it was pbobly 3 years before i tried it myself voluntarily. i am sure that this 1st experience affected my whole attitude toward anything sekual for the rest of my childhood and most of my adult years - only recently starting to recover from it. so - i guess there are many ways of getting the wrong start - and ignorance, neglect and a toxic atmosphere is another one of them.

lee
_________________________
"Tell your heart that the fear of suffering is worse than the suffering itself... And that no heart has ever suffered when it goes in search of its dreams, because every second of the search is a second's encounter with God and with eternity." - Paulo Coelho


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#423822 - 01/31/13 01:06 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: EdfromNYC]
crazy gecko Offline


Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 309
I'm sorry Lee... I guess it doesn't really matter how they did it, but us guys on here seem to have one more thing in common - having our sexual awakening, which should have been a wonderful rite of passage, stolen and twisted and turned into something horrible and traumatic. frown
_________________________
I guess what I'm trying to say
Is whose life is it anyway because livin'
Living is the best revenge
You can play
-- Def Leppard

My Story, Part 2

My blog

Top
#423844 - 01/31/13 09:23 AM Re: Finally see what was taken from me-trigger alert [Re: EdfromNYC]
EdfromNYC Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/18/10
Posts: 233
Loc: New York City
I relate to so much on here especially about the first orgasm and the negative thinking about me doing something wrong whether due to an adult or by myself. I lived in a home of sexual repression/avoidance and I was a boy in need of direction like ALL boys. An adult man took advantage of that and under the cover of orgasm and stimulation deliberately took my innocence from me. It has been confusing until recently. It is becoming very clear what happened.

That wasn't my first orgasm but like Traveler mine was solitary and confusing and felt good but also felt like I did something wrong especially since it felt good. In my home, no one was allowed to feel good about anything really. So add something that I had no control over and that I had many, many questions about and I had no one to ask, well, up to a point, my family's dynamics pretty much teed me up to either be helped or abused, it depended on - what - luck or lack thereof? Don't know and doesn't really matter. What matters is what happened and what I can do about it today.
_________________________
And more, much more, the heart may feel,
Than the pen may write or the lip reveal.
Winthrop Mackworth Praed

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