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#415785 - 11/09/12 12:23 PM Any Bible Study for CSA?
phoenix321 Offline


Registered: 09/26/11
Posts: 912
Loc: USA, FL
Rape works, too. If the Bible addresses CSA, I don't see it.

I realize I'll never see justice. Don't make me regret asking. Thanks.



Only thing I found was this:

"I'm writing a novel, and in it the main female character gets raped. I have gathered information on the psychology of a rape victim, but am having a harder time finding information on how to witness to a rape victim. Do you have any ideas, or perhaps some specific Bible verses?

Answer
Well I will do my best to answer this and hope you may find teas something here helpful.

Is the female character who is raped a Christian or non-Christian? I am assuming she is not saved hence she is being witnessed to rather than counseled. If she is unsaved then she must be made aware of her need for God in her life, and the need for salvation.

As you may know many rape victims blame themselves or are ashamed even though they are innocent victims, so from a biblical point of view you can address each emotion and issue using scripture.

When a rape happens, the victim needs to feel no guilt and be shown the blame lies completely with the rapist...

Duet. 22:25.
But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die:
26. But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; [there is] in the damsel no sin [worthy] of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbor, and slayeth him, even so [is] this matter:

Many rape victims hold a lot of anger and bitterness inside...
Though many victims have every right to be angry, holding the anger inside forever hurts the victim even more and bitterness will eat them up...

Ephesians 4:31 etc...

There are many verses in the bible that show comfort for those who have suffered, like in Psalms

Psalm 28:7

Psalm 9:9

Psalm 18:2

Psalm 34:18

Psalm 71:20-21

Matthew 5:4 says:. "Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted."

When I was In a real place of darkness in my life I found a verse in Revelation of all places that really gave me hope that one day the painfully traumatic things in this life will one day cease ...

Revelation 21:4

And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

Many times God can use a previous hurts to help us heal, by helping others who have suffered what we have.

I think the best way to witness to victims of any form of rape or abuse, is to get their mind on helping other victims like them, that in itself seems to in some way make the person be able to cope with what happen to themselves by helping others. Showing that God can use them nightly to reach out to others.

Show then they are innocent victims, and that God loves them and has a purpose for them.

Dr. John Henry J. H. Jowett wrote: God does not comfort us to make us comfortable only, but to make us comforters.

The story of the rape of Tamar by her half-brother Amnon may provide some good resources for witnessing from a biblical perspective:

2 Sam 13:11. And when she had brought [them] unto him to eat, he took hold of her, and said unto her, Come lie with me, my sister.
12. And she answered him, Nay, my brother, do not force me; for no such thing ought to be done in Israel: do not thou this folly.
13. And I, whither shall I cause my shame to go? and as for thee, thou shalt be as one of the fools in Israel. Now therefore, I pray thee, speak unto the king; for he will not withhold me from thee.
14. Howbeit he would not hearken unto her voice: but, being stronger than she, forced her, and lay with her.

This is a very good story to show that such a thing can happen even to a princess. It also shows the traits of the rape scenario seen even today.

Here the cry of Tamar... "do not force me" alas like many victims the cry goes unheard... later she cries out "whither shall I cause my shame to go?" the sad thought of a rape victim , feeling shamed, etc... he listen not to her and forces her because he is stronger etc..

As Amy Sondova wrote in her article The Desolate Woman: A Biblical Perspective:

"The story of Tamar is horrible and hard to read; especially when one considers the real and raw emotion Tamar must have felt. Yet this story is in the Bible, not only to show the downfall of David's household, but to teach readers something about rape, to show women who have been sexually assaulted that they are not alone in feeling shamed, unloved, and desolate. Sadly, women in your ministry, both youth worker and students, have been or will be victims of rape or sexual assault. While you may not want to take a student or youth worker who has been a victim of sexual assault to this passage right away, it is a helpful reminder that rape did exist and was mentioned in the Bible. Here are a few things youth workers can pull out of the story of Tamar that is universal in a women's experience of rape." end Quote.

If you haven't read this article here is the link, which you may find very helpful: http://ezinearticles.com/?The-Desolate-Woman---A-Biblical-Perspective-on-Rape&id...

Sorry I couldn't be of more help, I just hope you can take something from these answers. All the best with your novel."

Here's another: http://ezinearticles.com/?The-Desolate-Woman---A-Biblical-Perspective-on-Rape&id=1043027

*Tamar was denied justice. David, the king of Israel, could have punished Amnon for violating his daughter, but in refusing to do so he failed as a king and as a father. Even though Absalom killed Amnon, he may have seen Tamar's rape as a slight against him and defended his honor, too. Survivors of rape should never be denied justice. Again and again, God refers to Himself as a God of justice, who hates injustice (Ps. 9:16, 11:17, 33:5; Is. 30:18, 61:8.)
_________________________
Phoenix

A guy opens the front door and sees a snail on his doorstep. He picks up the snail and throws it across the street in a neighbor's yard. A year later, the guy opens the front door and the same snail is on his doorstep. The snail says, "What the f*ck was that about?"

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#415797 - 11/09/12 03:18 PM Re: Any Bible Study for CSA? [Re: phoenix321]
JustScott Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/27/08
Posts: 2590
I've run a program in my church a few times that deals with abuse of all types. It's really good material and has roots in the work and writings of Dan Allender's "The Wounded Heart". His book is excellent (he's a trained counselor and a survivor of CSA) and the material in the program I use is excellent.

Story of Tamar fills a whole session, as well as the story of Joseph and his abuse, sale into slavery, events that took place in his life, until he finally was reunited, forgave, and reconciled (to a limited degree) with his family.

I've mentioned trying to do something here and was waiting for a co-leader to show up, but sometimes I think maybe.... I should go ahead and try to give it a go without a co-leader.

only trouble is, it's meant to be used in a face to face small group setting. So chat rooms and message boards don't really work to well.

My next best thought was to try it via skype or some other voice program, but that still present considerable issues and complications.

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#415805 - 11/09/12 05:23 PM Re: Any Bible Study for CSA? [Re: JustScott]
phoenix321 Offline


Registered: 09/26/11
Posts: 912
Loc: USA, FL
Scott,

I'll be brutally honest about one part above in my post. "Help others and you'll feel better..." Helping others made me worse, depressed and suicidal cause I didn't get reciprocal help from people that talked my ear off or got stabbed in the back.

I'll look-up this guy's book but if he's the "just work on your relationship with God and it'll all work" CRAP or the "repent cause you're really to blame for your shit" CRAP, I'll pass. The worst is "guilt guides to success" CRAP some Christian authors just have to write. lol God is into fixing people, right? So, unless it is fixing or healing-based, it's a crock of shit otherwise.

Have any pdfs on his book? I'm broke so $1 is too much to spend on it. frown

I fully understand how Tamar must've felt though. I can identify there some. Thanks Scott.
_________________________
Phoenix

A guy opens the front door and sees a snail on his doorstep. He picks up the snail and throws it across the street in a neighbor's yard. A year later, the guy opens the front door and the same snail is on his doorstep. The snail says, "What the f*ck was that about?"

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#415806 - 11/09/12 05:34 PM Re: Any Bible Study for CSA? [Re: JustScott]
phoenix321 Offline


Registered: 09/26/11
Posts: 912
Loc: USA, FL
I found this review of his workbook associated with his book:

"There are some insightful points made in this book, but it seems to turn every issue the survivor has into their own sinful shortcomings. Whether this has any basis or not it leaves the reader feeling completely invalidated, condemned, and frustrated. There is very little said that is compassionate. Also, the author tries too hard to impress the reader with his vocabulary in a very unpoetic way that is irritating beyond belief. On the Threshold of Hope is much kinder to survivors and offers more hope for healing and restoration."

And, this one: "I do NOT recommend this book. The assertion, repeated again and again, that we cannot trust our memories, that repression is a choice, that survivors sin in their response to sexual abuse...I find these abhorrent. Allender speaks of repentance and the choices survivors make. He even asserts that most survivors remember everything that happened, but then goes on to invalidate memory. Too bad I can't get my money back. To call this book a help to survivors I believe is fraudulent. The secular "Courage to Heal" book and workbook are infinitely better."

I have a lot of problems with self-hate so the blame yourself for everything approach I'll pass on this guy. Thanks.
_________________________
Phoenix

A guy opens the front door and sees a snail on his doorstep. He picks up the snail and throws it across the street in a neighbor's yard. A year later, the guy opens the front door and the same snail is on his doorstep. The snail says, "What the f*ck was that about?"

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#415807 - 11/09/12 05:42 PM Re: Any Bible Study for CSA? [Re: phoenix321]
pufferfish Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/08
Posts: 6875
Loc: USA
In the New Testament in the Bible, the subject of kidnapping is addressed. In Roman times (In Rome) boys were susceptible to being kidnapped on their way to school. Therefore, Romans who were financially able, had a trusted slave to accompany the kids to and from school.

The practice of kidnapping is called "men stealing" in the King James version of the Bible. It is mentioned only once in the New Testament, in 1 Timothy 1:10.

1 Tim 1:10

[For menstealers] The word here used - andrapodistees (NT:405) - occurs nowhere else in the New Testament. It properly means one who steals another for the purpose of making him a slave-a kidnapper. This is the common way in which people are made slaves. Some, indeed, are taken in war and sold as slaves, but the mass of those who have been reduced to servitude have become slaves by being kidnapped. Children are stolen from their parents, or wives from their husbands, or husbands from their wives, or parents from their children, or whole families are stolen together. None become slaves voluntarily, and consequently the whole process of making slaves partakes of the nature of theft of the worst kind. What theft is like that of stealing a man's children, or his wife, or his father or mother? The guilt of manstealing is incurred essentially by those who purchase those who are thus stolen-as the purchaser of a stolen horse, knowing it to be so, participates in the crime. A measure of that criminality also adheres to all who own slaves, and who thus maintain the system-for it is a system known to have been originated by theft. This crime was expressly forbidden by the law of God, and was made punishable with death; Ex 21:16; Deut 24:7.
(from Barnes' Notes, Electronic Database. Copyright (c) 1997 by Biblesoft)

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#415820 - 11/09/12 10:15 PM Re: Any Bible Study for CSA? [Re: phoenix321]
traveler Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 3511
Loc: somewhere in Africa
i had problems with Allender's book - "The Wounded Heart" - for the reasons mentioned above. it had lots of good observations about the effects of abuse - but i got really upset with the repeated calls for repentance on the part of the victim.

a better book - by far - is "Rid of My Disgrace," by Justin & Lindsey Holcomb. i got it free on my Kindle from a link here - i think one that Scott posted. it is the best thing i have seen with Christian content. it doesn't seem to compromise on the spiritual component or to downplay the psychological aspects. very unusual in my experience. i highly recommend it.

another book i read recently - also free on my Kindle - is "God Forsaken" by Dinesh D'Souza. it is not about abuse per se - but more of a philosophical and theological discussion of how evil can exist in the same world as a loving God. very well written and documented and not full of easy platitudes as i had expected.

i am not very tech savvy - but if there is a way to share these, i would be happy to do so.

Lee
_________________________
As my life goes on I believe somehow something's changed
Something deep inside...
I've been searchin so long to find an answer
Now I know my life has meaning
Now I see myself as I am, feeling very free...
When my tears have come to an end I will understand
What I left behind: a part of me. Chicago


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#415836 - 11/10/12 01:04 AM Re: Any Bible Study for CSA? [Re: phoenix321]
JustScott Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/27/08
Posts: 2590
Ive read the book and never saw things the way the reviewer did, but then to each his own. I also neveor felt I was being told to repent of the abuse or that I was somehow to blame. But then if two people can read the Bible and get two different things from the same passage then its surely to happen with any materiail written by a broken man.

I'm definitely not a one size fits all person so whatever works for you.

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#415845 - 11/10/12 05:15 AM Re: Any Bible Study for CSA? [Re: phoenix321]
traveler Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 3511
Loc: somewhere in Africa
Scott - i guess i wasn't clear - he didn't say to repent of the abuse - but of the responses to it - such as dissociating at age 5 or repressing memories - (even if you weren't aware you were doing so?! as if it was a conscious choice!?) - because it is not the truth and everything that is not truth is a lie.

i agree especially with this part from the review Phoenix quoted: "that we cannot trust our memories, that repression is a choice, that survivors sin in their response to sexual abuse..."

i still have the book - marked up extensively - and will go back to re-read portions that i found helpful - but i discussed it with my T and he said - don't be surprised - not everyone is always right about anything. take what is helpful and discard the rest.

lee


Edited by traveler (11/10/12 06:29 AM)
_________________________
As my life goes on I believe somehow something's changed
Something deep inside...
I've been searchin so long to find an answer
Now I know my life has meaning
Now I see myself as I am, feeling very free...
When my tears have come to an end I will understand
What I left behind: a part of me. Chicago


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#415939 - 11/11/12 02:34 PM Re: Any Bible Study for CSA? [Re: phoenix321]
phoenix321 Offline


Registered: 09/26/11
Posts: 912
Loc: USA, FL
I read 11 Samuel 13:1-39

Tamar was treated like shit. Women were property in those days.

"...And Tamar lived in her brother Absalomís house, a desolate woman." 13:20

King David was "furious" and pretty much let Absalom whack Annon, the rapist, over raping their beautiful sister (13:1). Dumbass could've married her, too. Annon was wicked to the core.

The big thing, for women I guess, is Tamar was a favored woman and if she can be raped, any woman can suffer that fate, IT ISN'T HER FAULT AND ISN'T YOURS!

Maybe women being treated like property in the OT is why Jesus said, husbands have to die for their wives if necessary just like I died for the church.

I get God is David so to speak, Annon is the wicked he is pissed with and Absalom is his wrath. Tamar still got screwed royally. A barren women in those days was a shameful thing and a desolate woman (single till death) was even worse. I certainly can identify with being considered property that was easily discarded.

Apparently, lots of places have the name Tamar in them in the Bible. It was also popular among royals at one time, too. Is it so she would be remembered?

Incest must've been common in those days if brothers could marry sisters.

The other rape is the Levite story. It pissed me off so bad I quit reading it. My thought over was/is, "why the fuck is the story in the Bible?" I was raped all night like she was and there was no one there for me either. She died on the threshold. Not sure the meaning of the "threshold". She was raped and tortured so some Levite guy wasn't. Disgusted me. It really ticks me off they couldn't even name her. Insensitive a-holes! LOL Her body ended up being judgement on the land of the rapists though.

The New Testament doesn't talk about rape.
_________________________
Phoenix

A guy opens the front door and sees a snail on his doorstep. He picks up the snail and throws it across the street in a neighbor's yard. A year later, the guy opens the front door and the same snail is on his doorstep. The snail says, "What the f*ck was that about?"

Top
#415961 - 11/11/12 08:33 PM Re: Any Bible Study for CSA? [Re: phoenix321]
pufferfish Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/08
Posts: 6875
Loc: USA

Originally Posted By: phoenix

The other rape is the Levite story. It pissed me off so bad I quit reading it. My thought over was/is, "why the fuck is the story in the Bible?" I was raped all night like she was and there was no one there for me either. She died on the threshold. Not sure the meaning of the "threshold". She was raped and tortured so some Levite guy wasn't. Disgusted me. It really ticks me off they couldn't even name her. Insensitive a-holes! LOL Her body ended up being judgement on the land of the rapists though.


This story is disgusting. Notice that the Bible doesn't withhold the details. Notice that this was a long time ago and the standards were very low. I think "the threshold" means that she barely made it to the 'front porch', where she died.

They had the same problem then as we do now. In that story the woman (who was probably an attractive teen) was loved by the young husband. But nobody cared. Nobody in the land rose up to avenge her rape and death.

They didn't have newspapers or internet. The young man was so furious (this sounds really terrible but it worked) that he chopped her body into pieces and sent them into the various regions of Israel on mules. This had the result of raising the level of consciousness against the crime to the appoint that people realized that action needed to be taken.

What do we have to do to raise the level of consciousness in our land to the point that abuse is taken seriously? How many lives have to be destroyed before we are taken seriously?

Puffer

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