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#413485 - 10/18/12 06:36 AM Re: angry at God [Re: traveler]
JustScott Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/27/08
Posts: 2582
Brings a smile to my face I know that. :-)

Prayer works for sure!

I agree with you Phoenix. Talk to God like anyone else.

I still remember my English professor in College... He's open the class with prayer and immediately transfer back to the 1600s..... "Father with thank thee.... thou art....." and all that..... was almost comical because it was almost always the same.... how helpful is that?

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#413506 - 10/18/12 10:29 AM Re: angry at God [Re: traveler]
Ed53 Offline


Registered: 10/16/12
Posts: 3
Loc: Conn

I sometimes wonder, in light of my dysfunctional upbringing, if I would have EVER given GOD a serious thought if it had not been for my chidhood trauma....
Jeremiah 29:11
New International Version (NIV)
11 For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the LORD, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future.

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#413564 - 10/18/12 07:44 PM Re: angry at God [Re: traveler]
phoenix321 Offline


Registered: 09/26/11
Posts: 912
Loc: USA, FL
Traveler, Thanks. Like you said, the praise is God's. smile I think when we get to heaven a lot of people will be there we didn't think would be and a lot we thought would be that aren't. Best thing, like in sales, is to never assume anything till you know--and with God, you ain't gonna be knowing much but your own walk (sorta) with him.

JustScott, I figure if I can't talk to God like a friend, any friend, then he's not a friend like he said he'd be. In a church, I can't talk to God my way (cause other people won't like it not him). And, one day, I'll look back and say to God, "I haven't said 'fuck' in a long time. Thanks." As he fixes my problems, that'll go away. I repent once a day and no worries. His grace is sufficient. He came for the fucked up not the perfect! lol

Above all, he wants the relationship. If a person builds a $1 billion cathedral to him and never has the relationship with him, that's a big waste of a building.

A guy was sitting outside this big church and cries out to God, "They kicked me out. They won't let me in. It sucks."

God said to him, "Don't worry. They won't let me in either." lol
_________________________
Phoenix

A guy opens the front door and sees a snail on his doorstep. He picks up the snail and throws it across the street in a neighbor's yard. A year later, the guy opens the front door and the same snail is on his doorstep. The snail says, "What the f*ck was that about?"

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#413803 - 10/21/12 09:00 AM Re: angry at God [Re: traveler]
traveler Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 3452
Loc: somewhere in Africa
some of this background you may have heard before. sorry - i can't remember what parts of my story i've told in which forum. the end of the post is new info, though.

I never had the chance to get to know my real father. He died when I was a few days shy of turning 3. He was buried on my birthday. I was told that now my Father was in heaven. It was just like the Lord’s Prayer: “Our Father who art in heaven.” And my heavenly Father and my real father were just the same in the way they related to me. I believed that they both loved me – but they weren’t physically present – and never could touch or hug or protect or talk with or play with me. And even though I’d have loved to have them more active in my life, it just didn’t ever seem to happen. They seemed distant, silent, unreachable, uninvolved.


The step-father, on the other hand, seemed onmi-present and omniscient and omnipotent. – at least in our house. He was not benevolent, accepting, loving, forgiving or merciful - but on the contrary – was intimidating, critical, perfectionistic, demanding, contemptuous, angry, vengeful, and punishing. He was very controlling and active in my life and was the complete Lord and Master of his kingdom – all-powerful and unchallengeable.


So I had a very dualistic or schizophrenic view of God – two totally opposite images that were mutually exclusive – but somehow I accepted and believed them both. I remember being very confused about God but believing in him passionately and pleading repeatedly and persistently for his intervention, miraculous help and rescue. Nothing happened. I remembered trying to love God and not being sure if I was doing it right because I wasn’t sure what it felt like. And I was sure that the reason that my prayers weren’t answered was because I wasn’t good enough.


I have always had a big problem with relating to God the Father. I am good with Him as Creator. As an artist, that is inspiring to me. As a writer and literature fan and teacher, I love Jesus’ identity as the Living Word or Word of Life. And many other names and titles also speak to me or help me to connect with Him. But Father is a tough one – for obvious reasons – but it is also a very important one. And it has been an aching void. I have a huge ambivalence about that name/title/identity – both a need for it and longing for it as well as being afraid of it and – as I now know – anger at it.


I think I am getting closer, though. I was reminded of some passages today that help. Jesus told Thomas – “Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father.” (John 14:9) A perfect case of like Father – like Son. So I guess that the attributes of both must be the same - (as One God – that is a given, I guess) – even though the roles of each individual identity differ. And Jesus also said “the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does.” (John 5: 20) which means that their motivations and intents and purposes are exactly the same. And Jesus also said that, “No one comes to the Father except through me.” (John 14: 6) That sounded like a pretty safe route – and good company too. I was losing some of the fear of God the Father as I started to understand the unity He has with the Son.


This morning in church, the worship time was very meaningful to me. Not because I am a great fan of group singing or really was getting into it. I was actually quite tired and had low energy and not much motivation or desire to worship. I certainly was not entering into it whole-heartedly or with much effort or focus. I can’t even tell you what songs we sang. But the overwhelming impression I got was of God’s love for me. And for the first time I felt like it was safe and OK for me to unload on Him about how I really felt. I think I had previously been censoring or editing everything to make it more “acceptable” – thinking that I had to be polite and respectful. Like I didn’t want to alienate God or make Him mad at me if I wanted His help. As if He didn’t know what was in my heart anyway. The biggest thing was what I posted about earlier = being angry at God. So this was it.


I remembered what Sam said: “Be angry, beat your fists on His breast until you become weak with effort, then feel his hands around you as He lifts you up and you fall into his bosom safe, free from the abuse and the controls.” And what Scott said: “God can handle your anger.... Anyway, talk to God. Pour it all out. Nothing will surprise Him.” And Phoenix: “Get pissed. He's heard it all before. Nothing new under the sun. He wants a relationship like a friend above all.”


So I said it. I didn’t have to yell or scream or hit anything. I just s-s-s-s-said it and started sobbing. It just poured out once I started. But it was exhausting. I think it was the first time I was really honest with myself and Him. And then I felt welcomed and accepted and as if I had been forgiven for the anger in advance – like it wasn’t even the big issue that I had made it. (just another sin? Big deal!) Then I had to pull it together enough to read the scripture aloud in the service – which I’d been asked to do. Whew!


I know that it is still going to be an ongoing process. Like my experience with forgiveness, I don’t expect it to be something that I do once and for all and have it finished. I’m sure I will have to re-visit this repeatedly as more things come to mind. But it is a good start....

Lee
_________________________
As my life goes on I believe somehow something's changed
Something deep inside...
I've been searchin so long to find an answer
Now I know my life has meaning
Now I see myself as I am, feeling very free...
When my tears have come to an end I will understand
What I left behind: a part of me. Chicago


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#413805 - 10/21/12 09:03 AM Re: angry at God [Re: traveler]
traveler Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 3452
Loc: somewhere in Africa
wanted to respond to all of you ...

can't tell you all how much this give and take has helped. i wouldn't be where i am - in a much better place without it.

Ed – I started reading your article the first time I saw it and didn’t get it – so I quit and came back to it later. At first I didn’t see how it related – until I came to the end and found this: “We can intellectually throw out false beliefs. We can intellectually remember and embrace the Truth of ONENESS and Light and Love. But we cannot integrate Spiritual Truths into our day-to-day human existence, in a way which allows us to substantially change the dysfunctional behavior patterns that we had to adopt to survive, until we deal with our emotional wounds. Until we deal with the subconscious emotional programming from our childhoods.” That makes sense to me. Thanks for sharing it. And welcome to our community.


Jim – I already replied to your post, but I think some of the long post above may be relevant to what we were discussing...?


Yerac - your post disappeared before I was ready to reply – but I remember that it had enough points of similarity with some of my past ones – especially the first ones when I came here – that I can say - I get you – and I’m not totally over it yet. So – yeah – I’m pissed too... like Jude said above: “I've had some shouting matches with God lately. He hasn't struck me dead yet. As was said above, God can handle your anger. But there still is no answer to "WHY?". I finally had to put it on the shelf. Someday I'll see Him face to face and we'll have a long talk about it. Till then I just have to go on with my life.” That is pretty much where I am now. I know I need God more than I need answers to my questions. So – for now, I am also trying to “put it on the shelf.” Hope you’ll come back and keep on chipping in with your contributions. You would have a hard time offending anyone here.

Lee
_________________________
As my life goes on I believe somehow something's changed
Something deep inside...
I've been searchin so long to find an answer
Now I know my life has meaning
Now I see myself as I am, feeling very free...
When my tears have come to an end I will understand
What I left behind: a part of me. Chicago


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#413819 - 10/21/12 12:13 PM Re: angry at God [Re: traveler]
phoenix321 Offline


Registered: 09/26/11
Posts: 912
Loc: USA, FL
Originally Posted By: traveler
But the overwhelming impression I got was of God’s love for me. And for the first time I felt like it was safe and OK for me to unload on Him about how I really felt. I think I had previously been censoring or editing everything to make it more “acceptable” – thinking that I had to be polite and respectful. Like I didn’t want to alienate God or make Him mad at me if I wanted His help. As if He didn’t know what was in my heart anyway. The biggest thing was what I posted about earlier = being angry at God. So this was it.

Lee


I would love to feel that and handle feeling that since I don't feel much at all except fear and anger (mostly anger) and hurt. When I was in the hospital and suicidal (or before I got there), God could've been in the room and I felt nothing just alone. I know God cares about me sorta, but, truth is, until he sends help my way, I don't know if that is true honestly. The last time I was with God I figured he'd dump me as soon as I quit doing any work. So, this time, I ain't doing a thing till I get the help I need. Considering how much I hate life anyway, I'm not much good in helping anyone else anyway. I never sought God the first time (back in 1992) or this time. Both times he came to me in my bedroom. I still have no idea why he did and why he wants me to begin with. I'm broken and know I'm broken this time. frown
_________________________
Phoenix

A guy opens the front door and sees a snail on his doorstep. He picks up the snail and throws it across the street in a neighbor's yard. A year later, the guy opens the front door and the same snail is on his doorstep. The snail says, "What the f*ck was that about?"

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#413844 - 10/21/12 08:00 PM Re: angry at God [Re: traveler]
traveler Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 3452
Loc: somewhere in Africa
believe me, phoenix, i have rarely felt this - maybe twice before. for long stretches of my life i, too, felt NOTHING. i remember when i pulled the plug intentionally on emotions. i was 11-12. i felt nothing more until i was maybe 19. had a brief foray of a few years into emotional sensations, then shut down again until i was 35. another period of testing the waters - and now again - i am coming back to life after more than 2 more decades. so - i know you've waited a LONG time, but don't give up yet.

something i heard yesterday made me stop and think: "Don't seek for God's gifts and blessings. Seek for God himself - and the gifts and blessings will come as well."

Lee
_________________________
As my life goes on I believe somehow something's changed
Something deep inside...
I've been searchin so long to find an answer
Now I know my life has meaning
Now I see myself as I am, feeling very free...
When my tears have come to an end I will understand
What I left behind: a part of me. Chicago


Top
#413870 - 10/21/12 10:59 PM Re: angry at God [Re: traveler]
phoenix321 Offline


Registered: 09/26/11
Posts: 912
Loc: USA, FL
Originally Posted By: traveler
believe me, phoenix, i have rarely felt this - maybe twice before. for long stretches of my life i, too, felt NOTHING. i remember when i pulled the plug intentionally on emotions. i was 11-12. i felt nothing more until i was maybe 19. had a brief foray of a few years into emotional sensations, then shut down again until i was 35. another period of testing the waters - and now again - i am coming back to life after more than 2 more decades. so - i know you've waited a LONG time, but don't give up yet.

something i heard yesterday made me stop and think: "Don't seek for God's gifts and blessings. Seek for God himself - and the gifts and blessings will come as well."

Lee


No emotions since 3.5 years old for me. That's about 40.5 years ago. If I wasn't Bipolar, I seriously doubt I'd be alive.


Edited by phoenix321 (10/21/12 11:21 PM)
_________________________
Phoenix

A guy opens the front door and sees a snail on his doorstep. He picks up the snail and throws it across the street in a neighbor's yard. A year later, the guy opens the front door and the same snail is on his doorstep. The snail says, "What the f*ck was that about?"

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