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#407104 - 08/17/12 02:14 PM Re: Guilt ... Baggage (TRIGGER WARNING) [Re: SkyLukewalker]
SkyLukewalker Offline


Registered: 08/12/12
Posts: 31
Loc: West Coast, US
Took a break for a few days to get my head together. Some of you have sent me private messages that were very kind - thank you. smile

I guess the point of the thread is "This isn't real - stop stressing over it - accept that the 'perfect guy' and acting out are symptoms of how my brain handles abuse."

I have to admit, I don't have a better answer than that, and yet it drives me up the wall to think that these emotions are based on something that FEELS so real and yet DOES NOT exist. That's not fair - that's how schizos go through life.

I feel like the 'Perfect guy' is supposed to give me something - what is he supposed to give me?

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#407157 - 08/18/12 08:34 AM Re: Guilt ... Baggage (TRIGGER WARNING) [Re: SkyLukewalker]
SamV Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/13/09
Posts: 5941
Loc: Talladega, Alabama, USA
The perfect guy is supposed to give you success, safety a sense of well being. After the abuse, the perfect guy personality came out so you could keep track of.., everything. We made ourselves the reason we were abused, so by watching ourselves the way a warden watched inmates, we made sure we did nothing bad, no mistakes, no problems.

The problem with the perfect guy is that it is an imbalance. When we are not balanced with our personality, we use our emotional energy to support it at the rate of 5 to 1. We burn out. We have to act out or use coping mechanisms to fortify that extreme.

So...
The perfect guy is the extreme, the other would be what, in your life? What is the polar opposite of perfect guy?

What is the balance of these extremes?

How would the balance manifest itself in your life?

Sam
_________________________
MaleSurvivor Moderator Emeritus 2012 - 2014

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#407163 - 08/18/12 11:48 AM Re: Guilt ... Baggage (TRIGGER WARNING) [Re: SkyLukewalker]
cant_remember Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/05
Posts: 1039
Hello Sky,

You and I have a lot in common: like you, I don't remember my abuse, but I'm pretty sure it was at the hands of a white-haired man, because when I act out that's what I'm drawn to -- and yes, for me acting out is a recreation of the abuse. Maybe to get control over it in some subconscious way, but I feel like a broken record.

While you work to figure yourself out here with the rest of us trying to figure ourselves out, I would recommend you look into an SAA group so you have a weekly check-in. That might help.

I've just started attending an SAA meeting, and I don't really feel like it's an ideal fit for me, but it does serve a good purpose of giving someone accountability for our actions, and could help with your more risky acting-out behaviors like the outdoor stuff.

As for your pastor, tell him you're suffering from PTSD like a returning war veteran, except instead of a war zone you're a sex abuse survivor. Maybe that will click with him.
_________________________
Recovery is possible. Hang in there, brothers.

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#407200 - 08/18/12 11:58 PM Re: Guilt ... Baggage (TRIGGER WARNING) [Re: SamV]
SkyLukewalker Offline


Registered: 08/12/12
Posts: 31
Loc: West Coast, US
Quote:
The perfect guy is supposed to give you success, safety a sense of well being. After the abuse, the perfect guy personality came out so you could keep track of.., everything. We made ourselves the reason we were abused, so by watching ourselves the way a warden watched inmates, we made sure we did nothing bad, no mistakes, no problems.


I'm not sure I understand this but it sounds very close. Can you give me an example?

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#407212 - 08/19/12 09:34 AM Re: Guilt ... Baggage (TRIGGER WARNING) [Re: SkyLukewalker]
SamV Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/13/09
Posts: 5941
Loc: Talladega, Alabama, USA
Hm... are you a Star Trek TNG fan?

"
Quote:
NT. SCIENCE SHIP CHAMBER - ON TIMOTHY

a boy of ten. Trapped beneath a fallen bulkhead in an
even more heavily damaged area. He looks up at Data
and Riker -- panic on his face.

TIMOTHY
Are my parents alright?
"

"
Quote:
12 INT. VICO (OPTICAL)

Data and Geordi are standing by. Riker is crouched
down next to the trapped boy. Timothy appears almost
numb with fright.

PICARD'S COM VOICE
Is the boy ready, Number One?

RIKER
(to boy)
Everything's gonna be okay...

A beat. The boy doesn't answer. But he nods his head
almost imperceptibly.
"

"
Quote:
Everything happens at once:

-- with his android strength, Data forces the bulkhead
upwards. The boy scrambles free, falling to the floor.

-- a second structural member collapses as a result of
the action.

-- Data drops the bulkhead, spins, scoops the boy into
the air and dashes back toward the opposite corridor.

17 DATA (OPTICAL)

shoots into the open corridor, boy under his arm,
tapping his combadge with his free hand.

DATA
(to com)
Energize!

He and the boy DEMATERIALIZE -- a piece of the ceiling
falls right through them.
"

"
Quote:
TROI
If he is lying, I haven't been
able to sense it. Perhaps his
level of emotional trauma is too
high.

PICARD
Why wouldn't he tell us the truth?

TROI
He's still in shock... it's hard
to know what's going on in his
mind.
"

"
Quote:
He turns away and goes to the mirror hanging on a
nearby wall.

He stares at his reflection. Then makes his face
utterly impassive.

TIMOTHY
(Data-like)
I am designed to exceed human
capacity...

He tilts his head in imitation of Data, watching the
result in the mirror until he gets it right. Again,
his voice is an imitation of Data's.

TIMOTHY
(continuing)
That is correct...
"

"
Quote:
OFF another head tilt, as -- in his own mind -- boy
becomes android...
"

"
Quote:
TROI
So... you're no longer a Human?

He cocks his head in pure Data fashion.

TIMOTHY
I'm an android.

TROI
When did this happen?

TIMOTHY
I've always been an android.

TROI
What's it like... being an
android?

TIMOTHY
I am designed to exceed human
capacity both mentally and
physically. But I do not
experience emotions.
"

"
Quote:
TROI
I know it sounds unusual - but
it is understandable.
Technically, it's called
enantiodromia. Conversion into
the opposite. Timothy went from
Human to machine. From being
emotional to being emotionless.
But the underlying trauma is still
there. He's just found a new way
to repress it.

PICARD
How long will this behavior last?

TROI
As long as he needs it to.
Timothy is rebuilding his identity
as best he can. The android
persona is only one step along
the way. When he becomes stronger
and more sure of himself, it
should drop away naturally.
"

"
Quote:
PICARD
(gently)
Timothy, can you tell us what
happened to your ship?

TIMOTHY
I did tell you.

Timothy's struggling to hold on to the android fantasy,
but it's wavering. He gives a few Data-like head
tilts. Picard glances at Troi.

TROI
Tell us again...

TIMOTHY
(evenly)
We were attacked.

STAR TREK: "Hero Worship" - REV. 10/16/91 - ACT FOUR 49.

79A CONTINUED:

DATA
That is highly unlikely. Our
investigations have clearly
demonstrated --

TIMOTHY
-- We were attacked! We were
attacked!

DATA
Timothy, androids do not lie.

A silent beat. Like a toppled wall, Timothy's fantasy
crumbles.

TIMOTHY
(quiet; horrified)
It was me.

Everyone's taken aback.

DATA
Please explain.

TIMOTHY
It was me. I did it. I killed
them all...
"

"
Quote:
Picard, Troi and Data are still reacting to Timothy's
revelation. Timothy speaks quietly, haltingly. He
shivers, repressing sobs, as the agony of revealing
his darkest secret emerges...

TIMOTHY
Everything was shaking. I lost
my balance. I was just trying
to hold on to something. I didn't
mean to do it.

PICARD
What didn't you mean to do,
Timothy?

TIMOTHY
My arm... it hit the computer
panel. That's what destroyed the
ship.

The adults exchange a glance.

TROI
The ship was damaged when your
arm hit the computer panel... ?

Tears roll down his cheek as he nods silently.

TROI
Timothy, listen to me -- the
damage to your ship might have
occurred at the same time you
touched the panel but it was only
a coincidence... this was not
your fault...

TIMOTHY
Yes it was...
"

"
Quote:
DATA
It is not possible. The onboard
control systems for every starship
require a user code clearance.
You could not have inadvertantly
affected any of the Vico's
systems.

Timothy doesn't quite get it.

PICARD
Your computer had safety
precautions. There's nothing
you could have touched that would
have damaged your ship.

Timothy is silent, trying to understand. Troi puts
a hand on his shoulder.

TROI
You're not responsible for what
happened to your parents.
"

"
Quote:
TIMOTHY
Can we still do things together
-- even if I'm not really an
android?

DATA
I have many Human friends. I
would be pleased to count you
among them.

TIMOTHY
That would be...

Timothy smiles -- the first time we've seen a genuine
child's smile.

TIMOTHY
(continuing)
...acceptable.
"

Okay this reply got out of hand lol, many of my replies do Sky. Listen, I want you to watch the Star Trek episode called "Hero Worship", season 5 episode 11 in the season. The dialog is above in this post. There is one click here if your Adobe Flash Player is working at all, mine wasn't today. In it a boy has a traumatic incident, and finds safety in imitating an android, perfect, no emotions, no fear, no mistakes.

It is an interesting piece, going through a boy's reaction to trauma, while not mirroring abuse, it is a sense of what goes through a male child's mind. It makes me wonder what could have happened if an entire community was urgently searching for the answers, as if their lives would be negatively affected if they did not help this one young traumatized boy.

You asked for an example and this is the first thing I thought of, sorry if it is lame. Let's talk about it when you are finished.

Sam
_________________________
MaleSurvivor Moderator Emeritus 2012 - 2014

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#407220 - 08/19/12 11:44 AM Re: Guilt ... Baggage (TRIGGER WARNING) [Re: SkyLukewalker]
SkyLukewalker Offline


Registered: 08/12/12
Posts: 31
Loc: West Coast, US
I can't find the episode right now but I think what you're saying is that I'm trying to imitate my life without the abuse.

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#407221 - 08/19/12 12:32 PM Re: Guilt ... Baggage (TRIGGER WARNING) [Re: SkyLukewalker]
SamV Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/13/09
Posts: 5941
Loc: Talladega, Alabama, USA
Yeah, that's about it Sky. We "imitate", in that in mimicking the movements of others, we distance ourselves from the abuse and it's effects. We "mirror" the actions of those we see, so that we do not have to be emotionally involved in life. Without emotions, we can go through life, be functional. Should anyone peer closely, they would only see the imitation, the perfect mimicking of those we follow who are successful, above and beyond. If there is success, there can be nothing else, right? Wrong, but we did not know that.

In the beginning, being perfect means we take the "image" and analyse it, and imitate the success until we master the art of it. It is only later, when the success has been realized that we lose the perfection, breakdown and begin to consider our "beginnings" and wonder at the persistent self doubt and destruction we may have felt. This creates a need for healing, but instead coping mechanisms like drinking, porn and sexual acting out drive us. What we should heal from gets covered over with... ok, I am gonna shut up now. I have had years of recovery, fellow survivor, and am trying to offer that in one post. Sorry for the manic thoughts...

Sam
_________________________
MaleSurvivor Moderator Emeritus 2012 - 2014

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#407576 - 08/22/12 05:45 PM Re: Guilt ... Baggage (TRIGGER WARNING) [Re: SamV]
SkyLukewalker Offline


Registered: 08/12/12
Posts: 31
Loc: West Coast, US
That's certainly a compelling argument but I wish one of the therapists on this board could tell me. I really want to know what this is from a medical standpoint.

Going to bring up PTSD with my Psych when I visit him in September.

Back to topic - Porn, acting out and this 'Perfect Guy' - I can buy that this is me trying to imagine my life without the abuse but there seems to be more to the story. P.G. seems to be trying to tell me something. What is he trying to say?

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#407587 - 08/22/12 08:48 PM Re: Guilt ... Baggage (TRIGGER WARNING) [Re: SkyLukewalker]
SamV Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/13/09
Posts: 5941
Loc: Talladega, Alabama, USA
Sky, may I offer a left turn?

Don't:
-project adult feelings onto the abuse.
-say what would have happened in hindsight, what you may have done differently with shame.
Don't listen when others say what they would have done differently, they have no idea.
Don't ask, "Why didn't I run, scream, fight, leave?"
Don't search for specifics about the assault until the feelings overwhelm you. As the memories come, reason with them, calm yourself and slowly take in each event, posting, replying and understanding your innocence and hope for the future.
Don't ask blaming questions such as, "Why was I wearing that? Why was I there? Did I lead him/her on?"
Don't ask irrelevant questions such as, "Was he/she good looking?" "Was I attracted?"
Don't allow other's to make your decisions, you are going to need that, urgently.
Don't forget that recovery from sexual assault is an ongoing process that takes months, years or a lifetime.
Don't forget to take care of yourself. You can't recover if you don't support yourself.

Simply put, recovery is different than surviving. Survivors keep chasing the cure, recovery let's the "cure" come to us.

Patience Sky, this is a marathon, not a horse race, and right now in the points standing, your are leading by a nose. wink

Sam
_________________________
MaleSurvivor Moderator Emeritus 2012 - 2014

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#407800 - 08/24/12 12:40 PM Re: Guilt ... Baggage (TRIGGER WARNING) [Re: SamV]
SkyLukewalker Offline


Registered: 08/12/12
Posts: 31
Loc: West Coast, US
I dig what you're saying but I'd simply like to know what this part of my head is saying to me. It's like it's trying to communicate something important and I'm not getting it and it doesn't stop trying to say it.

What is it?

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