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#404501 - 07/23/12 04:21 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
tshodson Offline


Registered: 06/13/12
Posts: 131
I agree jls...I was just trying to point out that I am really sick of this hero worship above all else and that so many people feel that Paterno is a god-like figure...In fact, he was just human and really a really flawed one at that...and his flaws caused hurt and damage to many, many young boys...

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#404503 - 07/23/12 04:30 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
tshodson Offline


Registered: 06/13/12
Posts: 131
If you really want to get sick, read about tweets from the Penn St. faithful. Such a sick culture... They even blame the media...oh -- what else is new?

http://gothamist.com/2012/07/23/bitter_reactions_to_ncaas_punitive.php

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#404505 - 07/23/12 04:47 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
tshodson Offline


Registered: 06/13/12
Posts: 131
Really good article saying we should stop talking about football in the Sandusky matter and get back to the REAL issues...

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/07/23/ncaa-sanctions-let-s-forget-about-football-now.html

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#404508 - 07/23/12 05:02 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
jls Offline


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 1142
I have personal experience with this since last year I put my job on the line by reporting the abuse of a dog in my workplace to the SPCA. I was well aware that doing so would put me in the crosshairs of my employer because he was aware that the abuse of the animal was happening but did nothing, which where I'm from is illegal not to report. Anyways I'm not saying its easy to report the powers that be. Far from it. I found it extremely stressful to be in the middle of it and as a survivor was triggered by it big time. However, I had to ask myself what I could live with and decided that I could live without the job but couldn't live without my integrity so that's why I acted. Thankfully I still have a job but that's besides the point in my mind.
_________________________
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world.


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#404512 - 07/23/12 05:16 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
jls Offline


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 1142
That is sick, the tweets I mean. Equating upset football fans to what csa survivors endured is very disturbing. These people need a harsh dose of reality to re-set their sense of proportionality. In light of their reaction perhaps it would have been best to pull the plug on the football program altogether. As such they should just shut up and be grateful that they got away with more than what was deserved.
_________________________
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world.


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#404513 - 07/23/12 05:24 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
LN3(SS) Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/20/08
Posts: 486
Loc: MD
These penalties were excessive.

The upcoming football players did not commit these crimes, Sandusky did. Taking scholarships away so these kids cannot attend college undermines these kids's future education. How many kids have worked their entire lives to be able to play college football?

The football players that won all those games for the last decade plus did not commit these crimes. Sandusky, Spanier, and Curley did. Vacating those wins undermine the effort of those teams that played their hearts out and won those games on the field. Paterno fulfilled his duty under the law and now has lost his wins for fulfilling his legal duty. Great way to encourage people to obey mandatory reporting laws.

About the only part that I halfway agree with is the fine.
Quote:
Removed incendiary comments


I'm disappointed that MaleSurvivor would support these sanctions.

Brian


Edited by ModTeam (07/23/12 06:18 PM)
Edit Reason: Please keep to the topic without engaging in other argument's. If you feel the need to express those other thoughts, do so by creating another topic. Please continue to express yourselves within the guidelines, this is welcome in our safe place.
_________________________
"When we go into battle, I will be the first to set foot on the field, and I will be the last to step off, and I will leave no one behind. Dead, or alive, we will all come home together." LTG Hal Moore, Jr., USA (Ret.)

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#404515 - 07/23/12 05:42 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: LN3(SS)]
jls Offline


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 1142
What you fail to address is that Penn State as an organization needs to face consequences for failing to report Sandusky's crimes and in effect were an accessory to them by allowing Sandusky's continued participation in their football program. There is a degree of liability here on Penn State's part that can't be ignored by simply pointing the finger at the perpetrator after the fact when they knew full well what was going on all along. You continue to repeat that Paterno fulfilled his obligation to report. I don't believe this to be true at all. If I knew that a child was being abused but only reported the first instance and ignored the rest while the abuse continued does this count as fulfilling my duty? Hardly. After all, the point of reporting is to stop the abuse, right? When his report to the university went unheard he should have gone directly to the authorities. There is no question that this would have been the only proper course of action. Of course I'm speaking of the way things work in the real world and not the one coloured by football fans in denial. As far as that goes when it comes down to it it's just a game. Sexual abuse is not so some people should get a grip already.
_________________________
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world.


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#404516 - 07/23/12 05:43 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
cant_remember Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/05
Posts: 1046
Paterno lied to the grand jury. If he were still alive, he would have been indicted given what came out in the Freeh report.

Get over it.
_________________________
Recovery is possible. Hang in there, brothers.

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#404523 - 07/23/12 06:45 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
LN3(SS) Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/20/08
Posts: 486
Loc: MD
jls,

I agree that Penn State, as an institution, needs to face penalties. And they did in the form of $60M. I support the penalties about probation and creating a compliance officer.

What I can't square is hurting young adults that have committed no wrong and merely sought to play the game of football while receiving a higher education. That is the net effect of vacating those wins.

I also can't square hurting young adults that seek to play football and get their education at Penn State. That is the net effect of taking ten scholarships per year. These adults did nothing wrong. They simply may want to go to school close to home and have the ability to play in Division I football.

Penalizing these young adults for something they had no connection with is wrong.

Brian
_________________________
"When we go into battle, I will be the first to set foot on the field, and I will be the last to step off, and I will leave no one behind. Dead, or alive, we will all come home together." LTG Hal Moore, Jr., USA (Ret.)

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#404524 - 07/23/12 06:53 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
MrEdd Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/24/03
Posts: 317
Loc: Texas
It is not possible for the NCAA penalties to be excessive.
Not today, not tomorrow, not yesterday, or any other day.

Football is just a game.
It is diversionary entertainment.
It is nothing more than that.
It can never be more than that.
It is just a bunch of people running around throwing a ball.
Period.

If someone can not grasp this, they have a mental problem. Their mental problem, however, does not make diversionary passtimes of more than the most casual importance.

In addition, if the school doesn't like the rules, it can drop out of the NCAA at any time. The money put into sports could be better spent.

Little boys being raped, is tragic.
That is something important.
Whatever it takes to stop it needs to be done.

For those who don't watch sports, well...
I wouldn't give a crap if a child rape scandal in hollywood caused someones favorite TV show to be canceled - and the actors and script writers could go do something else.

No difference.

Neither is of any importance at all measured against the damage serial pedophiles do.

Ever.

Grow up.
_________________________
Some Things are not problems to be solved, rather, they are facts which must be coped with over time.

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