Before I get to a condensed version of my story, I want to uplift all of you on here who are sharing, and also helping one another thrive. It is encouraging to "hear" the honesty behind the words.

OK, here goes....I am the wife of a survivor. I will get into details of that later, as things progress. Right now, I need to know if there are stages one goes through to get to the other side, where healing starts ? Almost 5 years of marriage feels like 50. I wonder if I am helping my husband any by being this cry baby with every hateful word, and selfish action he takes. Why do I feel so hurt each time ? There are short periods of time, I can shake it off, but most times I can not. I have often thought, if I were stronger and tougher and set boundaries right from the beginning, I wouldn't be here struggling so much. Of course, I think about alot of things that might work. Truth is, I do not know anymore. What I do know, is I used to be this confident, capable woman, and now I feel like a non-entity. I keep thinking, "It's not OK, It's not OK, It's not OK !"
I think because I am this overly-sensitive, want to help person, it has depleted any good I might bring to him.

Just tonight things got busted up, harsh words were thrown at me, and off he went, tearing up the yard, and running over a tree I planted in memory of my Dad. I break down and cry so deeply, I start throwing up. How can I help, if he is not even at a point to think he has a problem ? Is there ever a time when a survivor will let love in ? Or am I just walking on eggshells for nothing ? What can I do ?

there are many smarter folks around here than me who will see your post and respond. But for now you're stuck with me. I will respond as if I am the healthy survivor who has come out the other side. My own wife reminds me it wasn't that long ago that I was doing these things so I cannot claim to be past these actions for good, just for now.

First of all I am sorry to hear about the emotional abuse you are suffering, about the alienation and about the hurtful actions. These are the actions of a man who is ddeply hurt somewhere inside but he does not know where. Because I have lived with this hurt so long it feels like a part of my identity. Like the color of my hair. When I cause ruin I am reacting. This is not malicious and premeditated but, for you it no less painful to bear. Again, as an emotional abuser I am sorry.

You are doing the right thing for now. As a victim who was abondoned and abused I constantly tested and I needed the constancy of a supportive partner. I don't know why I did what I did. I just needed to do hurtful things. I pushed away. I got mean. I went AWOL. All to test. To see if I was really, truly loved. I was broken and undesirable and it was unimaginable that anyone would love something as ugly and dispicable as myself. So I tested to see if the love was true. Or was it really like I thought -all some game to get something from me? Your stability is vital but the victim is still lost in the cycles of self-destruction.

By trying to destroy a personal relationship I am trying to destroy myself. I feel unworthy. I feel angry because I am so unworthy. But there is somebody else's life that I am also destroying: my partners. As a victim I cannot see the collateral damage I cause. I only know the suffering that I endure every day. Once in a while I may recognize a horrible thing I've done but it was becuase of some reason. You made me do it.

There is a wise man here named Anomalous who talks about raising the bottom. Not putting up with the abusive behavior for your own sake, for your own mental health and sanity. No one can tell you where that threshhold is for you. With the assitance of a counselor you may be able to define that for yourself. But moving forward, you will need to decide how long the victim is going to run your world.

I am seeing the light. I was a victim, mired in self-hate and destructive cycles that hurt everyone around me. I was fine. The world had problems. I am now a survivor. A survivor reaches out for help. A survivor makes changes to become healthy. A survivor repair the broken peices of his life. This takes time, years... decades for me. But I am doing it. The road was steep and painful and it only seemed to get worse. But eventually it did get easier and as it got easier I was able to see real changes in myself.

No one made me change. I got fed-up with being so broken and sick. Finally, after 30 years of denial I had a massive breakdown... naked and fetal weeping on the ground. I said to my wife, you're right. This self-destruction has got to stop. No one can tell you what to do. (We get in trouble for telling others what to do) We can only advise you how understand and how to manage this very painful situation.

Above all, You have to feel safe and respected. It's not always about him. I am so very, very sorry.

scottyg....Thank you for your caring response. The tears started flowing at your..."First of all I am sorry..." I had a text message from my husband yesterday not long after he left for work in his fit of rage. It said, "I am sorry about my fit of rage today.I am sorry if I hurt your feelings." The past 2 days he has been in his "I'm OK, you're OK state." It is in those times that I feel more confused than ever, because he's play-acting a role just to get something from me. I try to see if I can gain some understanding of what is going on inside of him, but he won't ever get to a point of realizing that this game he keeps playing is our life. Everything is a joke. One of the things in these past 2 days I mentioned to him was he never says he's sorry, so I now feel he is taking each thing I say and turning it around to keep me here under his control. Each time he snaps in rage, it just gets worse. Our home is falling apart from his tantrums. He fixes things for a living, and no one would ever believe what our home looks like. He goes after my stuff, never his own. His direction is always towards me. I know that what he really wants to do is instead of hitting the wall, he wants to hit me. I think the only reason he has not, is he knows I would never let him see the light of day if he laid his hands on me. That is not comforting, but it does let me know that he recognizes boundaries. I have never been afraid of him when he goes around tearing up things. I have stood a foot away from him when he is punching his fist in the wall. I am not saying that to sound brave. I am not naive enough to believe that give him some time, and he will, if not helped, cross that boundary line, because each time now he's doing things that can't be cleaned up or hidden. This time he broke the window in the kitchen, and picked up a concrete block he put in the living room to sit on while he puts his boots on, and smashed it on the ceramic tile entryway. Maybe he's getting tired of hiding.

You talked about my threshold. It must be pretty high. I went to a counselor last year to get help for me. I wanted answers as to why I am here in this situation, and what if anything I could do to help him. You know what she told me ? I was the strongest woman she'd ever met. I wasn't like all the other women that come in there, beaten up, and beaten down, and defeated, and having to stay with him because I needed a man. That's what she said. I encouraged her every time I came in there. I was staying with him because I had made a choice to. I was not there because I had to be. That is what she said. She said I was his light, even though he did not see it yet. OK, to say the least, that "observation" did not make me feel any better, or give me any answers. I so wanted to reach out to those other women she spoke of, and learn what this whole thing was about. In short, I felt like I WAS one of those other women. Just because I don't show physical bruises on the outside, does not mean my insides are not dying. I don't know if it is possible to totally transfer what he is feeling inside to what I experience everyday, but I feel everything intensely, and all of the words he describes...numb and dead inside. The only difference is my faith renews hope inside of me everyday. Something he does not share with me. I wake up each morning thankful to breathe and have 24 hours more to make a difference in this world. I sometimes think, my husband is what God wants me to make a difference with first. I may be wrong though.

Thank you scottyg for your concern, and for sharing your thoughts and part of what you are trying to do in your own life. It means alot to me. You are right about the meaning of survivor....my husband is still a victim, and until he reaches out for help, he will remain so. I am here loving him, but I have got to stop being his victim. I have to start TODAY.

Have a blessed day !!!

HI Haven Lost

I am so sorry that you are stuck in this.

My heart is more for the partners of Survivors rather than the men in denial that their lives have been affected by their childhood.

There is only one person that can change things, and that is you. The things that you can change are the things that affect you, you can control your actions and your thoughts and the more you become independent and confident, the more he will have to reassess what is happening to him.

There is a book called "Co-Dependent no more by Melody Beattie"
It is a tremendous book for Partners of survivors, and although you might not think you are Co-Dependent, you will notice that you are.

Work on yourself, work on your self confidence, self worth, and you will be surprised at how he changes the way he looks at life.
Don't try to control manipulate, or coerce your husband into healing or dealing with his past, JUST START LIVING FOR YOU.

I hope this helps you

Heal well
Martin

Martin (whome)....Thanks for the words of encouragement. I think I have that book somewhere around here. I will look for it. I have no doubt that I have fallen leaps and bounds underneath all of this focus on him. I know that is wrong. I always thought I never had a problem with confidence, or self worth, but now I question myself on everything. I wonder how I could fall into all of this if I were indeed that type of person to begin with, but that is what these days are about, unfortunately, I question everything now, except my faith. Just this morning I am questioning whether I want to be here when he gets home from work ( he works 3rd shift) or if I want to go over my Mom's and let him see the broken glass in the sink and smashed concrete block on the tile on his own. Part of me wants to see if this time he will see he has work to do on himself, and now is the time, but you're right, my whole world has become what he is going to do or say that will affect my whole day. Maybe that is the answer. I need to go.
My stomach hurts all of the time, and I'm afraid that all of this is going to cause some irreversible damage to my well being that I can not get over. I keep waiting on him, when I need to be living for me. I'm going to go. Have a fabulous day !!!

Havenlost

Yep, Your life now revolves around what he thinks and feels. This is the worst way to live.

Remember that leaving him does not mean the end. It is just a step in the process. Besides you dont have to leave him, it is not a law, as I say it is just a tool.

Keep working on yourself, work on your well being and mental health.


Heal well
Martin

Haven~

I understand so much of what your saying and I see myself in your words. It has been 8 years since my husband told me of his CSA. I was the first person he ever told and that was the first time he ever said it out loud. We had been married for 4 years and had two small toddlers at the time. I found that there was a long period after him telling me that he never spoke of it again. But his abuse of alcohol increased, his self loathing increased and all of his other self distructive behaviors increased. He went a long time thinking that his abuse had not affected him in anyway.

I tried to keep the peace and did EVERYTHING I could not to set him off. In the process I lost who I was and what I believed in, I lost my self confidence, I became depressed, and I looked at my boys and told them I was so sorry for bringing them into this mess. I finally hit a low and got some help to realize that I control my happiness, I am in control of my self esteem and I would no longer ALLOW him to hurt me. I need to be in control of me! I make that sound easy and it wasn't....It took time, lots of self talk, staying present in the moment and I took lots of steps backwards.

My DH constantly tested my love and trustworthiness. That is what it seems like your husband may be doing. It doesn't make it right but it is what they do. I posted in another post that at one point I felt like I was dealing with a third small child. Then it hit me...I was! He was testing me in the same exact way our two children tested our love as parents. He was stuck emotional as a small boy.

I finally had to give him a choice~ Get the help he needed or I needed to take the boys and leave. Not because I didn't love him but because I loved him deeply and I knew that he didn't want the boys seeing him self destructive and learning that treating others this way was OK. He needed to get help to keep the family that he said he wanted. I don't recommend giving an ultimatum as it could back fire but I knew my husband and I knew it would work. He got into personal counseling and we went to marriage counseling too. It has been a long, hard walk but we are making it!

I have chosen not to leave this marriage but that is my choice and this is my story. Each of has to decided what we can live with and without. My marriage isn't going to be the marriage I thought it was when I got married in 2000. The man I married then and the man I am married to now are different. I love them both. I have posted my almost complete story on these boards and if I knew how to put the link on here I would. But please PM me with any questions, thoughts or concerns. We are all here to support one another. I am so happy to have found this place!

Great post! I agree that in many ways we are like small children acting out and throwing fits. The difference is we can throw cinder blocks and crush floor tiles. This emotional immaturity is something to keep in mind during interactions. It does no good to speak to somebody in the throes of denial as if he's a rational agent who's in touch with his motivations. My wife and I used to fight a lot due to my bad behavior. When she yelled and screamed I responded in kind, meeting her with even louder yelling. I wanted her to descend into dysfunctional behaviors so we could both be wrong. But when she calmly asserted that I had behaved badly without the angry yelling, simply by factually reporting my hurtful actions the confrontation lost its teeth. It had a much deeped impact. Of course, even though I got the message I still yelled and went off in a huff. But I was acting like a child. The partner speaking from a place of authority and emotional maturity will make the point far better that the partner who's drawn in to a highly charged emotional display. As far as the later aplogies being a manipulation, perhaps. However, I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt. His apologies could also mean that he's finally aware of how deeply dysfunctional and hurtful he has become. I might suggest you use an apology event as a teaching moment. Rather than accept it at face value, perhaps you could reflect aloud that this constant destruction is not acceptable. Ask him what he's willing to do to beyond this cycle. Start a dialogue about healing. Don't push the issue just ask for input. I wonder if in a moment of apology he would recognize that changes needed to be made? It's a huge positive step.

Now to get geeky. On my computer Male Survivor web space works better in Internet Explorer than Firefox. When responding with embedded links switch to the "Full Reply Screen" The icons at the top will allow you to flag your post with an emoticon. For instance, I used a lightbulb icon to flag this post. Below the icon bank is the formatting tool bar the 2nd from the left is the hyperlink tool. Copy the http address from another post and paste the address into the first dialogue box. Next insert the text phrase you want to use as the link. I've included a link to my story as an exapmple.

Hey everyone, Sorry for the delay in reply. I have been over my Mom's house and she has no internet connection. I just got back here to my "home" tonight.

I have lots of thoughts about several things you all have brought up. When I got home and found that the glass from the sink was picked up, but it was piled full of dishes, and no apparent attempt to fix the window, and the concrete block was stacked on top of itself and pushed to the side, but not taken outside, and it looks like he tried to put the little pieces of tile back in their prospective cracks, it indeed makes me see him as a little boy not even knowing what to do. I have visited that scenario before...the one where it seems like I am having to raise a child instead of live a life with an equal partner. I don't like that scenario. It never leaves me with any answers as to how to proceed with my life. I don't want to be my husband's mommy. Speaking of which, there are so many deep seeded issues he has with her. My Mom has brought up if I think he thinks I am his Mom when he flies into a rage. I had to say "maybe." Throughout the years, I have had to piece things together with his family. There is so much that is swept under the rug and hush hush, that I don't know where to turn for answers. It was just this past year that I tried to enlist his Step Dad with getting some understanding. He acted like he was shocked about some things my husband was doing to me, but as more things got shared, he got a little overwhelmed with it all, and honestly I think it became way too familiar of his life with his own wife, my husband's mom, so I just stopped sharing, then all was well. That seems to be something that was taught in his family....put on a happy face to the world and act as if nothing wrong is happening. How do you ever heal that way ???

Part of me feels like I need to take a stand and fight. I have been weakened by all of this mess, but I know I still have strength in me. I want to tell him....who does he think he is ? I am not what caused his pain, and I should not be punished because of it. I am the only one who took a chance with him, and decided to love him. I did not know all of this stuff until we were married, but I knew enough to know something was wrong, and I still decided to love him, and it is as if he hates that fact, like loving him is a foreign language that he cannot understand, and cannot reciprocate, and I still stay one more day hoping that will be the day he stops running from himself, and decides to let someone in. I feel like I need to tell him I am taking my life back and our home and the fits of rage stops right here and right now. I am sick of being controlled. I don't even know who is looking back at me in the mirror anymore. My heart aches for the self-imposed prison he puts himself in, but how can I ever be of any help if I myself have allowed him to put me in there with
him ? I keep thinking....does he know...really know the devastation he is putting me through ? Is he so alone that the only way to feel anything is to make me feel it too ? I have told him that I do feel all of it, his happy boy days that are only a prelude to the windup of demonstrative rage that follows leaves me numb like he says he feels. I could write long lists of things he keeps taking from me, only to have you question the validity of my words, because it seems so far fetched....but that is just it....this is my reality. I married a man who was abused, who now chooses to abuse me, and by remaining in this situation, I am letting him continue, and that is not helping him, and it is just destroying me, so is it as simple as walking away ? Will that be what it takes to makes him get help, or should I make my stand ? Didn't somebody once say that if you stand up to a bully they stop bullying, because it is the manipulation and control that keep them in their place of hierarchy ?

One more thing...I am not naive enough to believe that his anger will cease to continue to escalate and he will stop destroying our house and turn on me, do I want to wait for that ?

I will re-read the posts here and suggested "stories" and respond later with more specific details. It truly helps to know somebody out there is "listening" to my ramblings and giving advice to not only help me, but ultimately my husband. I can't express how much you guys are appreciated.

Havenlost-

You need herowannabe! I've pasted a favorite post from her reply to a similar partner as yourself. I recommend you read the wisdom in everything she's posted on MS.