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#404413 - 07/22/12 09:53 PM * [Re: LN3(SS)]
Smalltown80sBoy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/25/12
Posts: 2217
*


Edited by Smalltown80sBoy (04/28/13 06:13 PM)

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#404414 - 07/22/12 09:56 PM * [Re: SamV]
Smalltown80sBoy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/25/12
Posts: 2217
*


Edited by Smalltown80sBoy (04/28/13 06:13 PM)

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#404461 - 07/23/12 10:14 AM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
LN3(SS) Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/20/08
Posts: 486
Loc: MD
I think the "moral responsibility" thing can be argued forever. He fulfilled his "moral responsibility" when he met the legal responsibility the law assigned him. That's essentially what the law is: a moral judgment on what we may and may not do.

Scotty,

1) Paterno should never have been involved in ANY discussions afterward, if he was. Once the information was reported to the designated officials (Spanier and Curley), it was THEIR responsibility under Pennsylvania law to report the matter to police. Having further discussions was against the law. Spanier and Curley will pay the price. Further, we do know that Paterno never used email. Therefore there are no documents that prove what Paterno might have said.

2) Regardless of whether Paterno was the "most powerful leader on campus" or not, his job title was that of head football coach. Not "designated recipient of child abuse reports." That distinction means that he had the ability to do exactly what he did under Pennsylvania law: report the abuse to the official so authorized.

3) If we are concluding that reporting to the school administration is a hollow gesture, then we better change that law. That is the process the Pennsylvania legislature set up for reporting abuse: reporting within the confines of an institution. This is never a good thing. But a person that follows the law, as written, should not then be accused of failing to do his part to protect abuse victims.

Brian
_________________________
"When we go into battle, I will be the first to set foot on the field, and I will be the last to step off, and I will leave no one behind. Dead, or alive, we will all come home together." LTG Hal Moore, Jr., USA (Ret.)

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#404466 - 07/23/12 11:03 AM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
catfish86 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/27/09
Posts: 826
Loc: Ohio
Brian, I once admired Joe Paterno and Penn State. My high school iss a football power house in NE Ohio and JoePa was a frequent visitor. Joe's actions were off the charts. He knew of the investigation with emails stating he was eager to know the progress and mysteriously a very embarassing prosecution was avoided. There is so much that stinks in the program and the whole scenario. I can tell you from players talking about colleges,etc that JoePa spoke and it happened at PSU. Had he said punish and stop Sandusky, it would have happened. We have emails saying he did the exact opposite. He not only looked the other way, he gave Sandusky all the tools to continue. That is why his statue is removed and he lost every win since the 1998 shower incident. We all know the patterns and behaviors of predators. We all know it would be surprising if it hadn't been going on since 1969 when Sandusky first started coaching at Penn State. I can tell you that people considered PSU were told you had to accept the fact that even if you were the ball boy Joe Paterno would know if you farted at the dinner table. Tell me he didn't know a lot longer than just 1998.
_________________________
God grant me
The Serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The Courage to change the things I can,
And the Wisdom to know the difference.

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#404475 - 07/23/12 12:58 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
Merci Offline


Registered: 07/23/12
Posts: 2
Loc: U.S.
I joined this discussion forum today hoping to find some conversation involving Penn State that did not defend Paterno, and of all places, here in a survivor space, the excuses continue.

Brian, as you pointed out, Joe did report to Curley and Spanier, yet that was the bare minimum requirement. Anyone in a position of authority at an educational facility, which includes athletic coaches, who receives information pertaining to an imminent threat to the safety and well being of young children should be expected to respond far above that minimum requirement. Maintaining a safe environment on campus by following up on what actions could have been taken against Sandusky is no violation of any law. Paterno's lack of concern for anything but his pride helped bring the situation at Penn State to where it is now.

The sanctions seem reasonable, with less punishment for current athletes and the brunt of the backlash on Paterno's legacy as a hero on the field while a coward at heart.
_________________________
"None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free."
-Goethe

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#404487 - 07/23/12 02:21 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
tshodson Offline


Registered: 06/13/12
Posts: 131
Paterno's family reacts. Calls the President of Penn State's response to the NCAA ruling a "panicked response to the public's understandable revulsion." They wanted a full hearing before the NCAA...Please...

http://www.wishtv.com/dpps/sports/footba..._medium=twitter

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#404492 - 07/23/12 03:04 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
cant_remember Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/05
Posts: 1046
Merci,

Welcome to MS. We're sorry you need us; but we're glad you're here.

As for Brian and his defense of Paterno, don't let it bother you.

Today is a good day for survivors because we've been heard. Our brave brothers who took the stand against Sandusky have saved an untold number of future victims the grief of becoming survivors like us.

There's still a long road ahead for this story, but the Cult of Paterno is now dead.
_________________________
Recovery is possible. Hang in there, brothers.

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#404493 - 07/23/12 03:38 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
tshodson Offline


Registered: 06/13/12
Posts: 131
Paterno's family says that NCAA "defamed the legacy" of a great coach...OMG...He was not a god...He was a flawed individual as we all are ....

"The sanctions announced by the NCAA today defame the legacy and contributions of a great coach and educator without any input from our family or those who knew him best,” they said.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/post/paterno-family-calls-ncaa-penalties-against-penn-state-a-panicked-response/2012/07/23/gJQAm4bn4W_blog.html?Post+generic=%3Ftid%3Dsm_twitter_washingtonpost
Paterno family calls NCAA penalties against Penn State a ‘panicked response’

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#404499 - 07/23/12 04:02 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: catfish86]
jls Offline


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 1142
Do Paterno’s successes as a football coach somehow mitigate or erase his failings at moral leadership? It shouldn’t, yet there are so many similar examples of people willing to jump to the defense of notable persons despite the wrong they have done. The defenders of Michael Jackson and Roman Polanski come to mind. Yes both contributed much as artists yet the fact can’t be escaped that both also sexually abused children. However, we still have multitudes that jumped to their defense as if their abusive behaviour was in spite of their importance as artists, and not in part because of it. Both Jackson and Polanski used their elevated positions to abuse children, and to some degree Paterno did the same thing by turning away from his moral responsibility to protect children in order to protect Penn State’s football program instead, which by extension was for his own gratification. Like with Jackson and Polanski, I have no problem saying that Paterno was greatly talented and a giant in his chosen profession but I won’t for an instant excuse his greater moral failings as a human being because of his worldly accomplishments. Just my thoughts.
_________________________
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world.


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#404500 - 07/23/12 04:18 PM Re: PLEASE -- Give up the Paterno Defense [Re: tshodson]
jls Offline


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 1142
At the risk of sounding self-righteous yes I have my flaws but I don't consider myself nearly as flawed as Paterno was. For example, I would never put my "legacy" or position in life ahead of protecting the vulnerable, but perhaps that is a lesson I've learned from being a survivor.
_________________________
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world.


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