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#399152 - 06/01/12 07:05 PM Re: self condemnation [Re: nebius]
KMCINVA Offline
Greeter
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 1610
Esposa

Your first two sentences are so true--child or adult no one deserves to be abused. How it affects the victim is so different for each person. I know what happened to me, and I to this day grapple and do not understand why I did what I did to cope. I question myself, so should others--probably yes-but should they also look at the total picture?

It is a horrible thing to have your life robbed at any point in life--child or adult. A child does not have a mature mind and that part of the child never matures always shamed, feeling self guilt, distrustful--just disgusted with themselves. The child seeks relief through drugs, alcohol, sex, suicide, recreating being the victim now in control--but the a relief of the pain is temporary--never permanent. The adult with a mature mind must feel totally violated,deprived of being in charge and control, shamed and guilt ridden by understanding what happened.

And those around them do not see their pain. And not knowing the victims pain and only seeing what they did to live with the pain and these actions hurt them. So many lives ruined and destroyed by the hands of an abuser who leaves and never knows the pain but leaves a path of destroyed lives. I only recently could adamantly say I was raped. I could write it but at the race to Stop CSA I said it out loud after admitting why I was there--and it relived some pain and hurt. I began to despise my rapist. Yes that is the right word.

Too many hurt, too many robbed of joy and happiness--the victim and those around them suffer more than the abuser. So let us all be kind to each other, reach out, understand their pain, and not condemn what they are living through. The victim if a child has decades of pain and those around maybe far less years, the adult victim with a more developed and mature mind must be experiencing excruciating pain and thoughts because they totally comprehend the damages of rape.

I, like everyone here has been through such grief and loss of self. But the pain of being raped can not be understand by those who have not experienced such loss and the betrayal to those around us cannot be totally understood by the victim, we have different pain and hurt. But to the victim it is loss of self and who we are or believe we should be or confused as to who we are. We are robbed of a belief we deserve to live and be happy because our bodies were robbed and violated and unknowingly it affected our minds and hearts.

Have a priest penetrate you as a child and tell me your pain is the same and your mind has not been destroyed as to who who you are. Yes everyone is in pain, no pain is acceptable and the degree of pain cannot be measured because it differs for all of us. So let us show compassion for each other.

We all need support and help.


Edited by KMCINVA (06/01/12 07:16 PM)

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#399154 - 06/01/12 07:28 PM Re: self condemnation [Re: nebius]
KMCINVA Offline
Greeter
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 1610
Esposa

After I wrote the above it was not directed at you. But I responded to you, it was a generally vomment. Sorry about thay.

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#399156 - 06/01/12 08:15 PM Re: self condemnation [Re: Esposa]
prisonerID Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/17/08
Posts: 1247
Loc: Oklahoma
Any victim can tell you though how questions are asked is very important.


Daryl
_________________________
Broad statements often miss their true mark.

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#399158 - 06/01/12 08:39 PM Re: self condemnation [Re: nebius]
earlybird Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/17/10
Posts: 1007
Loc: WA USA
Iíve wrestled at length with this thread and peopleís responses struggling deepest with my own conflicting thoughts. I need this type of controversy, though somewhat painful, because it makes me think and rethink my position on things.

Though I believe I can somewhat understand and empathize where some of the ďdoubtersĒ of this manís story are coming from I, as an ASA man, also know the fear and agony of not being believed and my motives questioned. I have to be honest and admit I also have some real internal questions concerning the information given which is (understandably) too inefficient for me to arrive at a clear knowledge of the events that occurred or the motivations of another individual I do not know. I at best can only speculate yet mustnít I remain open to an answer other than that born out of my suspicions. I canít (nor, in my opinion, should anyone) use my own experience as a measuring stick to the legitimacy of another manís situation. Iím too biased to be impartial.

Iíve really grappled with the pain of my confliction pertaining to this thread and have come to the conclusion that sense this is not a court of law no man here should have to prove their innocence. If he is lying to cover his tracks, as implied, then shame on him and heíll have to face the consequences that will surely come later. However if he is telling the truth then there is a greater harm done (and by me) by mistrusting him. Itís clear I donít know the ďtruthĒ and sense here at MS we are not part of the judicial system I must fall on the side of supporting this couple and their storyĖ even though Iím puzzled by the situation as presented thus far. But damn, doubt is common and at times Iím puzzled by my own rape and I was there.

Thanks to everyone who has shared their thoughts for each position has caused me to evaluate which is what I need and why Iím here.

Neibus, I especially owe you a thanks for opening up, taking a risk and sharing your story with us. I have little doubt that this is and will continue for years to come to be a tough road that you and your husband are on. It is my hope alone with EVERYONE here that you find support and comfort at MS and elsewhere.

First and foremost Ė be kind to yourself and take careful care.
_________________________
Balanced (My goal)

There is symmetry
In self-reflection
Life exemplified
Grace personified

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#399187 - 06/02/12 09:10 AM Re: self condemnation [Re: earlybird]
GBWU Offline


Registered: 04/21/12
Posts: 17
Earlybird,

Well said. Nebius needs support and so does her husband. Like you said if he is not telling the truth it will come out. It always does.

I must say it use to bother me if I thought people did not believe what happened to my husband, but I could care less now. My only concern is that he continues speaking to his therapist twice a week and we continue seeing a family therapist once a week together. He is taking all the steps necessary to try and recovery from this and recover as a married couple. It's not been easy at all. Last night was another major breakdown. The anger he feels towards his rapist takes over his life and the constant wondering why she chose him. The constant question of why me!

The breakthrough for us has been not to keep this deep dark secret any longer and finding wonderful therapists. These ladies are fantastic and very supportive. Our family therapist said it best, if it turns out this child carries my husbandís DNA the only thing the rapist can gain is money, but she can never gain your soul. Absolutely true! It does not change the fact that he was raped. Nothing changes that.

Someone asked Nebius has her husband filed a police report, etc. The reality is that men are not going to report rape for fears which we all know. One attorney we spoke to about my husband's rape said the worse decision he made was not going to the police the next morning, but he stated to my husband he understood why he didn't. It's hard for a woman to report rape so how can we expect a man? As my brother in-law (police officer) told me unfortunately the courts will probably not care how the child was conceived, as a society we just aren't there yet. So let's be clear, to think that a man's first reaction is to go to the cops after he's been raped is not living in reality. Thereís no support system in place for a man and that has to change.

I'll use my husband's real rape for an example of how society does not care what happens to an adult male. In this case female on male rape. Would any of you QUESTION a woman who was intoxicated and decided she had enough and went to bed in her own apartment only to find out the next day that a man she did not know came in her place of residence uninvited and raped her? Remember the law is clear when it comes to incapacitation (drugs, alcohol, etc.). But yet because my husband is an adult male, it's OK to violate him because he's a male- he should have been able to protect himself. If he didn't want it he wouldn't have ejaculated. He wasn't THAT drunk because he was aroused. It's just nonsense and we are talking about people's lives here. REAL PEOPLE!

I know if the roles were reversed there would be no questioning of the man's guilt. The fact is none of us know for sure how we are going to react when a life-altering event happens. I was one of those people who did not believe a man could be raped. I was one of those people who would say he/she should have done this, should have done that. Like I knew all the answers. Not anymore.

In the coming weeks we will know if this child carries my husbandís DNA then we move on to child support hearing. There are many decisions to be made. We have been told are case covers different departments of the justice system: family law, criminal law, and civil law. The attorney has made it clear it is up to my husband if he wants to proceed beyond the child support hearing. We found out the rapist wants my husbandís name removed from the birth certificate. She wants to supposedly leave the country. She supposedly tried to get the child support hearing dismissed, but she canít because she is on welfare. She no longer has the power and she knows it.

I feel for all the men out there who have no support system. What happens to them? I've learned so much from this horrible ordeal my husband and I are going through. I want to do something to help, but I don't know what that something is yet. It will come to me.

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#399189 - 06/02/12 09:28 AM Re: self condemnation [Re: nebius]
Obi Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/28/09
Posts: 1303
Loc: kansas
excellent post, gbwu!!!!!

thank you!
_________________________
live another day. climb a little higher.

my story

my vlog

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#399195 - 06/02/12 10:23 AM Re: self condemnation [Re: GBWU]
prisonerID Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/17/08
Posts: 1247
Loc: Oklahoma
GBWU,

Thank you for a firsthand commentary from the point of view of a loved one to a male ASA. Your insight is very valuable for not only men who have been raped but also for all others on this site. I admire how you have taken your own pain in the direction of healing for your yourself and your husband.

I very much appreciate this sharing of some of your personal story in this. I hope that it helps Nebius and other women who might come here in a similar tragedy in their lives. I hope it also encourages men who were assaulted as adults to see that judgment and condemnation are not the automatic responses of all connected to a survivor. Perhaps it will help them to open up to their wives, husbands, partners or others in their lives.

It sounds like you and your husband are on the right path which is inspiring in many ways.


Daryl
_________________________
Broad statements often miss their true mark.

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#399216 - 06/02/12 04:59 PM Re: self condemnation [Re: nebius]
lucylives Offline


Registered: 04/07/11
Posts: 358
WAs Nebius' husband drunk? I missed that part. I really am curious how he ended up alone with this woman. I can't imagine the pain of a man being raped. I can imagine that of a woman as I have been there. I was physically over powered and that is a very scary thing, indeed.

I have read many of the stories from men on here about how they met someone online (behind their wives' backs for a little triste) and it went horribly wrong or hooked up with a prostitute and it went horribly wrong. Were they raped? Yes. Did they put themselves in a very dangerous position with unsafe people? Yes. For example, my husband went to hook up with a hooker and guess what? She stole his pants and his wallet. Do I feel sorry for him? Nope. If he got raped, I would have but I would also say you put yourself in a horribly dangerous situation. BTW, he still denies the whole thing but I am not stupid. Said his car was broken into and his pants were in there with his wallet in there. Really? I am not an idiot and you hear about this stuff happening all the time.
This reminds me of the movie Fatal Attraction. did the man cheat on his wife? Yes. Did he deserve what he got for that? That is debateable. Maybe, maybe not. (I hope I am not dating myself with the movie reference)

I feel so incredibly bad for Nebius and her husband. It is so hard to imagine what really happened or to give too much sympathy when we don't know the details. We can only go on what we have seen and experienced.

Hang tough, Nebius. When I couldn't quite place my finger on the issues, I prayed for awareness. That was right before D-day. Sometimes I am sorry I prayed for that.

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#399217 - 06/02/12 05:03 PM Re: self condemnation [Re: nebius]
lucylives Offline


Registered: 04/07/11
Posts: 358
And also, as for filing a police report, if he doesn't want to do that because of shame, that is understandable but this nut job at least needs to have a restraining order against her.

No they don't always work but a nutjob like this woman needs to be stopped in her tracks or at least of a record of the harassment with the police.

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#399220 - 06/02/12 06:05 PM Re: self condemnation [Re: Obi]
GBWU Offline


Registered: 04/21/12
Posts: 17
Obi,

Thank you for your kinds words. My husband and I are continuing to take one day at a time. Some days are better than others, but the good days are starting to out weight the bad days. Of course that pendulum could start swinging the other way, but as long as we have each other we know there's light at the end of the tunnel and good things are coming our way.

The key for us has been our therapists. They have literally saved my husband's life. No question about it and have opened my eyes in so many ways.

All the best to you Obi and I mean that with every ounce of my being. The fact that you can speak about what happened to you says everything. You are brave and a survivor.

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