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#389727 - 03/18/12 09:03 PM Re: Can I understand? [Re: Anomalous]
Darkheart Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 331
Loc: Illinois
I would voice mostly what the others have said...my experience was rare and long term, so I have a unique perspective and unique issues. I'm more than willing to share, but I don't want to detract from the topic

Forrest

_________________________
My Story...

http://www.malesurvivor.org/board/ubbthr...8711#Post348711

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#390519 - 03/24/12 12:37 PM Re: Can I understand? [Re: TheTwoOfUs]
CruxFidelis Offline


Registered: 06/16/10
Posts: 486
Loc: NJ
Originally Posted By: TheTwoOfUs


You lose your faith in yourself. I couldn't protect myself or my sister. What the hell makes me think I can protect my wife? My children? I lost all faith in myself, in my ability to take care of, provide for, and protect my family. I was supposed to protect my sister and I failed miserably at that. I had to hurt her to keep her alive! So what the hell makes me think I can protect my kids and my wife? That goes through my mind a LOT, even still.


I can strongly relate to this

_________________________
“If a man wishes to be sure of the road he treads on, he must close his eyes and walk in the dark.”

- Saint John of the Cross

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#390991 - 03/27/12 07:56 AM Re: Can I understand? [Re: CruxFidelis]
peroperic2009 Offline
Moderator
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/09/11
Posts: 3621
Loc: South-East Europe
Dear brothers: Matthew, Anomalus, Darkhearth and CruxFidelis thanks for your inputs.
This was so helpful for me... I'm sorry for your terrible experiences, I'm very sad knowing such things are happening all time and even more when hear how society treats male victims after such assaults. I can't find proper words for all that...
Dear Darkhearth please feel free to share more with us, you can do it here or open new thread (it doesn0t matter), do what you are feeling need to do wink!
Heal Well my brothers!
Pero

_________________________
My story

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#390995 - 03/27/12 09:26 AM Re: Can I understand? [Re: peroperic2009]
JustScott Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/27/08
Posts: 2590
Hey guys, I want to thank each of you for sharing. I guess I take it for granted sometimes that people know I do read each and every post here.

The posts have given me very good insight. I do understand better and I do see a lot of parallels between CSA and ASA but see that each carries it's own parts that are unique.

Thank you for sharing and if others want to continue sharing that would be cool. I would love to see this particular part of the forum become more utilized by those that need it and would like it to help further the cause for adults victims. There certainly is a sad state of affairs when it comes to male victims, but even more so when that victimization took place as an adult.

I've seen a bit of that disparity even among female survivors too. There's this true difference of level of support for girls who are raped and abused vs. women. and I think that effect is even stronger, amplified, and perhaps even multiplied to the extreme for boys vs. men for many different reasons.

I do believe all are valuable. I do believe all deserve help and support. Regardless of when the traumatic events too place.

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#391271 - 03/29/12 12:30 AM * [Re: JustScott]
Smalltown80sBoy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/25/12
Posts: 2217
*


Edited by Smalltown80sBoy (04/28/13 04:53 PM)

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#391850 - 04/02/12 01:22 AM Re: Can I understand? [Re: JustScott]
TheTwoOfUs Offline


Registered: 11/03/11
Posts: 149
Loc: USA
Hi Scott,

I don't mind answering questions like this. The only way for people to begin to educate, be educated, and UNDERSTAND ASA-only cases is to talk about it.

I'm glad it helped... that's all. The more people understand about ASA, the more likely the proffessionals and fields that work with sexual assault are to actually TREAT male ASA properly, or at least to TRY.

Right now we get largely blown off, and that's bullshit.
_________________________
Matthew

Adapt. Overcome. Survive.

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#392196 - 04/04/12 04:46 PM Re: Can I understand? [Re: TheTwoOfUs]
LN3(SS) Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/20/08
Posts: 486
Loc: MD
I would add a lack of resources.

Male ASA is not accepted. There are no real world support groups that specifically cater to ASA.

There are no retreats for male ASA survivors. There are many options open for male CSA survivors. If your issue is not CSA there is a difficult time fitting in and not being triggered by activities that CSA survivors can do.

I have been asked here and out in the real world why I didn't fight back, how can a man be raped, etc.

Brian
_________________________
"When we go into battle, I will be the first to set foot on the field, and I will be the last to step off, and I will leave no one behind. Dead, or alive, we will all come home together." LTG Hal Moore, Jr., USA (Ret.)

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#392243 - 04/05/12 12:04 AM Re: Can I understand? [Re: LN3(SS)]
Anomalous Offline
Greeter Coordinator
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 03/07/10
Posts: 1355
****** TRIGGER WARNING ******

Hi All,

As we have all stated in our own ways, the abuse and assault of adult males is denied and rejected by society.

Adult women are blamed, especially by other women, for having been raped. "They wore the wrong clothes," or "they shouldn't have been at a certain place at a certain time of day/ night" are many of the things said about women who are attacked.

Adult males are blamed, too. We hear things such as "I would never LET it happen to me," as though one "let" the abuse or assult happen.

"Why didn't you fight back, " and "men can't be raped" are also some of the derogatory, ignorant and harmful things we hear. Sadly, some of those words come from the very professionals who we seek out for help.

Women are told NOT to fight back. It is more important to survive than it is to fight a fight which often results in death.

We are emasculated and ridiculed by other men. Women think a man who "let" himself be assaulted is "less" of a man.

Men are harsh on males who reveal they have been abused/ assaulted. Many, in a false display of bravado or masculinity, will verbally and physically torment the male who was abused/ assualted, as though they can "prove" to themselves that it could never happen to them. Men additionally torment the abused/ assaulted male, by questioning his sexuality and whether or not he is really a "closet homosexual" (as though homosexuality is something of which to be ashamed).

We all know that abuse/ assault is about power and control. Yet those who torment, ridicule and emasculate us try to make it seem otherwise.

Men are seen as "weak" or otherwise lacking if we don't fight back.

Those who say such things often say them out of their own sense of fear or inadequacy. If they were in the same positions they, too, would not be able to fight back.

Before I compiled the resource list in this forum, I had created a resource list before this forum existed. The list of resources on the original list is much shorter.

One of the major differences is that when I compiled the original list, there were NO books written exclusively about, and for, guys who were abused/ assaulted as adults.

There is still a very long way to go before we have sufficient resources for therapy, both individually and groups, and before the therapeutic community becomes sufficiently educated about this to be able to help us.

As with the sexual abuse/ assault of children, and later of adult women, education will be the key that brings to light the truth about the very dire consequences, and needs, of adult males who have been sexually abused/ assaulted.

Though it is slow in coming, the definition of rape is being changed to include males.

Where the definition was only about a male forcing himself on a female, the current definition of rape is:

"A penis or object inserted into the vagina or the anus, or a penis inserted into the mouth."

This is the definition of rape being taught by a sexual abuse awareness program in several schools. This course is also including information about female abusers, and that sexual abuse/ assault is about power and control.

The knowledge and acceptance of the abuse and assault of adult males is where the knowledge of the abuse and assault of adult women was forty years ago.

Things are changing, in the therapeutic community and within ourselves.

Not only are we sensitive of language which does not include ASA issues, we are pushing for change. We are making sure we do not remain invisible.

We may not have had a voice while we were being abused and assaulted, but we have a voice now.

It would be great if we never had to educate people about these horrors. But since the abuse and assualts are not going to stop anytime soon, the best we can do is to make sure we have the services and the support we need to deal with this.





Anomalous
_________________________
Acceptance on someone else's terms is worse than rejection.

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#393650 - 04/16/12 02:52 PM Re: Can I understand? [Re: JustScott]
peroperic2009 Offline
Moderator
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/09/11
Posts: 3621
Loc: South-East Europe
Thanks guys for educating us, it is really helpfull for me to know more about your pain and to hear about your problems.
I wasn't aware about huge lack of resources for abused adult males, that is terrible evidence of some neglect by society. I hope that this will be improved in near future!
Here is link to some similar thread in Male survivors part of board about chat between CSA victims and ASA victims:
http://www.malesurvivor.org/board/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=393149#Post393149
It seems that ASA brothers are outnumbered here and need some additional support. I wonder how can be that some survivors here don't have enough understanding and empathy for brothers in pain but obviously we humans are very short sighted and forgetful beings... That fact makes me really sad. If we don't want to help, listen and give support how can we expect to get some for ourselves?
Lets stop being selfish and self centered; lets keep this dialogue open and lets learn from each other. It is great feeling to make each other richer with some support and understanding.
Pero
_________________________
My story

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#396035 - 05/04/12 01:59 AM Re: Can I understand? [Re: peroperic2009]
TheTwoOfUs Offline


Registered: 11/03/11
Posts: 149
Loc: USA
Peroperic,

I have to say as someone who is strictly ASA - the outnumbering of CSA versus the ASA folks here can sometimes be an issue. Even in the chatroom there are many times where I actually feel out of it, or as though I do not belong there.

This is part of why I post so rarely, or sporadically.

I do not discount ANYONE'S trauma. ALL of us have suffered trauma(s), regardless of whether that trauma happened as an adult or a child. We are ALL here looking for support and a way to help ourselves, we are ALL here for the same basic reason : healing.

But the PROCESS of that healing is sometimes very different between CSA and ASA, and the language used often shows this as well. For me, being strictly an ASA - and moreover than that, an ASA with forced incest involved in that where we were BOTH adults - with NO prior childhood abuse evident - it sometimess puts me in a corner by myself. Even among the ASA folks, many have CSA or some form of abuse in their childhoods and backgrounds as well - I do not.

All that being said - I am still of the opinion that this is one of the best places for me, and I do still come in and read. I haven't left. I might drop below the radar every so often, but I've never completely left. There are just times where I don't feel like I should be here, that is all. And that is me - not anyone else here - it's my head, I'm sure.

Anyway. This thread does a good job I think of showing some of the differences, but the biggest problem in my opinion is the general attitude of society at large in regards to male survivors. ALL male survivors. Not just CSA or ASA, but ALL of us. There are little to no resources, little to no proffessionals who will work with us, or understand us, and almost zero acknowledgement or understanding from society in general.

Women are re-victimized if they try to report, let alone pursue legal action, yes. But this happens SO much more with males. Sis and I reported ours. I was literally laughed at and told that I must be joking, males "don't have the right equipment" to be raped. The officer literally laughed at it.

And then the proffessional and legal communities wonder why more of us don't report. *shrugs*

We often don't report because we get laughed at, or aren't believed, or re-victimized.

We don't talk about it because our fellows will laugh at us, antagonize us, harass us, or laugh about it behind our backs and pretty much view us as a weakling or less of a man.

We don't seek proffessional help because there aren't many proffessionals who WILL help us or who know HOW to help us.

When I came home from the middle east, it was very easy to get help for the combat related PTSD I had. But I sure as hell haven't been able to find much of any help about this when this happened. If anything, the people who know I served, thought it even more disbelievable BECAUSE I served. "You were such-and-such... you were trained to kill, and they managed to do THAT?" Among other things.

What it boils down to is frustration, shame, and secrecy. And the last two are poisonous, because they keep this from being dealt with and handled appropriately, which allows the offendors to keep doing it, and condemns the victims to suffering alone and in the dark with it.

I consider myself extremely lucky in that my sis has been a HUGE support for me. My eldest son also has a very good idea of what happened, as does my eldest daughter (they are 18 and 16 respectively), and they've been actually very good about it. They might not truly understand it, but they know it happened, and they don't doubt it happened, they know it's real, and they've really tried hard to step in and be little-adults once in a while when I just literally haven't been able to.

But my wife has her own issues she's dealing with, I try to limit the exposure my kids have to any of the fallout from this, even the older two - and even though I HAVE a therapist, he has made it very clear from the start that he isn't entirely sure how to deal with a male victim, and that I might have some times lapse between sessions if he has to go digging for information or help from his co-workers on something.

He's trying, but he's honest about the fact that what I need is certainly NOT his specialty. But he's also the ONLY one I've found so far who was even willing to TRY and work with me.

The proffessional community has a LONG way to go before we can accurately say "there's help available" to us, and the legal community has an even longer way to go before they can accurately say that they're treating male rape and CSA cases as seriously as they do female ones.

Sorry. I guess I just had to say all that tonight... been very frustrated lately... I'll shush now. I'm rambling.
_________________________
Matthew

Adapt. Overcome. Survive.

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