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#382649 - 01/17/12 08:53 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: Edward Wong]
Avery46 Offline


Registered: 09/23/10
Posts: 1243
Loc: USA
This an interesting post guys. I appreciate all of your experiences.

Avery

_________________________
aka DJsport

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#382970 - 01/20/12 04:59 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: westchesterguy]
arty Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/12/04
Posts: 20
Loc: Mass
Originally Posted By: westchesterguy
there is no one to blame for homophobia except the gay community itself.


This is messed up. Would you say the same of Women encountering misogyny? I think not. I have heard this kind of logic before, but it doesn't hold water. Look people have to be responsible for their own actions. If people say mean or hateful things it is not the person they are ripping apart's problem - no matter what!


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#383013 - 01/21/12 06:46 AM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: arty]
westchesterguy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/13/09
Posts: 421
Loc: Westchester County NY
Originally Posted By: arty
....This is messed up. Would you say the same of Women encountering misogyny?


good question arty; i do not view a parallel line of reasoning between society's view/belief of gays and how some men feel about women.

here is a question for you arty: why is it that i along with my three closest friends have nothing to do with, and want nothing to do with the "gay community?"

answer: like it or not, call it prejudice if you will, the gay community that the greater society "accepts to be true" is not who we are. i.e. flags, fetishes, leather, parades, bears, trans(whatever), depicted as such on tv or in movies. not us. and yet it is those exact same reasons why people snicker, post nasty comments online, go out of their way to condemn "gays" in communities around the country.

so, as i stated in the original quote: the gay community must fix their perception problem.

it is the gay community's responsibility to prove itself as "active," "passionate" members of the greater society... not simply demanding special treatment without giving back.

it is the gay community's responsibility to show society they no longer support nambla -- and any other fringe group of yore -- and to show its not just about being in a drag parade.

show society that the gay community is not about promiscuity, show that gays are commitment-oriented and hold high levels of morality.

yes, something is messed up, i agree with that term - but only as it is directed at lack of leadership in the gay community. fix that - homophobia vanishes.


_________________________
Jeff

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#383015 - 01/21/12 09:34 AM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: Avery46]
mike13 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/02/11
Posts: 419
Loc: California USA
Interesting post I never thought I was homophobic but the thought of giving or receiving anal scares the hell out of me. I have had the chance to have many gay friends and had the privilege to be by the side of two gay friends who lost there battle to AIDS. I know it is easy to let the past rule our lives but remember when we let that happen we are only hurting ourselfs.


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#383041 - 01/21/12 06:37 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: westchesterguy]
prisonerID Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/17/08
Posts: 1247
Loc: Oklahoma
No, homophobia will not vanish with any or all of the suggestions that you made here. It will exist in the hearts of those who choose to carry that prejudice until they decide to make a change.

I do think Arty did have a valid point about women since many men blame some of the ills of the country on feminists.

I am what one might term a pretty low key guy who happens to be gay. I could pass as straight if I wished to do so, do not participate in drag in any form and so on. But I do not think I should be considered any more deserving than a guy who leans in the more dramatic direction.

If we begin to decide who deserves rights then some folks will always be left out of the mix. Would we do that within the more core groups of an ethnic group?


Daryl

PS In response to what one post here: I do not think of homophobia as someone who does not wish to have sexual relations with someone of the same sex. That is personal choice as well as one's orientation. I have absolutely no desire to have sex with a woman but do not feel I am "heterosexual-phobic". That is just something I do not desire.



Edited by prisonerID (01/21/12 06:46 PM)
Edit Reason: PS added
_________________________
Broad statements often miss their true mark.

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#383114 - 01/22/12 03:54 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: prisonerID]
westchesterguy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/13/09
Posts: 421
Loc: Westchester County NY
Originally Posted By: prisonerID
No, homophobia will not vanish with any or all of the suggestions that you made here....


i can understand why the suggestions wouldn't resonate as a solution - because they've never been tried....

only nowadays to attempt those suggestions one would have to sell his story as well as counter the media-driven perception of glbt labels. hm, which doesn't happen to include me as their ultra-conservative poster boy.

who is powerful and connected enough to make "gay-related news" about, say, corporate leaders across the fortune 500 sector who have set up college education funds for various disadvantaged kids...or leading a business redevelopment project in a high-unemployment center to bring jobs back from india... rather than making the weekly headline about "who just came out in hollywood" and / or the colorful, gay pride parade as our themed annual headline?

where exactly online are gay executives and professionals discussing economic solutions and ways to fix our broken public education system, which would foster benefits for everyone...rather than hit the fetish websites for bears and feet?

i say there is even more of a reason today to harbor homophobic views if someone in the general population assumes that the fringe represents "all."

what else is visible?

for that reason, i don't draw a parallel with feminism here; firstly, because women are highly visible - they make up the majority of our population (numerically speaking).

secondly, and even though i am a feminist myself, i too understand how the "women's movement" hurt men. and me. equality came, but without a transition. the pool of talent was just dumped in our laps, and doubled within a decade of liberation -- and now women and men compete for the same corporate jobs today that, prior to liberation, only our dads/ grandfathers held.... but the pool of jobs has been in steady decline for 20 years.

as someone actively looking for a new job (where i can be gay without being fired for it), enough recruiters confirm privately to me that "all things being equal" between my CV and that of a female competitor, she would get the job.

therefore, i am the one who has to jump higher, i have go that extra mile.... gays must too if we want to diminish homophobia, in my view.

_________________________
Jeff

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#383124 - 01/22/12 04:27 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: westchesterguy]
ksequoia Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/16/11
Posts: 92
Loc: NYC
This is infuriating. Period. Walk the extra mile so you can hate us a little less? Here are my shoes - now go and walk in them.


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#383128 - 01/22/12 04:53 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: ksequoia]
westchesterguy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/13/09
Posts: 421
Loc: Westchester County NY
Originally Posted By: ksequoia
This is infuriating. Period. Walk the extra mile so you can hate us a little less? Here are my shoes - now go and walk in them.


isn't that the case for survivors as well? society doesn't just wake up one day and totally sympathize with male survivors of sexual abuse.

we have to (or 'had to' since i was doing that in the '90s) educate that "population" of non-survivors that 1) we don't reciprocate pedophilia - so no need to fear us, right? 2) we didn't ask for it, right? the list goes on and you know the score.

how is this any different?


_________________________
Jeff

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#383129 - 01/22/12 05:00 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: westchesterguy]
prisonerID Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/17/08
Posts: 1247
Loc: Oklahoma
I think many gay folks do this day in and day out and is evident in both gay oriented publications as well as in mainstream. This evidence is there for anyone to see if they wish to see the opposite of how they feel towards any population. Including those with an alternative lifestyle.

And that goes for those from within our community as well. Self hatred is abundant within the gay community due to the pressure and prejudice of many from general society. We have to be careful that we do not buy into those lies as well.

Just as survivors of sexual abuse/assault must as well.


Daryl

_________________________
Broad statements often miss their true mark.

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#383131 - 01/22/12 05:59 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: prisonerID]
Anthony39 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/15/07
Posts: 345
Loc: Montreal, Canada
this is all i have to say:

Watch it : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hqp6GnYqIjQ

_________________________
Look up and not down; look forward and not back; look out and not in; and lend a hand.
E. E. Hale


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eM213aMKTHg

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