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#382196 - 01/12/12 01:45 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: Castle]
Chase Eric Offline
Moderator
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/25/10
Posts: 1269
From Ed's (NYC) response right down the line, I am dazzled by the insights! These answers are right on the money. I congratulate Edward Wong for bringing this up - it can't be easy.

I am convinced that most homophobia derives from fear, not hatred. I'm sure you may have heard of the Reverend Fred Phelps, pastor of the Westboro Baptist Church (GodHatesFags.com). A friend of mine nonchallantly said of him, "Oh, he's definitely gay."

Hmmm... At first I didn't agree. How could someone so violently anti-gay possibly be ... gay? But thinking about it for a long time, I realized that would make the most sense. Of course, whether he is or isn't is not really important or even debatable here. But it brings up the issue that most homophobia comes from a very deep-seated self-resentment or insecurity. I wonder if most of the hatred in the world comes from people fighting their own inner demons, the ugliness spilling out all around them.

I think I walked a similar path to Edward, at least in-so-far as the homophobia. I went to college absolutely detesting gays, making loud and obnoxious pronouncements about it, and living my life as if I were in a performance to prove to others I was not gay. I despised those who accepted themselves as gay, and especially those who immersed themselves in it. I saw them as weak, unable to resist the same temptations I felt but was too fearful to admit - even to myself.

It took a long time and a lot of deep, personal work to realize that my homophobia was one of the worst elements of damage I suffered from my abuse. There was no "aHA!" moment about it - it was a gradual education. My homophobia was the sum of all my fear and shame and insecurity. It was the hell of my existence after the abuse ended. It was what my abuser set up for me - and I dutifully carried on. My abuser - if he could have seen me fight those inner demons - would have folded his arms, smirked, and congratulated himself on a job well-done.

I don't give my abuser that victory anymore. He doesn't preside, albeit in absentia, over the battles he has set up between me and myself. I don't know if I would have been gay or not without his uninvited intervention in my life, but that's not important. I am who I am - if he played a role in making me that, then so be it. But I own me now - not him.

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#382197 - 01/12/12 02:00 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: EdfromNYC]
phoenix321 Offline


Registered: 09/26/11
Posts: 912
Loc: USA, FL
EdfromNYC,

It's easy for me to not have any bigotry or racism since I grew up as a military brat around just about every different race possible. We kids just didn't have bigotry or racism around us except when we were in the local cities and towns. The south was the worst for it. I had no idea why people there hated people of color. We are all human. As long as they don't harm you, why hate or be bigoted to anyone?

What I saw in people that were bigoted and racist was ignorance and a culture that propped up that ignorance. The ones that refused to change I just saw hate.

The churches I was forced to go to definitely hated the LGBT community with a passion due to religion. The religion was "we are better than everyone else cause we got god" and the LGBT bunch are just sinners out to destroy us so fuck 'em. I thought it was bullshit then and it still is bullshit.

Society should have NO tolerance for bigotry and racism. I've definitely been the victim of bigotry and racism myself. I know how bad it can hurt. We need to see all people as people just like us. All of us one day are going to need that same treatment.

Edward said in his post he knew it was wrong. Maybe he's just trying to justify such thoughts with "I'm afraid". Face your fears is the only way around it. Maybe tell your Brother-in-law why you think they way you do. He might just shock the hell out of you and be understanding. You wife doesn't want you thinking that of your brother-in-law because he's her brother. Take this opportunity to get rid of that homophobia.

_________________________
Phoenix

A guy opens the front door and sees a snail on his doorstep. He picks up the snail and throws it across the street in a neighbor's yard. A year later, the guy opens the front door and the same snail is on his doorstep. The snail says, "What the f*ck was that about?"

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#382198 - 01/12/12 02:14 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: phoenix321]
Mulligan Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/15/10
Posts: 94
Loc: USA
I can gaurandamntee you that if you were abducted and tortured by purple space aliens......you would be suspect of them for the rest of your life. With that said my abuser is/was gay. For years my only experience with gay people was being raped by one. Was I homophobic yes and I beleive justifiably so. Since entering recovery I have had lots of new experiences with gay people and now some of my closest friends are gay. I would suggest that you ask your wife to give you some time with this and that you are triggered by gay people. Doesn't make you a bad guy it makes you triggered. I am triggered by church. I don't go!

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Because I never give up the fight!

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#382199 - 01/12/12 02:19 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: phoenix321]
EdfromNYC Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/18/10
Posts: 233
Loc: New York City
Phoenix

I agree that its about facing one's fears but with CSA in the picture it can be complicated. And who knows what the bro-in-law is like? We can't assume he is approachable nor is that necessarily the best way to face the fear but we don't know. Each of us faces his fears in different ways and it seems like Edward is starting to face this stuff.

To admit that one has a problem is the first step. To resolve the problem can be a process that takes time and space to figure out and that is what I am stressing. It is not crucial to force this any faster than necessary. One can have feelings or phobias and not have to act on them; rather, one can acknowledge that they have them, sort them out and then be able to more accurately perceive events and act with the ability to choose how to act.

I think homophobia is a hot button issue for many who suffered CSA and there is no one way to resolve the issue. Homophobia is merely a symptom of other things, in my opinion.

_________________________
And more, much more, the heart may feel,
Than the pen may write or the lip reveal.
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#382202 - 01/12/12 02:45 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: Castle]
neveragain Offline


Registered: 12/21/11
Posts: 26
EdfromNYC you are right on. i feel sorry for this guy. some gusy on this place do more damege than help. I spent along time getting paid by gays to have sex with them. i was a 16 yearold kid so dont tell me gays arent peds. they can be and i met alot of them. to blast this guy for how his csa has left him is as ignerant as his being acused of being.


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#382206 - 01/12/12 02:55 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: Edward Wong]
whome Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/07/11
Posts: 1734
Loc: Johannesburg South Africa
Hi Edward

In My case many of my abusers where gay men. This had then built up in me a resentment of gay men, understandable as I believed that all gay men where potential abusers.
Its easy to say that you must learn to tolerate gay men, and to compare this to racism, but its not like that in my case.
To me it was simple as a child, Gay = abuser.

I did go through a patch where I had sexual confusion, and experimented with men, but it always made me feel worse, so I wasn't homophobic because I was in the closet. Even with this knowledge, I still continued to hate Gay men, and it got worse as I got older.
I was one of those Ignorant people that would drive past the Gay clubs and throw beer bottles and shout faggot and other derogatory names at them.

So what changed.
I learnt that I am a survivor
I learnt that Gay men suffer as I do, and that many of them were also sexually abused
I learnt that not all gay men are perpetrators, just as not all stepfathers and uncles are.
I learnt that if I were to fight against CSA, I would need to learn to love gay men and treat them just as I would any other survivor.

Today I can say that there are several Gay men that I have counselled and continue to do so, and I harbour no ill feelings toward them.
Amazing how life changes when you face the truth.

As for your wife, sit her down and explain to her why you feel like you do, and tell her that as you are healing, things will improve and that she needs to be patient with you and know that you are working on your issues

I hope my experience helps you

Heal well
Martin



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#382210 - 01/12/12 03:23 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: whome]
Castle Offline


Registered: 10/03/09
Posts: 723
Loc: NJ
WOW...Lotta action, as usual.

A Mulligan appearnace, NICE!.... Billy, you challenged your thoughts based on some experience and you have grown because of it. Dont you think? I think some of the intolerance has also to do with enviornment and such well beyond just a CSA issue. I too was abused by a gay male, a family member...and my feelings and experiences are differnt than yours.

Never...Im telling you "gays" are not pedos...this thought process is foolishness. Coining them "gays" or "the gays" is equally as foolish. You may have encountered some gay male pedos, but to say "gays are pedos" is really destructive and hurtful in so many ways, and on so many levels.

I also see thought, from the beginning, the op want to try and work through this issue more, and always a hard first step.

still curious if this is being worked on DIY or with pro help.



Edited by Castle (01/12/12 03:26 PM)
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#382215 - 01/12/12 05:04 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: Castle]
Edward Wong Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/25/11
Posts: 40
I tried talk therapy, but it didn't help me. I still see a psychiatrist for antidepressants.


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#382219 - 01/12/12 05:39 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: Edward Wong]
Mulligan Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/15/10
Posts: 94
Loc: USA
Talk therapy takes some time and the right person. I have seen a couple of Ts and each one of them has advanced me on some level of recovery. It does work, just have to find the right one.

_________________________
Because I never give up the fight!

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#382229 - 01/12/12 09:23 PM Re: Homophobic because of the Abuse [Re: Mulligan]
Castle Offline


Registered: 10/03/09
Posts: 723
Loc: NJ
Can you expand a bit, if its safe for you, Edward, why you feel talk therapy didn't help you?

Are you opposed to trying it again?

When you tried before, were you actively working on recovery?
(I'm not asking that in a negative way, I just dont know where in your process you are)

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My posts can self destruct at any time..read them while you can.

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