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#367218 - 08/02/11 08:02 AM Finally
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
After such a long time of internal struggles, I have finally come to peace to my sexual identity. I, like most of the people on the planet (who are honest with themselves) is bisexual. I had two sides of my personality fighting each other, each one trying to kill the other. I finally relaxed and realized there is room for both sides of my desires. I may never be with a man sexually and only chose to have fantasies or some day I may give it a shot. My mind isnt closed. I do want children someday and my own family so I will need an open minded woman who will accept me for who I am. My abuse destroyed so many needs that are unmet to this day with males. Maybe as I work on those needs my SSA will disapear, if not oh well. Feels good to breathe again. And I realized I allowed the complete bullshit from the gay and straight community that bisexuals dont exist to completly posion my mind and casue me horrible conflict and anxiety. Now im free smile

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367229 - 08/02/11 12:03 PM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
kinghenri Offline


Registered: 05/06/09
Posts: 215
Loc: Tucson Arizona
Congratulations man. :-)

_________________________
"In my life, I have seen,
People walk into the sea,
Just to find memories,
Plagued by constant misery,
Their eyes cast down,
Fixed upon the ground,
Their eyes cast down

I'll keep my eyes fixed on the sun"

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#367232 - 08/02/11 12:48 PM Re: Finally [Re: kinghenri]
kinghenri Offline


Registered: 05/06/09
Posts: 215
Loc: Tucson Arizona
I think I'm gonna do the same. It's just too much emotional distress.
I guess once the pressure is off I won't have as much trouble with women (sexually).
Best of luck

_________________________
"In my life, I have seen,
People walk into the sea,
Just to find memories,
Plagued by constant misery,
Their eyes cast down,
Fixed upon the ground,
Their eyes cast down

I'll keep my eyes fixed on the sun"

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#367237 - 08/02/11 01:42 PM Re: Finally [Re: kinghenri]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
how old were you when you were abused Henri? and who was your perp

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367243 - 08/02/11 05:23 PM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
kinghenri Offline


Registered: 05/06/09
Posts: 215
Loc: Tucson Arizona
4. I was four yrs old
I recorded 3 videos regarding my struggle on my phone. I wanted to try and post them here but I dont thinkvI can

_________________________
"In my life, I have seen,
People walk into the sea,
Just to find memories,
Plagued by constant misery,
Their eyes cast down,
Fixed upon the ground,
Their eyes cast down

I'll keep my eyes fixed on the sun"

Top
#367248 - 08/02/11 07:16 PM Re: Finally [Re: kinghenri]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
who was the perp to you? mine was my dad

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367282 - 08/03/11 02:20 AM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
kinghenri Offline


Registered: 05/06/09
Posts: 215
Loc: Tucson Arizona
His name was Steve.
He moved in with us.
My parents didn't really care about us or they couldn't I don't really know. Part of me suspects they were once victims that doesn't excuse their negligence.
He was always there when thet weren't. Attention, toys, fun trips. I grew up with steve as my father so I can kinda understand where you're coming from. I enjoyed the abuse but i really didn't have a choice. It's so fucked up.

_________________________
"In my life, I have seen,
People walk into the sea,
Just to find memories,
Plagued by constant misery,
Their eyes cast down,
Fixed upon the ground,
Their eyes cast down

I'll keep my eyes fixed on the sun"

Top
#367291 - 08/03/11 08:18 AM Re: Finally [Re: kinghenri]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
yeah, and many people on this board make VERY dangerous claims that abuse cannot CHANGE orientation...maybe not BUT the confusion can be so deep that one can yearen for that "love" that bond that sexual feeling and become convinced they are gay and live there lives chasing the "positive' feelings during abuse. There is a guy on this board who spent 22 years dude 22 years a gay man..Then he went for help for his abuse and made the connection to not only his sexual behaviors but also his feelings...that unmet need the abuse left with him. Hes straight now and with kids, not with men anymore and fullfills his needs by intimate non sexual male bonding. EVERYONE IS DIFFERENT. 22 years is a long time to be "convinced" your gay.

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367292 - 08/03/11 08:19 AM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
and no he didnt do repairative theraphy

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367296 - 08/03/11 10:42 AM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
Ever-fixed Mark Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/02/10
Posts: 729
Loc: United States
Hey Freshwound,

I'm glad to hear that you have come to a place of peace with your sexual identity.

There was an interesting quote in the Sexual Imprinting book that you referenced earlier talking about male on male sexual abuse that results in a "positive sexual imprint":

Quote:
"It is also extremely important to to stress to survivors in this category (homosexual abuse) that choosing heterosexuality ("I want to be straight and have a family and children and never think about guys/girls again") as a therapy goal is usually impractical, in my opinion. In my experience with hundreds of survivors of this type, the positive imprint is permanent, and if they catch themselves looking at same-sex peers or adults and becoming aroused (...) they will then feel that they failed, both in therapy and in their new goals. It is far better for them to accept the fact that they will always be bisexual (in order to cover any same-sex attractions, thoughts, and fantasies)..."

I know that understanding and aligning my sexual orientation, sexual identity, and sexual behavior has brought me to a similarly peaceful place. The individual is always at the center of the journey and they ultimately decide what is right for them. I'm glad to see you claiming that autonomy fully.

-efm

_________________________

Everybody here's got a story to tell
Everybody's been through their own hell
There's nothing too special about getting hurt
Getting over it, that takes the work

- "Duck and Cover" by Glen Phillips

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#367297 - 08/03/11 10:58 AM Re: Finally [Re: Ever-fixed Mark]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
Thanks mark!

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367298 - 08/03/11 11:21 AM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
I will need to figure out how to become closer to women without co dependancy and also how to not look at women as objects to get off to. My relationship with my mother was horrendous

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367307 - 08/03/11 02:17 PM Re: Finally [Re: Ever-fixed Mark]
Lo Don Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/26/11
Posts: 133
Loc: Sacramento
Hey, group.
I watched a program with Oprah's 200 Men, when she asked that direct question to Dr. Howard Fradkin, "Does having been molested as a boy by a man make him Homosexual?"
He said the sexual imprinting had begun far before that occurrance. So, no it does not make them gay or bisexual. I disagree but I only went to graduate school in Sociology and Psychology and on molestation is only a hobby I write about, because I am a MS, have SSA, still happily married with an understanding wife, who has rules: no women, no men! My friends are held to No Women! I have read about several men who's lives changed after the molestation; I believe they would have been straight if there was no male preditor.
I am not an expert; but with talking to others and my own rapes I have to disagree with the founder of MS.
Don

_________________________
The me that nobody knows!
Did you replace me with a younger Boy?Does he bend,squat, beat,say Awwww as well as me?
I still love you & miss you.My Perb referred to me as his
'Dirty 'lil Boy','cause I allowed him to bang on me anywhere, anytime."Bend over you Dirty Boy;we know you can take it!"

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#367309 - 08/03/11 02:55 PM Re: Finally [Re: Lo Don]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
No it doesnt MAKE you gay but leaves a POSITIVE imprint which can cause SSA, acting out with men and a longing for closeness with males, love and care from males. Especially if the child was brought to orgasm. I think the author of the article was pointing out OK just accept the SSA dont be upset about them and its OK to label yourself as bi and never act out with men. Its basically the same thing you just said but in different words. You have SSA but wont act on it. For people that dont fullfill those needs they can live a "homosexual' lifetsyle and not realize they arent gay. Like I posted earlier, a man on this board was gay for 22 years, had relationships sex with males etc...he connected what he was doing with his abuse and how he was attempting to fullfill those needs and became or "came out straight". However contrary to popular belief sexuality male and female DOES exist on a contonioum. Most everyone is at least SLIGHTLY bisexual. I have way too many gay friends to think otherwise. Many of them say if they had a few drinks they would bang a girl or suck on her tities lol The impact my abuse that I suffered at 6 years old by the hands of my father was astronomical...I seek emotional comfort and love from men...never acted with men and have been with a ton of girls sexually and relationship wise...saying Im bi shuts up the two voices in my head. Each one battleing for dominance over the other. I probably would have turned out bisexual or straight with SSA without abuse. My mother was insane. Horribly emotionally and physically abusive to myself and my brothers and even my father. My dad was cold, withdrawn and was obviously defeated by my mother. I had crushes on both sexes during childhood with the boy crushes being much stronger after the abuse.



Edited by freshwound (08/03/11 03:16 PM)
_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367318 - 08/03/11 05:25 PM Re: Finally [Re: Lo Don]
Prairie Dog Offline


Registered: 05/20/11
Posts: 19
Deleted myself


Edited by Prairie Dog (06/11/12 01:09 AM)

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#367329 - 08/03/11 07:37 PM Re: Finally [Re: Prairie Dog]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
WOW is all I can say Prairie dog. I cant tell you how much I relate to your story. Just when I feel im all alone and the only one going through the struggles, thoughts, guilt, anxieties and frustrations, someone like you comes along and almost mirrors my experiences 100%. My dads abuse was also "love", grooming, kissing and seduction. After the abuse he was cold, withdrawn, miserable. My mother was not all ther ementally,. I would come home from school and she would be sleeping on the couch, if I went to grab a bowl of cereal she would wake up screaming "you little fuck you woke me up on purpose, get the fuck out the kitchen". Or she would slap me across the face. Once she was on the phone laughing saying "let me go im about to beat the shit out of my kid" and she ran over and pulled and pulled on my hair until my head swelled. I also have a horrible feeling she may also have sexually abused me. I am not certain, but sometimes when im having sex with a girl something feels a little twisted and "familiar". My brother was also very abusive to me verbally and I also have a bad feeling he too sexually abused me. The combination of these trumatic events caused me at a younge age to gravitate towards boys more and I was terrified of girls and little attractions. I had a few crushes on some of the older girls in the neighborhood and then a few crushes on girls in elementary school. Girls were like this mysterious thing to me..pictures and images from magazines and tv in real life that I didnt know how to relate to. When you said humiliation I related. My mother humiliated me constantly, emasculating me every chance she had. So now I am left with SSA that is mostly emotional and I have pure lust for girls...porn star style sex...dirty talk etc and have little interest for closeness...the second I attempt to do so it turns into co-dependancy.

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367373 - 08/04/11 12:48 AM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
Lo Don Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/26/11
Posts: 133
Loc: Sacramento
Freshwound, Prairie Dog,

This is great! You both are like twins! I can relate also, both of you are incredible! Both of you had relations with your parents, you are knowledgable about all of this. I have been extremely confused for years. I have been brought to an orgasm by lots of men from 12 on. I have been brought to orgasm by women several times. I have been brought to orgasm at parties with both men and women at the same time, and loved it. I was a dirty boy. I am cleaning up as we speak. I also am bisexual, with SSA tendencies. I can not have a relationship with men; only one night stands; leave before dawn. I am married, with a mind in conflict, but able to keep it under manageable mind set. Just the opposite of the both of you I have lust for men, but can maintain a loving relations with women.
A very stupid statement: Gay, Bisexual, Hetersexual. Are there grey areas? CDA, SSA? Is Gay and Bisexual considered Homosexual!? I do not totally understand what I am, the search is long, I do not know who I am. Your conversation is making a lot of sense. Thank you Freshwound and Prairie Dog! You 2 have helped me find the me that nobody knows.
Peace,
Don

_________________________
The me that nobody knows!
Did you replace me with a younger Boy?Does he bend,squat, beat,say Awwww as well as me?
I still love you & miss you.My Perb referred to me as his
'Dirty 'lil Boy','cause I allowed him to bang on me anywhere, anytime."Bend over you Dirty Boy;we know you can take it!"

Top
#367388 - 08/04/11 08:14 AM Re: Finally [Re: Lo Don]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
Thanks Don, I think for survivors labels dont work, they just dont. But for many of us "bi" helps keep our sanity. There is NO conclusive proof that biology, genetics, evviormental cues or any other factors are COMPLETLY responsible for sexual orientation. And sadly and honestly NOBODY can prove sexual abuse cannot alter ones orientation, or at least blur it so badly someone could literally spend thier whole lives trapped in abuse and shut off one portion of their sexuality and gravitate towards the other. From what ive read it depends on the abuse and the subjective experience of the survivor. I've read stories of women who were brutally raped by men, never had an attraction to women before and after rape was suddenly attracted to women. Men who get life in prison not only rape each other but develop attractions and some even fall in love with other men despite never having these feelings before. One can make the logical conclusion that Kinsey and Frued were right about sexuality. Everyone on the planet is born more or less bisexual and various factors cause us to either go in one direction, the other , stay in the middle or shift during our lives. I believe its rare any one of us are born 100% gay or straight. I happen to disagree with Joe Kort's take on sexuality. He talks about straight men that have sex with men. Non abused men that seek out sex with other men for whatever reason, and he comes up with logical conclusions for each. Personally I feel its a slap in the face to bisexuals. Bisexuality is not about even attractions. Even though these guys may be looking for the act vs the person its still not a woman , its a guy. Its a bisexual tendency coming out. Obviously if the man is abused its a different story, but he may have to use the label bi anyway to keep his sanity.



Edited by freshwound (08/04/11 08:15 AM)
_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367421 - 08/04/11 07:19 PM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
Logan Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/05/03
Posts: 1205
Loc: NY
Hi Guys. My name is Logan and I am 30 yrs old (but emotionally I feel much closer to early 20's).

I just wanted to say that I have been reading all of these posts and have found them to be tremendously helpful and reassuring!

I basically wanted to chime in and pretty much say thank you-to all of you that have contributed to this post! I have struggled with SSA for a while and have acted out with guys before-but I always felt tremendously shameful immediately afterward!!!

You guys have been very candid and honest when expressing yourselves on this post, which I have found happens to be a very difficult topic to discuss, so I will try to do the same.

As far as my sexuality goes..... Well I may as well give you guys some back round info.
I had several Perps: a next door neighbor that basically was just fondling and that was from 7-8 yrs old, and the fucked up thing about that is he groomed me and I didn't even know that what he was doing was wrong at the time.
The other main perps was a teacher and another person. The stuff that happened with the teacher was, in the beginning at 11 yrs old, not that bad--that is until I think it was a bout a year later that he began to threaten me and began to "share" with his sick pedo-ring friends, some of whom were very violent and terrifying and those ones made me do stuff with other kids to which i though was my fault and hated myself for it for the longest time until I spoke about it here on MS and in Therapy. They also made child porn from me.
The last time I was raped I was late 14 or 15--I sorry but I don't really remember.

I could go on but it is painful to think about and besides we all have our own stories of why we are here! The important thing is that WE ARE HERE! And now the important thing now is to try to recover and heal from the immense shame and damage that was done to us that was completely not our Fault or by our creation at all!

I just want to add that although I don't always feel this way, I feel very fortunate to have made it and survived and therefore I can now say it and call my self a SURVIVOR!!!!!

Back to the main topic:
I was suicidal by the time I was 17 because I hated myself so much and thought that the CSA made me Gay. and I continued to think that I was gay until I was around 19-20. Then I had my first GF and all of that changed and I suppressed everything until the nightmares hit when I was around 24 or 25 and I began this journey

Sorry about spilling so much, but I just thought that it would only be fair since you guys have poured out your heart and soul on the issue.

Anyway for the last 2 or 3 yrs now, I have secretly considered my self Bi-leaning more towards straight/hetero.

when I have acted out with other guys in the past, it wasn't because I was sexually attracted to them. I know this because many times I had trouble getting and maintaining an erection. So the reasons for the behavior were several; the main one I think was to have male bonding/intimacy with a male, but I didn't know that at the time.

Again I just want to say Thanks for this post and discussion on a very tough and for me-shame filled topic!

Take good care of yourselves.

Sincerely,
Logan

P.S. I made some posts on the Members side of the Forum about this very topic that some of you may find helpful. I could repost them here if you guys may find it helpful. We are all here to help each other, Right?
Just let me know or PM me.



Edited by Logan (08/04/11 07:22 PM)
Edit Reason: Post Script
_________________________
"Terrible thing to live in Fear"-Shawshank Redemption
WOR Alumnus Hope Springs 2009
"Quite a thing to live in fear, this is what is means to be a slave"
-Blade Runner

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#367438 - 08/04/11 10:27 PM Re: Finally [Re: Logan]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
Thanks for sharing Logan. I think everyone here will find this very very very interesting! http://members.tripod.com/~unicorn_rg/imprint_hypothesis.html

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367440 - 08/04/11 10:48 PM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
And oh yeah Logan I'm 36 going on 21 lol I play video games, read comics, watch jersey shore and spike my hair into a Mohawk lol

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367451 - 08/04/11 11:45 PM Re: Finally [Re: Ever-fixed Mark]
1islandboy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 861
Loc: washington
fw...

FREEDOM...!!!

I know how society tries to push us into one category or the other..

Beyond that...I believe the nature/nuture debate to be more complex than most give credit...

There was a time...I got really spun out over this...(I felt that I didn't quite absolutely fit or belong in either corner)...

If there wasn't enough confusion already...there was a time when I thought I was a female trapped in a boys body...(I believe I can isolate this part, relative to my abuse).

I am not exactly sure how I am emotionally oriented...(I have had relationship issuses concerning emotional availability prior to recovery)...

In my travels...I Found the term "Pomosexual"...and it led me to the same freedom.

I think one of the greatest recovery gifts...is to be comfortable in ones own skin...with ~or~ without the answers.



Caught Between The Tigers (TNT)

island

_________________________
Rise above the storm and you will find the sunshine ~ M.F. Fernandez

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#367476 - 08/05/11 07:59 AM Re: Finally [Re: 1islandboy]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
>>TRIGGERING>>>I agree with your words "freedom". BUT I believe imprinting is BIG when it comes to sexual preferences. Even though my first imprint is excessievly powerful and was percieved by me as "positive", which was my father bringing me to orgasm and constantly telling me it was all 'ok". I loved my dad, trusted him and believed him. So I was imprinted with the homosexual imprint at 6 years old...BUT as I went through puberty I created new heterosexual imprints (extrememly eciting and pleasurable) that I am able to pull up when I want to. So if you aware of these things you can chose your sexual partner. I've been with alot of girls in my life. Sometimes it was me proving my manhood or being straight, other times it was sheer hedonistic, ultra pleasure. I've created multiple imprints and I have taught myself to "tap" into them when I want/need to. Everyone has a subjective perception/experience with all of this and there is no "right way".

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367498 - 08/05/11 02:52 PM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
Logan81 Offline


Registered: 01/28/11
Posts: 42
Loc: Lubbock, TX
freshwound, I've reached a similar place myself recently. My CSA began when I was 4, with an older male cousin, so I believe it's had a strong impact on my sexuality. I worried for a long time that I might be gay, but once I laid that fear aside, it became pretty obvious that I'm not.

I'm physically attracted to guys, and have had a fair number of experiences with them, but romantically, I tend to be more attracted to women. In the long run, I'll probably end up marrying a girl (if I marry at all), but I've reached a point now where I'm just as comfortable with the idea of having a long-term relationship with a guy. Not having that stress/worry hanging over me has been a huge relief!


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#367502 - 08/05/11 05:03 PM Re: Finally [Re: Logan81]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
That's great man! I know what's hard for me is my family dynamic as well, my parents didn't have true love for each other, but rather old fashion expectations, shoulds, loyalty etc. But my mother abuses my father emotionally on a daily basis. I internalized all their bull shit and I'm afraid of being 100 percent myself with a woman. I cAn rock her world sexually but relationships wise I fall into the same trap my parents are in . A power struggle. My family wrote the book on dysfunction. My parents relationship didn't seem to be about attraction more then lust for each other. And that's how I see women. People or objects to lust over. I want to be with a woman but I have alot of work to do.

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367503 - 08/05/11 05:15 PM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
Looking back I remember once my parents sitting me down asking "we aren't getting one, but if we got divorced who would you go with"? My parents were assholes. My brother was also verbally abusive. In my house whoever showed the most anger had the edge. I was good at slamming my door ten times as hard as I could. I hated my family so much as a kid.

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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#367819 - 08/10/11 03:07 AM Re: Finally [Re: thefutureorbust]
Incognito Offline


Registered: 04/17/11
Posts: 105
I don't have much to add here but wanted to chime in and say I wish everyone continued luck with their progress. My perp wasn't a family member and I imagine that only intensifies the situation when it's someone who is supposed to love and nurture you.

_________________________
"If you're willing to carry the weight, feel the strain, push past the pain, and give more of yourself than others expect of you, the world is yours." - Dave Tate

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#367941 - 08/11/11 05:50 PM Re: Finally [Re: Incognito]
thefutureorbust Offline


Registered: 04/24/11
Posts: 171
Loc: NC
Thanks bro, its been tough but Im getting some clarity on my sexuality, which was the most important issue for me

_________________________
"What does not kill me makes me stronger"

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