I heartily agree, Driftwood.

My hope is that because of the insights and mitigations that come from research like this that future lesbian, gay, bi, and transgender school children won't have to endure the terrible bullying that so many of us faced in our lives.

But that isn't the only thing I hope they don't have to face.

In general, bullying victims in school experience the most child maltreatment, and the highest rates of sexual victimization. Cause and effect isn't clear, but no child should have to experience any of these abuses in their lives.

-efm

If you're going to cast doubt on studies based on their author's motives then pretty much any study is going to be useless. Short of pure science like chemistry and physics the only science that gets done is paid for by someone with some sort of interest in the outcome. But just because something is social science rather than pure science and is performed by someone with an interest, it doesn't mean it's useless. Short of peer review or review by someone with a social science type Phd, we'll never know for sure. Strangely enough, I don't find your word very convincing.

You know, I didn't think that EFM was especially mean or hurtful or whatever. He was sharp, perhaps. But I'm not really sure what reaction you expected when you came into the LGBT forum and slyly insinuated that everything is fine for the damn queers and they should just shut their traps and quit their whining. And also, they don't really exist, anyway. I mean that's the clear subtext of your post, right? Or am I horribly misunderstanding and victimizing your precious snowflake self? Maybe I'm one of those evil gay activists who only understands their own pain? Or is that exactly what you're doing?

There's that whole saying about when you point a finger at someone else, you have three pointing back at you. And a thumb sort of pointed down and off to the side.

87% of all statistics are BS.
All this study is saying is that this group of people had some questions about how some kids were treated in school.

We are all pretty sure that we know how the kids answered. I would rate pretty sure as being 85%, pretty much the same percentage as the study.

All studies are biased, the fact that there is a study biases what is being studied (pretty sure of this, 85%).

One of you is stating that the study is biased because, well, it is. I am also sure (75%) it is pretty accurate.

I have not determined if this study was done at Princeton, in a lab or if it was done by a group of field organizers, loosely affiliated with GLSEN, doing their best to get as much information as they could to a group that is trying to protect children, but pretty sure that it is closer to the latter. How was that for a run on sentence. But i am sure (75%) that the fake numbers show pretty accurate statements about the lives of these people.

Stop bitching, you are both right.

USELESS STATISTICS:
“Since 1984, the Buffalo Bills have won only two games in which they were four points ahead with less than six minutes to play.”

“A preliminary census report indicates that for the first time in our nation’s history female anthropologists outnumber male professional golfers.”

“The latest poll indicates that 72 percent of the American public believes we should withdraw economic aid from Nicaragua.” (Later in the article, we learn: “Of those who expressed this opinion, 28 percent thought Nicaragua was in central Asia, 18 percent thought it was an island near New Zealand, and 27.4 percent believed that ‘Africans should help themselves.’”)


USEFUL STATISTICS:
“...one out of every four black males between the ages of twenty and thirty has spent some time in prison.”
“...the nation’s expenditure for the education of black children is 23 percent less than for white children.”

Accuracy of specific numbers may be debatable (that’s why pollsters publish margins of error), but gay children reporting incidences of harassment is a useful statistic. Knowing people are being harmed or treated unfairly, we can take steps to protect them.

(Statistics from Neil Postman’s “Invisible Technologies” 1992)

The great thing about science is that it requires things to be repeatable, encourages researchers to build upon and test existing hypotheses, and it expects reasoned skepticism when insights are unexpected or unexplained.

When a study is an outlier (finding an incidence that no other study has found) it sets other researchers in the field on the track of understanding why and how such a finding occurred and comparing it to their own, often peer reviewed research. And there is plenty of research in this field to use as a baseline.

Reviewing a sample of the aggregate academic research (including the peer reviewed research) in this area, the GLSEN study doesn't say anything new or controversial, or qualify as an dramatic outlier in terms of the incidence of specific types of homophobic bullying it reports. From School Psychology Review, 2008, Volume 37, No. 2, pp. 202–216 " Homophobic Teasing, Psychological Outco...d Schools Have? " by Dorothy L. Espelage, Steven R. Aragon, and Michelle Birkett of the University of Illinois at Urbana—Champaign and Brian W. Koenig at K12 Associates:


None of these numbers seem surprising when compared with the GLSEN data, and most importantly none of them say that homophobic bullying isn't a problem. More:


Bullying and homophobia are linked, and there are strong associations between homophobic content and aggression.


I need to dig into how they achieved the normative sample (reaching closeted LGB kids) but it potentially may provide a more complete picture by including those who are not out. Overall, however, it's a concern that there is no representation of trans kids who suffer terrible bullying, violence, and health outcomes and these persist when they become adults. The findings of the research aren't a surprise:


And unsurprisingly for any research project, it's recommended that more research is needed:


There is a lot of academic research in this field that can be used to validate the hypotheses and results of interest group research like that of GLSEN's. The reason you don't hear a hue and cry about GLSEN's findings in the research community is that they are not really surprising, and track what is being seen in other related academic research.

-efm

Wow. Sorry all. Didn't mean to start an argument. As a former kid abused by bullies, and a Virginia educator, I was just sharing some info to hopefully bring a problem to light to make things better for kids. That's all.

Peace (for crying out loud),

John

No need to apologize, FT. So much good has come out of this! I feel privileged to be a part of it, and I've learned a lot. I especially appreciate the generous work of EFM in shedding light on the nature of polling, data collection, margins of error, etc. That's enlightening. It's also useful to know that bullied kids are more prone to be sexually abused and that there are organizations out there, in addition to GLSEN, who are working to protect the vulnerable.

I'm sorry you were bullied. I was too. I know what that's like. (Does that make us brothers in an odd way? Hope so!) Thanks for starting this thread.

FT,

I have to second what Driftwood said - it is up to each individual how they respond to what is written on any thread. Many are simply trying to get the word out about bullying and harassment and you did good job with that.

You also did it without bringing a personal agenda to this thread. I cannot say that for all who responded here but I think about all of us did.


Daryl

Thanks, Drift and Daryl! I really was just trying to help kids. My childhood was a living hell and I don't want any other kid to have those kind of experiences.

Thanks for your support!



Peace,

John