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#365859 - 07/12/11 12:17 PM Re: I'm tired of failing [Re: whome]
sally123 Offline


Registered: 11/29/10
Posts: 54
Hope, so sorry for what you are going through! Just wanted to send you a hug! You are amazing! Please don't be so hard on yourself. I know its easy to say, as I find myself doing same thing! you have been loyal loving and a true friend (plus many more positives). I hope in your pain you can be proud of yourself for being who he probably wishes he could be.


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#365862 - 07/12/11 01:42 PM Re: I'm tired of failing [Re: sally123]
hopeandtry Offline


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 476
@Whome I am already in Al Anon and other 12 Step groups. I am not "dying" to be in the relationship anymore or I wouldn't have left. It's less to do with "dying" to be in the relationship and more to do with the fact that maybe I understood his pain just a little too much...cared too much. In any case, I'm not in it anymore, but that doesn't mean it won't hurt...and hurt doesn't mean I'm weak or dying to be treated badly. Anyway, thanks for the support to take care of myself and other suggestions.

@Sally, thanks for the encouragement. I am in a better place than a few days ago. I just despise lashing out at anyone (not just my ex) so it is hard for me to deal with when it happens. I don't like being bitter or expressing my anger in inappropriate ways. It doesn't matter if someone did just that to me...I do not want to be vengeful and give back what I was given. I am proud of myself for at least trying to be understanding though my understanding lasted too long...that is, I tried too long to stay and support him when it wasn't the right thing to do anymore. I have a lot of compassion for him and I am thankful for what I've learned here. Now I'm just trying to take care of myself.


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#365865 - 07/12/11 01:53 PM Re: I'm tired of failing [Re: hopeandtry]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6602
Loc: FEMA Region 1
H4H,

Both of you are dealing with weapons-grade plutonium pain. What I have come to use to at least explain (not justify...just explain) all the turmoil...all the fkg hellacious turmoil that CSA brings to life, is this: "Its the nature of the business."

There's no changing that, this, then, him, you, us, to be anything other than under the dictum and conditions of CSA.

Just as Baseball is Baseball, CSA is what it is. You know I've gone through hell and back several times. I've lost everything (as in "everything"). I have literally no choice but to be subject to the conditions of CSA.

I TRULY, TRULY believe WE (both jointly and individually) all dictate the outcomes. My outcome was a very bad, bloody crash-n-burn. Other's have had great landings with their S.O.s and spouses. There are SO many variables, no one can identify a formula for a great landing, but WE all ARE (individually and jointly) responsible for the outcome...the landing.

I'm dreadfully sorry any human has to go through any of this.

_________________________
I'm "that guy."

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#365867 - 07/12/11 03:38 PM Re: I'm tired of failing [Re: hopeandtry]
katie1205 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/03/11
Posts: 48
I just wanted to say with truly toxic unhealthy people like this, it's kind of like a diabetic cutting off a foot that has gang green (I know I spelled that wrong) to save their life. It's 100% necessary and there is no other choice. It's hard. It's painful. You will miss that foot forever. But you are preserving the rest of your life. I don't know if that makes sense. Sometimes my analogies are a little weird. Please get into CODA TODAY and go every day as much as you can. Call their frigging 800 number if you have to. Do what you have to do but stay the hell away from him. He is toxic like eating arsenic. If you go back to him, you are in a sinking row boat trying to bail it out with a Dixie cup. It will NEVER work. When I left my horrible ex husband, my friend, Kathy said to me, "Go on eharmony.com and find somebody,you're too good to be alone". I am not promoting that web site but honey, you're too good to be alone too. Go find somebody healthy. And yes, that is how I met my wonderful Adam.


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#365869 - 07/12/11 05:22 PM Re: I'm tired of failing [Re: katie1205]
hopeandtry Offline


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 476
@Robbie, I am very sorry for what you have gone through. You are right that CSA is pretty much always going to be hell to deal with...for the survivor or supporters. I also agree that while we are subject to the conditions of CSA, we do have control over the outcomes (at least, I think that's what you're saying). I am not a puppet to the circumstances anymore than my ex is. He can't help what circumstances he was delivered (in terms of his childhood), but he (and I) have control over our lives as adults. Can we control other people's actions even now? No. You could not control your wife, the lawyer, the judge, etc. We can, however, control our thoughts toward ourselves and how we treat ourselves. That is why I chose to leave.

@Katie, I am already in 12 step groups that deal with codependency. While I've looked at CODA, I really don't want to add yet another group to my schedule right now (one can overdose on recovery as well). In any case, yes, I am getting help. You are right that things will never work out under the circumstances. I cannot "doom" him as being a person who will never get better because that is not true, but yes under the circumstances "it"...the relationship...will never work. As for dating others, while I may do that some day (who knows...I really can't tell the future), 1) I think it's unhealthy to start dating when I need to work on myself and so soon after being involved with my ex...plus unfair to use someone to get over him and 2) I don't think being "good" or "bad" has anything to do with being alone. While I appreciate the compliment, there is nothing at all wrong with being single (whether by choice or because I haven't been asked out or whatever). I don't need a man to be complete. Anyway, when the time comes, I hope that I WILL find someone healthy rather than someone who hurts me, as I imagine is your main concern by what you wrote. That is why I'm taking time for myself...because I want to examine myself, work on some things, and make sure I don't repeat the same unhealthy choices.


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#365892 - 07/13/11 01:49 AM Re: I'm tired of failing [Re: hopeandtry]
whome Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/07/11
Posts: 1736
Loc: Johannesburg South Africa
Sorry might have been a bit harsh, Had a tough day dealing with people that don't want to see the truth, and refuse to take responsibility. My words may have come across harsh.
I feel for you, I really do, but I feel for your partner who seems to hold on to the fact that he needs to suffer alone. Seems not all are willing to heal their lives
Again sorry If I sounded harsh
Heal well
God Speed
Martin

_________________________
Matrix Men South Africa
Survivors Supporting Each other
Matrix Men Blog

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#365915 - 07/13/11 01:22 PM Re: I'm tired of failing [Re: whome]
hopeandtry Offline


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 476
I'm sorry you had a rough day, Martin. I, too, feel for my ex for his belief that he is "bad" and must suffer. I suppose that's partly what made it hard to leave...he truly does not want to hurt me or do things that are wrong. As for myself, it is true that I must take responsibility by leaving the situation, which is why I am doing so. I am hurt by him and angry, but if I stay it is my fault essentially that these things are happening over and over. I am not trying to play victim by my posts, just venting. I truly hope my ex gets some healing.


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#365926 - 07/13/11 06:28 PM Re: I'm tired of failing [Re: hopeandtry]
lovingBen Offline


Registered: 06/19/11
Posts: 38
hi hope--

it's been a few weeks since i have been on here. i'm so sorry you're going through this and that i wasn't on here to help given how much you have helped me.

i know you love him. as you told me, you must come first, and you must give yourself permission to put your foot down. it's so hard because we love them so much and want them to get better. you cautioned me about enabling ben not to do the work and not to have to fight for the one person who gets him and loves him the most...now it's my turn.

if he loves you and wants to get better, what you've done might be the kick in his ass he needs to do his work. if not, well then, you've taken a very healthy step toward reclaiming your happiness. you deserve love and respect, especially from him as his partner/supporter.

we know they can only give it in certain ways, in certain codes, and with a million limitations...but we deserve it just the same.as you told me, you get to change your mind a million times, based on how he responds to your needs and pleas and vents. for now, give yourself permission that you made the right choice. tomorrow give yourself permission to change your mind if he satisfies you that he took a step to helping himself (if you so choose).

our hearts break every time, even when we have been hurt so deeply and they have behaved so badly...acknowledging why and balancing it with over accomodating is our struggle every day.

take comfort in knowing we are all here for you, how ever this plays out smile

take care and hang in!


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#365934 - 07/13/11 09:46 PM Re: I'm tired of failing [Re: lovingBen]
hopeandtry Offline


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 476
LovingBen,

Thanks so much for that. Your message really almost brought me to tears because this is so hard at times. Tonight as I was driving home I felt a terrible pang and loss. Even now I am on the verge of tears.

You are right, what I suggested to you is the very same thing I need to do (and am trying to do) for myself. I hold myself to such a high standard sometimes. While right now I am walking away as if this is "final," you are right that I do not have to make it final IF he were to get it together and get help and work on healing. However, I also cannot count on that nor live my life waiting for it to happen. It's a weird place to be. I guess I could describe it as a "probably forever" decision.

I appreciate all the help on here especially during a week when my nerves are shot and my emotions are a roller coaster more so than normal I think. Still, there is a calmness and steadiness underlying my feelings that I never had before I learned so much from MS and therapy and 12-Step groups.

Perhaps right now would be a good time to share that today has had its bright moments. After weeks and weeks of job searching for a summer job and/or fall job (as I finish my last year of grad school), I checked my email just a few minutes ago and found that my program director had sent me an offer to teach once again this fall AND spring (different subject, but still in my field and one I've taught before). It is not definite but just the great possibility was a huge relief and made me feel like all my efforts to take care of myself are being rewarded. This is "my" year. I will make it count. I have a fresh start in a new apartment and hopefully this new job. I don't think it's a coincidence that my "MS birthday" is in just a few days. I hope this time in my life will mark a lot of "birthdays." :-)


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#365949 - 07/14/11 03:09 AM Re: I'm tired of failing [Re: hopeandtry]
whome Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/07/11
Posts: 1736
Loc: Johannesburg South Africa
This is the joy of this site, I suppose, it is the fact that we can Vent and in so doing find answers and healing. I have said it on this site to many different people, so bear with me if you are one of these.
The most important thing in any disfuntional relationship is that the "well" party needs to remain just that, 'WELL'. If you colapse then there is no hope. If you need to leave that situation to remain well then that IS what you MUST do. It does not have to be anything permanent.
By removing yourself from that Toxic relationship you do two things.
1 you are no longer closely involved so you can attain a better overall view of the things that are happening
2 You can take this time to HEAL YOURSELF. You cannot take time for yourself if you are constantly living in fear or afraid of what will happen next. Use this time to go through your "Codependents no more" book and work the exercises (You do have the Book right?)
the 3rd thing achieved here is that the H has to face his demons alone, and deal with them.
You are married to the man but You are not his KEEPER. you are his lover his queen and the light of his life, but you are not responsible for his pain. He chooses to hold on to it. You need to learn to separate, your role as lover and your role as healer, and never the twain shall meet.
It is harder to repair two broken vesels, than to patch one.

Stay strong and HEAL WELL
Martin

_________________________
Matrix Men South Africa
Survivors Supporting Each other
Matrix Men Blog

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