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#365523 - 07/06/11 12:04 AM Re: Cuteness and ASA [Re: pufferfish]
CruxFidelis Offline


Registered: 06/16/10
Posts: 486
Loc: NJ
Originally Posted By: pufferfish

Last night I watched a dvd on Dogs Decoded. It was mostly an excellent educational dvd. It showed various puppies, including wolf and fox puppies. They're all cute. By about 8 weeks they start to lose their cuteness. Even the ugliest dog was a cute puppy! Same is true with people.


I do think that is very true... it is interesting how human childhood is so drawn out compared to other species. Even when you factor the average length of lifespan, we spend an awful large percentage of our lives dependent on others. It's because our brains are such complex neural structures that it takes that long to our brains to catch up to our bodies.

Originally Posted By: pufferfish

You mention Mickey Mouse. Perhaps it is of interest that the man who instituted my abuse with taking moving pictures when I was 4 was a major cartoonist. (NOT WD). I'm not free to give the name.



That is disturbing on so many levels. I am sorry if that may have triggered you.

Originally Posted By: pufferfish

In my case I found that I had some level of DID or DIDNOS (Dissociative Identity Disorder). When I remembered the abuse when I was about age 45 I became very much aware that I was still 12-years-old.


I am so glad to hear that you have found healing in EMDR and that you've been able to reconnect with that 12-year old inside. My wife was diagnosed with DID-NOS and treatment is very tricky because her abuse happened at the hands of a therapist, so there is a lot of mistrust towards therapy and recovery in general. I do hope healing is possible for her...somehow, but lately it has been getting me down. I am very familiar with encountering those younger versions of her. How long have you been in therapy for DID? when were you diagnosed?

While I don't have any inner child issues, I do think of my life as pre-assault and post-assault, and when I think of myself before the assault it is like encountering a different man. I really thought that being an adult meant that we didn't have to go through identity crises anymore.

_________________________
“If a man wishes to be sure of the road he treads on, he must close his eyes and walk in the dark.”

- Saint John of the Cross

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#365528 - 07/06/11 01:34 AM Re: Cuteness and ASA [Re: CruxFidelis]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6607
Loc: FEMA Region 1
Originally Posted By: CruxFidelis
... A child who was not sexually abused may not interpret the "cute" comments as sexual because they have an age-appropriate level of understanding regarding sex. Seeing life through the lens of CSA might mean you have a different perspective than I do. ...

...In my mind, when an adult comments that a child is sweet/cute/adorable, that endearment is a function of that adult's desire to protect and nurture someone who is dependent on others. It should have absolutely nothing to do with sex.


Well, I get actively freaked, uncomfortable and repulsed when an adult male calls any boy or girl "a cute kid" or "a cute little guy." In my mind, he's saying, "he's HOT!" or "She's HOT!" I guess I'm wired for seeing this human trait as a threat or pre-sex vocalization of attraction. I truly have never know what to make of it other than that.

_________________________
Hell needs firewood too ya know!

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#365529 - 07/06/11 02:03 AM Re: Cuteness and ASA [Re: Still]
pufferfish Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/08
Posts: 6875
Loc: USA
deleted


Edited by pufferfish (06/21/12 12:27 AM)

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#365538 - 07/06/11 03:48 AM Re: Cuteness and ASA [Re: pufferfish]
CruxFidelis Offline


Registered: 06/16/10
Posts: 486
Loc: NJ
As a man who hasn't experienced CSA but rather ASA, that is not how I look at it. I have a 1 year old son and it is like cuteness central over here. It seems weird to me to even imagine looking at a baby and not thinking they are cute. He is what reminds me that there is still goodness in the world. I would have fallen apart without him.

I remember so clearly who I was before my rape and assault. Yet, at the same time, I forget life without my child. I can't imagine a day going by where I don't see that little tiny toddler with my name and my smile.

It is sad that the abuse children can experience can cause them to hate their own cuteness. I was not discussing cuteness as a sexual thing though. I feel misunderstood.

_________________________
“If a man wishes to be sure of the road he treads on, he must close his eyes and walk in the dark.”

- Saint John of the Cross

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#365555 - 07/06/11 02:38 PM Re: Cuteness and ASA [Re: CruxFidelis]
Still Offline
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MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6607
Loc: FEMA Region 1
Its sad. THis is actually a very painful topic. It brings-on panic. This was a topic I was gonna broach with Mr T when I was ready. But I'm glad ya'll are confirming some of my suspicions.

I actually can't see "cuteness" in kids. My daughter is forever falling for certain boys on TV or RL. She'll say, "OMG isn't he cute?!" I just say "I guess...if you think so." But I'm repulsed by the idea and my heart always sinks.

_________________________
Hell needs firewood too ya know!

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#365558 - 07/06/11 03:03 PM Re: Cuteness and ASA [Re: Still]
CruxFidelis Offline


Registered: 06/16/10
Posts: 486
Loc: NJ
as a side note, i like the fact that you call your therapist, "Mr. T."

About the comment about not being able to see "cuteness" in kids. As far as I recall, your daughter is a young teenager, right? If a teenage girl says a boy is "cute" she is probably expressing the fact that she is discovering that she has sexual desires. I probably would have said the same awkward comment if it were my teenage daughter.... because, really, there is noting cute about a teenage boy from a [healthy] adult's perspective. A teenage girl making a comment about one of her peers being "cute" has a sexual connotation that an adult saying a child is cute should not have. If this is on your mind a lot, and it is bothering you, mentioning it to Mr. T is not a bad idea.

The cuteness I was mentioning before has to do with the fact that I think it is easier for mental health professionals to identify with the CSA survivor who is struggling, because they sympathize with the sad, innocent, troubled little child inside the hurting man or woman. But with ASA, it seems like there are some survivors here who have asked nearly every sexual abuse advocacy organization out there about help for men who were abused/assaulted as adults and there is no help for us, there are no Mike Lew superstar types who are putting out books filled with support, there are no ASA themed recovery retreats, there are no conferences, or support groups for spouses/significant others of men with ASA. Instead of having a hurt, confused, little kid inside to sympathize with, I think mental health professionals simply see an adult man who should have KNOWN better.

A really dear friend here who is an ASA survivor has heard time & time again from advocacy orgs and local groups that they don't have any ASA resources. I can't help but to wonder if they are simply saying to us, "BE A MAN," "WALK IT OFF."

We lack cuteness, which is associated with vulnerability. Therefore, people can't wrap their minds around the fact that an adult man can be set up and made vulnerable in a sexual assault. They don't understand that being elderly, disabled, or sick can render a man just as helpless as a woman or child. Even in the military, men can be raped and assaulted. Men in the military are viewed as "killing machines" by people outside the armed forces. You have to be an "army of one." But sometimes even that army of one can be made powerless when he is set up by his peers. Again, we're not talking about a hurting, scared but still endearing little child but a brave soldier who has built himself up to look intimidating, not "cute". Is that surviving soldier any less deserving than the male survivor of CSA?

_________________________
“If a man wishes to be sure of the road he treads on, he must close his eyes and walk in the dark.”

- Saint John of the Cross

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#365577 - 07/06/11 11:18 PM Re: Cuteness and ASA [Re: CruxFidelis]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6607
Loc: FEMA Region 1
Originally Posted By: CruxFidelis
About the comment about not being able to see "cuteness" in kids. As far as I recall, your daughter is a young teenager, right? If a teenage girl says a boy is "cute" she is probably expressing the fact that she is discovering that she has sexual desires.


She's 10...and not allowed to have such views...LOL.

The boy is 12. if you talk about his "GIRLfriend" he'll hit you. If you say..."OK...so you don't have a girlfriend..." he'll hit you.

_________________________
Hell needs firewood too ya know!

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#365582 - 07/07/11 12:07 AM Re: Cuteness and ASA [Re: Still]
CruxFidelis Offline


Registered: 06/16/10
Posts: 486
Loc: NJ
Those tween years sure can be rough on a Dad, I guess it gets worse before it gets better. my little boy just started saying "no" with wild abandon. Although it sounds more like "NOPE" so he will just scream "NOPE NOPE NOPE" across the room whenever he doesn't get his way.

_________________________
“If a man wishes to be sure of the road he treads on, he must close his eyes and walk in the dark.”

- Saint John of the Cross

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#365621 - 07/07/11 05:08 PM Re: Cuteness and ASA [Re: CruxFidelis]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6607
Loc: FEMA Region 1
But back to the "cuteness" issue surrounding SA: I don't think it had one ounce to do with the creeps who used me. I really think it was all about me being a safe and certain as possible. I was the tops in vulnerability and non-consequence. They knew my home life and family were not in any way an issue of risk and the entire neighborhood was certain I would be sent away at some point for the knife thing. There just was not that whole pedo thing going on there.

_________________________
Hell needs firewood too ya know!

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#365656 - 07/08/11 09:17 AM Re: Cuteness and ASA [Re: Still]
prisonerID Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/17/08
Posts: 1247
Loc: Oklahoma
I was thinking on a meeting that I was a part of a couple of years ago. I work with what is termed "at-risk youth". In one meeting one man was recommending we separate a young man from our program for his behavior. He was not a very attractive kid, hygiene challenged and had a piss poor attitude. Not that I do not have a hundred files of those on hand!

What really got to me was in the case discussion right before that we were discussing a female. She was very attractive but pure hell on wheels. The same gentleman was recommending we retain her and continue to seek to help her.

After the meeting I was asked by a colleague why I "almost came across the table at" the other guy. I told her that I could not handle the double standard and if one went they should both go. If one stayed then they both should be kept in our program.

I think you can easily see the same bias that I witnessed on that day and on many others as well. Peter, I also think this might go along with the point you are trying to make here.


Daryl

_________________________
Broad statements often miss their true mark.

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