Newest Members
SiegmundNYC, TheGreatWhat, MyNameIsPaul, serenity38, vivo
12486 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
Can-tex (45), cbchorn (41)
Who's Online
3 registered (GT13568, Don Laufersweiler, CCDC, LPC, 1 invisible), 18 Guests and 2 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
12486 Members
74 Forums
64149 Topics
447610 Posts

Max Online: 418 @ 07/02/12 07:29 AM
Twitter
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
#36383 - 06/05/03 08:11 PM The strength to speak up
dwf Offline
Moderator/BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/24/03
Posts: 1223
Loc: Austin, Texas USA
Keeping quiet about the abuse in my life is an old habit; I felt ashamed and guilty and so many times just let the topic slip by without comment.

Things are somewhat different now. I have spoken up about the abuse; and thanks to this forum, I am now speaking out, in a safe place.

My silence over the years was I'm sure a way of protecting myself--perhaps not the best way, but what I could do at the time. Living alone with the memories of abuse got too painful, and I began to talk about it. Relief came slowly but surely.

Now I am no longer content to just let things slide--it bothers me when people disparage sexual abuse survivors; when my gay friends talk about having sex when they were very young and try to convince me that it was not abuse, because they asked for it, etc.

Now one of my best friends, who has been my AA sponsor and supporter for the last 10 years, and who knows about the abuse in my life is really bothering me. He realizes too that he was sexually abused by his father.

He is a gay man who continues to talk about getting a hold of some young guy--the younger the better--to have sex with. He goes on and on, laughing and joking about them being smooth and hairless, or inexperienced but very horny.

It really bothers me a lot! What seems to bother me even more is that I am not willing or able to speak up and let him know how I am feeling about his continued references to sex with young boys.

It really pisses me off! That he just doesn't get it; that I have to worry about responding to his remarks; that I act phony and dishonest.

I also feel confused. Am I over-reacting? Making a big deal about a common theme in adult conversation? Will I hurt his feelings by challenging him on his behavior? Should I even worry about that?

I have the feeling that I am going to finally talk to him about it--any help or feedback before then would be most welcome.

I don't want to silently acquiesce to the sexual degradation of others.

What do you guys think?

I love this guy a lot and he has been a big help to me over the years. But if I continue to just "let it go" I end up feeling used and unhappy.

Anybody out there been here before?

Regards to my brothers,

_________________________
"Poke salad Annie, 'gators got you granny
Everybody said it was a shame
'Cause her mama was aworkin' on the chain-gang"

-Tony Joe White

Top
#36384 - 06/05/03 09:39 PM Re: The strength to speak up
Ivanhoe Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/19/03
Posts: 1907
Danny,

What if it were your brother that your sponsor was talking about.

No, I mean it.

Your sponsor entices some young kid into sex and the next night, you meet him.................HERE.

The kid pours out his heart to you and asks you what to do.

He talks about taking his life.

I wanted to. Have you ever? You know that boys that age can do it. What would you do, then?
How would you respond to this kid?

You couldn't ignore him, Danny, I know that you couldn't. I've been reading you long enough to know that you couldn't ignore him.

This friend of yours has got to know that what he's thinking of doing is against the law. He could go to jail for a long time.

He has got to know how others here have suffered by such activity.

You don't know that he hasn't already gotten to some kid, and that he's just trying out how you feel about it.

I'm sorry that he has put you in such a position.
You can only hope that his telling you isn't part of his seductiveness; his plan for you to be swept up by his perversion.

Am I coming on too strong. I apologize. You're the one having to deal with this guy and I don't mean to sound like I'm lecturing. It's just that this one hits pretty close to home.

Good luck talking to him; maybe he needs a little therapy.........
maybe he needs a lot of therapy.

Later,

Brother David

_________________________
"No soul is desolate as long as there is a human being for whom it can feel trust and reverence."
George Eliot

Top
#36385 - 06/05/03 09:55 PM Re: The strength to speak up
outis Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/27/03
Posts: 2260
Loc: Maryland USA
Danny,

The man who raped me when I was 16 was my AA sponsor. I wish someone had talked him out of it.

Talk to him. David's right.

Gotta go now.

Joe

_________________________
"Telemachos, your guest is no discredit to you. I wasted no time in stringing the bow, and I did not miss the mark. My strength is yet unbroken…"—The Odyssey, translated by W.H.D. Rouse

Top
#36386 - 06/05/03 09:59 PM Re: The strength to speak up
Wuamei Offline
Member

Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 2700
Loc: The left turn I should have ta...
Danny,

Do not be confused my friend you are absolutely right to be offended by the perpetration of the lies that were rammed down our throats and choked us into silence. Especially when its some of your fellow male survivors of SA who are doing it--or maybe they're not survivors yet but are still victims. What a shame.

Danny if that kind of crap is normal adult conversation then it damned well shouldn't be! It needs to be confronted, particularly when its being aimed at you by a man who is supposed to be your friend and who was also SA.

Of course confronting him will be painful becuz he
has helped you so much, but that doesn't justify what he's doing. Not to mention he's hurting himself too, becuz apparently he's in major denial
or something, minimizing what happened to him. But also minimizing what happened to you in the process.

If he really cares about you he will listen & stop
doing this.

Of course you'll have to be prepared for the possibility that he won't. But for me that would be better than continuing to put up with it. But that's me.

Just let him know how much this hurts you and why.
You might add that since he was abused it should hurt him too. This goes for your other friends if you want to talk to them too.

But take your time and take it easy. Be praying for you.

Victor

_________________________
"I can't stand pain. It hurts me."
--Daffy Duck

Top
#36387 - 06/05/03 10:09 PM Re: The strength to speak up
Ivanhoe Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/19/03
Posts: 1907
Ya, Danny, from me you got a lecture and from Victor some good solid suggestions.
You got my prayers, too.
David

_________________________
"No soul is desolate as long as there is a human being for whom it can feel trust and reverence."
George Eliot

Top
#36388 - 06/06/03 12:03 AM Re: The strength to speak up
Mike Church Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 01/23/03
Posts: 3439
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Danny:

Quote:
I love this guy a lot and he has been a big help to me over the years. But if I continue to just "let it go" I end up feeling used and unhappy.
Danny he is using you and probably does not realize it. I know that he is your sponsor. I am an active memeber of aa for the past 26 years. Nobody ever talked to me that way. Not ever. Danny I think that you should quietly tell him that you find that type of conversation upsetting and that you wish he would just not do it any more. Tell him you respect him as your sponsor but would he please stop.

One of two things will happen Danny. He will stop or he wont. If he does not it is time for you to find another sponsor.

I will tell you the best kind. Find a real sob
someone who can cut through the bullshit and tell it like it is. Someone who will get you so damned mad you will follow through with what he says. Eventually you will find that you love the sob. I found one like that and he is still my sponsor even though he has been dead for 15 years. He still gives me shit and I still get mad at him but nobody comes close to him in my thoughts.

Hope this helps a bit.

_________________________
Mikey

IT REALLY IS OK TO STUMBLE. NONE OF US ARE PERFECT.

Top
#36389 - 06/06/03 01:35 AM Re: The strength to speak up
dwf Offline
Moderator/BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/24/03
Posts: 1223
Loc: Austin, Texas USA
David,

I love your "lectures" ;\) I love the way you put your heart into your sharing. You did me a big favor tonight:
Quote:
What if it were your brother that your sponsor was talking about
You made me realize that these imaginary (I hope and believe) boys my sponsor talks about
ARE MY BROTHER.
Knowing this, I understand what I need to do; not to change my friend but to do what is right for me. Thanks, my brother.

Victor,
Quote:
Danny if that kind of crap is normal adult conversation then it damned well shouldn't b
Thanks for reminding me that I get to have my own ideals of what it means to be a man--and that doesn't include sexual exploitation! You are so right--if that is "normal" --then I don't want anything to do with it. Your prayers are welcome.
And your words of assurance and gentle encouragement give me an idea of how I must proceed.

Mike,

Quote:
Danny he is using you and probably does not realize it.
As always, you hit the nail square on the head!
Thanks for passing on your message.
I didn't get sober to put up with this kind of crap. It's my responsibility to myself and to my friend to speak my mind. My fear of "hurting his feelings" is just double talk for continuing to enable him to continue his sickness. Might appear to be easier to just let it go--but in the long run it's like poison for me and for him.
I'll let you know how it goes.
You also made me realize that I do need a new sponsor and am avoiding making that change. This guy quit going to meetings years ago and is really pretty dry (vs. living in sobriety).
\:D Maybe I'll just do it one day at a time, instead of trying to figure out all the possible consequences etc. etc. Living in the wreckage of the future......

Joe,

Quote:
I wish someone had talked him out of it.
God bless you, my brother. Your honest sincerity touches my heart. That you have found the courage to tell me about the terrible thing that happened to you in hopes of saving someone else, gives me the strength to do what I know is right.
Thanks for reminding me to be real....

Gratefully,
Your brother

_________________________
"Poke salad Annie, 'gators got you granny
Everybody said it was a shame
'Cause her mama was aworkin' on the chain-gang"

-Tony Joe White

Top
#36390 - 06/06/03 08:30 AM Re: The strength to speak up
guy43 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 450
Loc: Minnesota
To ya all,

As I put on my adult hat and read through this post I was grateful to see a calm, mature discussion on a difficult subject.

Kudos to you all.

Danny, keep posting dude, I'm soaking up the solutions you and others come up with!

jer


Top
#36391 - 06/06/03 10:58 AM Re: The strength to speak up
dwf Offline
Moderator/BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/24/03
Posts: 1223
Loc: Austin, Texas USA
The best reason I have to speak up and speak out:

This is my beautiful niece, Caroline Grace--2 years old.
For being so small, she gives me a lot of strength


[url=http://]photos.yahoo.com/bc/texastulips2003/vwp?.dir=/TEXAS+TULIPS+-CLASSICS-+EXOTICS-PREMIUMS/Caroline&.src=ph&.dnm=Carolines+flower+meditation---1.jpg&.view=t&.done=http%3a//photos.yahoo.com/bc/texastulips2003/lst%3f%26.dir=/TEXAS%2bTULIPS%2b-CLASSICS-%2bEXOTICS-PREMIUMS/Caroline%26.src=ph%26.view=t[/URL] [IMG] [/url] [url=http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/texastulips2003/vwp?.dir=/TEXAS+TULIPS+-CLASSICS-+EXOTICS-PREMIUMS/Caroline&.src=ph&.dnm=Carolines+flower+meditation---1.jpg&.view=t&.done=http%3a//photos.yahoo.com/bc/texastulips2003/lst%3f%26.dir=/TEXAS%2bTULIPS%2b-CLASSICS-%2bEXOTICS-PREMIUMS/Caroline%26.src=ph%26.view=t[/IMG]]http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/texastulips20...=http%3a//photo s.yahoo.com/bc/texastulips2003/lst%3f%26.dir=/TEXAS%2bTULIPS%2b-CLASSICS-%2bEXOTICS-PREMIUMS/Caroline%26.src=ph%26.view=t[/IMG] PREMIUMS/Caroline%26.src=ph%26.view=t[/url]

Regards,

_________________________
"Poke salad Annie, 'gators got you granny
Everybody said it was a shame
'Cause her mama was aworkin' on the chain-gang"

-Tony Joe White

Top
#36392 - 06/06/03 11:05 AM Re: The strength to speak up
Mike Church Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 01/23/03
Posts: 3439
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Danny what a beautiful little girl. I remember when my 22 year old daughter was that age.

I hope Caroline grows up like my Tanya; beautiful personality, good looking and sure of herself.

Your brother Wolf

Mike

AAAWWWWWWWWWHHHHHHHHHHHHHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

_________________________
Mikey

IT REALLY IS OK TO STUMBLE. NONE OF US ARE PERFECT.

Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >


Moderator:  ModTeam, TJ jeff 

I agree that my access and use of the MaleSurvivor discussion forums and chat room is subject to the terms of this Agreement. AND the sole discretion of MaleSurvivor.
I agree that my use of MaleSurvivor resources are AT-WILL, and that my posting privileges may be terminated at any time, and for any reason by MaleSurvivor.