Newest Members
RodrigoBR, MJ545, Marant, BeingFound, journey4two
12332 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
blueelectron9 (48), Grunty1967b (2014), highflight (42), jocks44 (54), kitm1 (47), Porrick (44)
Who's Online
5 registered (lapchinj, 4 invisible), 22 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
12332 Members
74 Forums
63415 Topics
443366 Posts

Max Online: 418 @ 07/02/12 07:29 AM
Twitter
Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
#362600 - 05/20/11 10:48 AM Re: Why do people become pedophiles? [Re: Castle]
Ken Singer, LCSW Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/24/00
Posts: 5778
Loc: Lambertville, NJ USA
Good point, Castle. While all pedophiles are child molesters/rapists, not all child molesters are pedophiles. The vast majority of sex abusers I've worked with over the last 30+ years are NOT pedophiles but most have abused children.

The reasons people turn to children for sexual reasons are complex and varied. However, true pedophiles have a strong sexual attraction to pre-pubescent children. The majority of "pedophile priests" are not generally involved with pre-pubescent children but are attracted to young adolescents and older teenagers.

The US Dept of Justice research shows that about 93% of all victims of sexual abuse are related to or are acquainted with the abuser. So, the stranger-danger myth, residency restrictions, public notification registries, etc. don't really protect children and waste resources that could be used for true primary prevention.


Top
#362627 - 05/20/11 09:17 PM Re: Why do people become pedophiles? [Re: Castle]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6401
Loc: 2.5 NATO Nations
If you want some in-depth material, this is a GREAT paper to read. Its written by the pro of pros in the FBI.

http://www.missingkids.com/en_US/publications/NC70.pdf

_________________________
Wishing You Were Here!

The Aftermath Video

The Water Buffalo Song

Top
#362690 - 05/21/11 01:54 PM Re: Why do people become pedophiles? [Re: Still]
Ken Singer, LCSW Offline
Moderator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/24/00
Posts: 5778
Loc: Lambertville, NJ USA
The link that Robbie posted above is called "Child Molesters: A Behavioral Analysis". A member here pmed me pointing out I was putting child molestation (a behavior) with pedophilia (a psychological disorder). I plead guilty to the lazy or ignorant mixing of the two that many people out there do when referring to pedophiles (or paedophiles like our Brit friends such as Lewis note) with the behavior of child molesting.

The point I was trying to make is that the media and many people call child molesters "pedophiles" when they don't meet the criteria for the illness. While I've worked with many men and women who have molested children, few would meet the criteria for pedophilia.

The problem also exists with those who abuse adolescents. Technically, they would not be pedophiles. Some clinicians would refer to them as "hebophiles" or "ephebophiles" but that is not listed in the DSM-IV and as far as I know is not being considered for the upcoming DSM-5 that is coming out in a couple years.


Top
#362700 - 05/21/11 08:58 PM Re: Why do people become pedophiles? [Re: Castle]
RICK57 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/31/03
Posts: 1611
Loc: ENGLAND
I actually took the perv that groomed/abused me to court!

Several friends attended different days in court.

The general comment from them was 'I thought he would have looked like some weirdo, however he just looked like everyone else'.

Not exact words for each friend, but that generalises it.

I have a sort of picture in my head as to what pervs look like, but strangely they don't look like the one in my case.

I imagine that they are grossly overweight, with jam-jar glasses, unkempt greasy hair and with a deodorant problem.

Best wishes...Rik

_________________________
*Never look down on anybody unless you're helping them up.
*I was seeking a way of expressing my anger - I found hope!
*There are many battles before the war is won! It can be won!

Top
#362733 - 05/22/11 09:37 AM Re: Why do people become pedophiles? [Re: RICK57]
OrionH Offline


Registered: 05/07/11
Posts: 20
Just some points:
1. Your stereotype/profile of what a pedophile looks like is different then what I consider to be a pedophile to look like. It's not just looks but also their demeanor. When I see a picture of one that was arrested, I am not surprised. It's like the characteristics of a pedophile are so broad that they can be anyone (hence stranger danger) but I have found those characteristics to be way off. For example, a male who works as a kindergarten teacher would probably be suspected as a pedophile (and we all know it) because of what we're told about the profile of a pedophile but the people who get arrested are those that don't make the news because they're more under the radar.
2. I don't think my question about why people become sexually attracted to boys was answered. I guess that means there is no answer to it but that's not surprising since there is so much ignorance (no offensive) on here. It sounds like a lot of people on here probably had too much therapy for their own good. They almost sound as hysterical as the women!
I wanted to know what made this person that I revered for become what he became. That is why I can't really be angry with him because if the professionals can't understand him then how can he? Even more confusing is the suggesting for pedophiles to seek help from people who obviously don't know much about it.
3. Nevertheless, I don't think it happens as much anymore. I think that when it does happen it's more of a cultural thing. For example, I was watching a program with kids who were removed from the homes for being sexually abused and the one common denominator was that they all looked like they just crossed the border. I would be shocked if any of the kids that I knew (especially the boys) were molested. By molested, I don't mean 'covertly.' I see it more as an 'industry' trying to stay alive to sell books or something so they redefine it to include more people that wouldn't have been included 10 years ago.



Edited by OrionH (05/22/11 09:41 AM)

Top
#362737 - 05/22/11 01:17 PM Re: Why do people become pedophiles? [Re: Ken Singer, LCSW]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6401
Loc: 2.5 NATO Nations
Originally Posted By: Ken Singer, LCSW
The link that Robbie posted above is called "Child Molesters: A Behavioral Analysis".


Yeah, this paper was clearly written for agents and police to be edified in understanding the "bahavior" and nothing more. In reading the thing cover-to-cover, I quickly realed how freakin scary this all is (so it was very triggering) and it taught me some of the realities out there. Though he mentions youthfull offenders (such as in my case) he does not dig deeply enough into the abnormal child psychology for my wishes. He also neglects some enablement found in certain issolating circumstances, but every paragraph was a learning experience for me. Do not read the article in search of any self-understanding or healing information. Its snot there.

_________________________
Wishing You Were Here!

The Aftermath Video

The Water Buffalo Song

Top
#454615 - 11/21/13 03:53 AM pedophile profile file - FBI [Re: Still]
victor-victim Offline


Registered: 09/27/03
Posts: 3333
Loc: O Kanada
Child Molesters: A Behavioral Analysis

Originally Posted By: Still
If you want some in-depth material, this is a GREAT paper to read. Its written by the pro of pros in the FBI.

http://www.missingkids.com/en_US/publications/NC70.pdf


this is an excellent document, and should be required reading.
thanks for the link, Still!

quoted from the document:
"Children who are seduced or actively
participate in their victimization, however, often feel guilty and blame themselves
because they did not do what they were “supposed” to do.
They did not recognize, resist, and report. When humans do something they know they were not supposed
to do, they tend not to tell others they did it and lie when asked about it. These
seduced and manipulated victims may also feel a need to sometimes describe their
victimization in more socially acceptable, but inaccurate ways that relieve them of
this shame and guilt
.
"

"Acquaintance child molesters, although sometimes violent, tend by necessity to
control their victims primarily through the grooming or seduction process and by
exploiting the immaturity of their victims. They usually need long-term access to do
this. They have been labeled as “groomers” (van Dam, 2006). This process not only
gains the victim’s initial cooperation, but also decreases the likelihood of disclosure
and increases the likelihood of ongoing, repeated access. Acquaintance offenders
with a preference for younger victims (younger than 12) are more likely to also
have to spend time seducing the potential victim’s parents/guardians or caretakers
to gain their trust and confidence. An acquaintance molester who uses violence to
control victims is more likely to be quickly reported to law enforcement and easily
identified. An acquaintance molester who seduces his victims can sometimes go
unreported for years if not indefinitely
.
"

"There is not one 'profile' that will determine if someone is a
child molester. But there are some child molesters who tend to engage in highly
predictable and recognizable behavior patterns. The potential evidence available
as a result of the long-term, persistent, and ritualized behavior patterns of many
preferential sex offenders makes the understanding and recognition of these patterns
important and useful to investigators and prosecutors in legally appropriate ways
."



regarding whether a perpetrator, predator, or pedophile can be physically profiled, i would have to say no.

the FBI document claims...
"He cannot
be identified by physical description and,
often, not even by “bad” character traits.
Without specialized training or experience
and an objective perspective, he cannot
easily be distinguished from others
."

although i do agree with canuck.
Originally Posted By: Canuck

God gave us instincts to protect us out there in the wild, including from each other. It wouldn't hurt if people who *Suspect* that someone might be a molester or other violent criminal would be discretely more vigilant about that person.


one should never ignore a gut instinct, and should at least investigate a hunch.
safety first, and where the safety of children is concerned, it is best to err on the side of caution.
suspicion, alone, can do no harm, if handled delicately and discretely.
unsupported suspicions that lead to accusations and rumours can destroy decent people, quicker than black magic and evil spells.
the fallout from such a disaster will likely damage the very child one is attempting to protect.

that being said,
i can honestly confess that i instantly and instinctively did not trust any of my abusers from the moment i met them.
something in the eyes, the tone of voice, the touch...
i'd get a creepy vibe, which i suppressed, dismissed or ignored, to my own peril.
the abuse never came as a total surprise.
it was expected, anticipated even.
but beneath that pervading sense of impending doom,
i harboured and nurtured a fragile hope that "this time" it would be different.
"this time" i was wrong.
"this time" i was worthy.

when it happened,
it was like i knew it was coming all along,
and the deed, once complete and confirmed, was better behind me than looming ahead.
that "just get it over with" feeling.
that blessed moment when the struggle between "dread vs. hope" gave way to the certainty of surrender and submission.

part of the reason i later carried a lot of blame, shame and guilt.
i started to think, i was too stupid or too weak to protect myself.
i may have even wanted it to happen.
crazy thoughts. self doubt. mental torture.

of course, being the intended child victim, the abuser would look at and talk to me differently than to another adult.
that might have been clue enough for me, but they would go to great lengths to conceal their hidden side from potential accusers.

i used to hold a lot of blame and resentment for the adults in my life that failed to protect me from what i thought were obvious threats, but i now believe that the grooming process might not have been as visible to them as it was to me.

public education and awareness is a good healthy start toward CSA prevention.


i will add this note:
the adults who got involved in my life,
and were truly trying to help me,
and were genuine good people,
(i.e. did not try to abuse me sexually)
did not show me enough affection to get my attention.
their professionally distant demeanour and "no fun" attitude made me think they were boring robots who had no idea what was really going on.
to my own discredit, i usually betrayed those people, forcing them to reject me, just to prove they didn't "really" care.

now that i look back...
considering how determined i was to perpetuate my self destruction,
it is a miracle i made it this far.

"Broken and sick, again I live. By death's taste, I know life's worth."
~ Zahir~ad~Din (Babur the Tiger)
_________________________
Victor|Victim

War
Love
Poetry

Top
#454637 - 11/21/13 12:04 PM Re: Why do people become pedophiles? [Re: Ken Singer, LCSW]
InsideTheWall Offline


Registered: 01/10/09
Posts: 280
Originally Posted By: Ken Singer, LCSW
Good point, Castle. While all pedophiles are child molesters/rapists, not all child molesters are pedophiles.
Thats actually different than what I've read. Most pedos don't abuse children. They want to, but don't.


Edited by InsideTheWall (11/21/13 12:05 PM)

Top
#454644 - 11/21/13 01:32 PM Re: Why do people become pedophiles? [Re: InsideTheWall]
BraveFalcon Offline
Greeter
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/25/13
Posts: 1096
Loc: The ATL
Originally Posted By: InsideTheWall
Originally Posted By: Ken Singer, LCSW
Good point, Castle. While all pedophiles are child molesters/rapists, not all child molesters are pedophiles.
Thats actually different than what I've read. Most pedos don't abuse children. They want to, but don't.


I'm not sure it's really possible to know this one way or another. I mean, surely there are people out there who live with pedophilic attractions and urges and who do not act on them but those ones you'll never hear about, so I can't imagine how one could conduct a legitimate study to confirm how prevalent such people are vs pedophiles who do act out and abuse. Just sayin'. Peace,

Ken

Top
#454649 - 11/21/13 03:24 PM Re: Why do people become pedophiles? [Re: OrionH]
victor-victim Offline


Registered: 09/27/03
Posts: 3333
Loc: O Kanada
not all pedophiles are molestors, not all molestors are rapists, not all rapists are pedophiles.

some people are all three.
some are a combination of two.
some only fall into one of these categories.

this is what i have learned from my own therapy and research studies, including the FBI document listed above.
_________________________
Victor|Victim

War
Love
Poetry

Top
Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 >


Moderator:  ModTeam, TJ jeff 

I agree that my access and use of the MaleSurvivor discussion forums and chat room is subject to the terms of this Agreement. AND the sole discretion of MaleSurvivor.
I agree that my use of MaleSurvivor resources are AT-WILL, and that my posting privileges may be terminated at any time, and for any reason by MaleSurvivor.