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#360019 - 04/17/11 07:01 PM SSA Article by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D.
nevragan Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/22/08
Posts: 907
Loc: NC
I've been searching for answers regarding SSA lately. I know many of us here have issues with this and need answers too. I googled SSA and came up with a link by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. I have read most of it and it is really an in depth article. There are points that I'm not completely sold on and others that I really disagree about also. I thought I'd post the link for others to see.

**I know that there are some out there that disagree so let's keep this discussion about this topic in a civil manner towards each other. Everyone has an opinion. Enjoy!

http://narth.com/docs/niconew.html

Andy


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#360036 - 04/17/11 09:52 PM Re: SSA Article by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. [Re: nevragan]
risingagain Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 595
Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Wow man....

" As clinicians, we have witnessed the intense suffering caused by homosexuality, which many of our members see as a "failure to function according to design." "

These are the same old arguments about how some feel that homosexuality leads to unhappiness / unfulfillment and narrow definitions of what God's design is. Nature is full of sexual diversity- there are creatures that reproduce in all kinds of ways.... Just because we can't comprehend it does not make it a failure.

If SSA is for you just a distortion related to the abuse, then changing your behaviors and working through the abuse should clear up the feelings. If not, perhaps you're gay. It's really that simple.


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#360046 - 04/17/11 11:06 PM Re: SSA Article by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. [Re: risingagain]
Fissy Tsickens Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/23/08
Posts: 466
Loc: Bassett, Virginia
I don't think this article or the points made therein apply to gay men who embrace their sexuality; rather, if you review the beginning of the article, the author is writing about SSA. Though perhaps not stated clearly, I take that to mean unwanted SSA. For me, personally, I read through it and saw myself in many of the authors assertions. Things just kind of "clicked" for me.

My way of thinking on this is that if you are happy with your sexuality, whatever it may be, then good for you! And who cares what the author or any other researchers say? But for someone like me, who is married 25+ years and fathered 5 kids, the SSA thing kinda gets a little dicey. You know, like the time when my wife checked my email and found the one where the guy I hooked up with discussed our previous rendezvous. Awkward.

In summary, I found this to be an enlightening article that led to numerous "aha moments" for me. Thanks for sharing it, Andy. And thank you, too, risingagain, for weighing in on it.

Peace,

John

_________________________
Wish that I could cry
Fall upon my knees
Find a way to lie
About a home I’ll never see

It may sound absurd...but don’t be naive
Even heroes have the right to bleed
I may be disturbed...but won’t you concede
Even heroes have the right to dream
It’s not easy to be me

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#360048 - 04/17/11 11:37 PM Re: SSA Article by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. [Re: Fissy Tsickens]
risingagain Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 595
Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Well, certainly, but being married with kids does not make you straight. I know several gay men who were unhappy in their heterosexual marriage who later came out and felt much more happy and at peace. They continued to be involved in their children's lives, often in a more healthy and honest way.

It's individual.

Here's another perspective and some additional information on NARTH. I feel people should have all the facts:

http://www.truthwinsout.org/narth/

NARTH, and many other organizations driven by a subset of religious beliefs, project many stereotypes onto gay men and gay life.

I have never been the type of gay guy who drinks cocktails, discusses their hair and prefers women as friends. I was really afraid to accept myself. I was terrified that I would be like the man in those old Saturday Night Live skits .. he accepts he's gay and then suddenly he has an embarassing lisp.

There's nothing wrong with more feminine gay men. However, to color all gay man as being 'deficient in masculine' is like calling all black people 'excessive in aggression and thuggishness'. It's BS. There are more than a few pro level athletes in ultra-masculine sports like football which are gay. All of the 'causative' factors suggested by NARTH and others are just narrow reductions. And the depictions of life as a gay person as being meaningless, full of hook ups and drug parties, they don't represent the better possibilities that are out there for gay people....

I simply feel that people should have access to balanced information about what being gay is like. Family is very important to me, and I have learned that being happily gay, committed and raising children is not only possible, it is increasingly what gay men are looking for.

So when I hear 'acting out' I think of people who are pushing yet more of themselves down where they don't have to see it.

SSA is a set of feelings. For some it is just the desire to GET WITH, FUCK, BE FUCKED by another man. For others it includes romance, cuddling, and close care. For others it means the lifelong commitment of partnership. For some it is wanted, for others it is not wanted. In my experience the best way to avoid unnecessary suffering is to witness my thoughts and feelings and to listen to my heart about which course to steer. I don't believe in a single 'gold standard' of action, so I won't try to tell you how to live a happy life.

But I certainly believe it's possible to live a happy and gay life!

I hope to be there one day. For now, I would like to learn what Love is, not in terms of gender, but in terms of unconditional love: to be truly cared about by another person and to care about them too. To me, that's what really matters.


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#360054 - 04/18/11 12:38 AM Re: SSA Article by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. [Re: risingagain]
pufferfish Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/08
Posts: 6843
Loc: USA
He has written a couple of books on this subject.

Reparative Therapy of Male Homosexuality, A New Clinical Approach. by Joseph Nicolosi

http://www.amazon.com/Reparative-Therapy-Male-Homosexuality-Clinical/dp/0765701421/

and

A Parent's Guide to Preventing Homosexuality by Joseph Nicolosi.

http://www.amazon.com/Parents-Guide-Preventing-Homosexuality/dp/0830823794/

I have heard some tape recordings of his ideas and they sounded good to me. I have the books but I haven't read them yet.

Allen


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#360055 - 04/18/11 12:42 AM Re: SSA Article by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. [Re: pufferfish]
risingagain Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 595
Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Great, well whatever works for you bro!


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#360087 - 04/18/11 10:59 AM Re: SSA Article by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. [Re: risingagain]
Ever-fixed Mark Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 01/02/10
Posts: 727
Loc: United States
Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. is an ideologue and resolutely anti-gay. Caveat emptor!

Here is just some of what Nicolosi has said:

Quote:
"Lesbians and homosexual men are 19 times and 14 times more likely, respectively, to have had syphilis than heterosexual men and women."
“We, as citizens, need to articulate God’s intent for human sexuality,”
“When we live our God-given integrity and our human dignity, there is no space for sex with a guy.”
"I do not believe that any man can ever be truly at peace in living out a homosexual orientation.”
"There is no such thing as a homosexual person. We are all heterosexuals. Homosexuality is a de>
_________________________

Everybody here's got a story to tell
Everybody's been through their own hell
There's nothing too special about getting hurt
Getting over it, that takes the work

- "Duck and Cover" by Glen Phillips

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#360090 - 04/18/11 11:17 AM Re: SSA Article by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. [Re: Ever-fixed Mark]
risingagain Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 595
Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada
My experience of Lee on the weekend was that he was a very even-handed guy who really respected my needs and wishes.

For you guys struggling with unwanted SSA I think you'd be much more likely to get better treatment from a guy like him than someone with a fixed agenda around SSA.

I was actually pretty angry at Lee because he helps guys who want to reduce their SSA if that is their choice. My impression is he doesn't take sides on this issue.


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#360091 - 04/18/11 11:22 AM Re: SSA Article by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. [Re: risingagain]
risingagain Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 595
Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Quote:
There's nothing wrong with more feminine gay men. However, to color all gay man as being 'deficient in masculine' is like


I wanted to add something here. I said this to a brother on the weekend. I told him that to me, a man's tears are about the most beautiful thing in the world.

So I need to correct myself, femininity is not weakness or deficiency. Masculine and feminine qualities are both awesome, and a man can be both.

Nothing like tenderness from a rough and tumble guy, I say!


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#360094 - 04/18/11 12:05 PM Re: SSA Article by Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D. [Re: risingagain]
CheerfulJohn Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/22/10
Posts: 142
Loc: England (at the moment)
Joseph Nicolosi looks like he would have helped me over the years.

EFM's belief system forbids the notion that there is design and purpose to align to or clash with from a Designer.

EFM preaching is offensive to me.

CJ

_________________________
Wolves will live with lambs. Leopards will lie down with goats. Calves, young lions, and year-old lambs will be together, and little children will lead them.

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