Wow. Moved the topic into the ghetto, huh? Let's get this back in the closet where it belongs. How pathetic!
If you have a cogent critique to make, please do so.
My expanded comment is simply that SSA is a very difficult and painful topic for a lot of survivors. For me, it's been the toughest so far and hopefully the toughest ever.
I've gone through stages with it that are probably familiar to a lot of people. Wondering if being abused made me gay. Wondering how I could not be gay and at the same time be drawn to sex with men. The shame associated with it was nearly overwhelming at times as I struggled to figure it out and manage it.
This conversation I think cuts to the heart of a lot of the issues, and I felt that some of what was being said was useful and enlightening.
Specifically, the discussion between Gary and CJ above really struck a chord with me. How they both describe the same type of pressure, but from different perspectives. One pointing out how painful it is for a gay man to be pressured into trying to be straight. And the other pointing out how the same is true of a straight man being pigeonholed as someone who's in the closet. I've faced this issue myself, as people have wanted to label me. But this was the first time I've ever observed the parallels, and it struck me how we all react with the same frustration to this ridiculous pressure. And it is a pressure that all of us who face this will have to overcome.
I've finally learned to be very open about who and what I am, what I've done and with whom, what responsibility is mine and what isn't. In part, I've had to get so specific about it because people insist on processing this shit through their own labelling system. So I've been fairly blunt describing my situation. But it is painful, and requires bravery to confront all of this shit.
When I logged on this morning, I read the lastest posts and was inspired by how openly and honestly people were sharing their feelings, and I hopped in the shower to think about a reply, part of which was to note that there are probably only a handful of places where survivors can talk about this issue and not immediately be labelled as nuts or ostaracized.
Then when I log in to reply, what do I find? Even here the discussion is ostracized. I find the two SSA posts, this and the other one, had been shoved into a corner, and I don't like it when people try to silence the discussion. Like many survivors, I've dealt with people who want the discussion silenced all my life and I have little patience for it.
As an example, recently in New Hampshire, where I lived for a long while, the speaker of the house called out the catholic archbishop, noting that he lacked credibility to speak out on morality since he was nothing more than a 'pedophile pimp,' which is accurate. I love it that he said that. But, of course, two days later he had to apologize and retract. Not because what he said was wrong, but because it just shouldn't be talked about in polite company. Blah, blah, blah. I've come to expect that bullshit elsewhere. But here, among survivors, silencing honest, well-intentioned debate or trying to push it into a corner is wrong. So I spoke my opinion on it.
Is the link posted here from a quack? Probably. There are plenty of them out there. Some of the people who've helped me along the way may be considered quacks to others. My guess is the guy has success counselling straight men who really are confused and is harmful to gay men who are having a difficult time accepting their sexualty. I have no complaint with the people who want to debate the merits or lack of merit to what he says and point out the errors, false assumptions, bigotry etc. in what he says. In fact, I think it's healthy so that people who read his material get their eyes opened.
But pushing this whole discussion aside reenforces the idea that SSA is something to be ashamed of. That it shouldn't be seen in public. In the main forum you'll find people talking about god, gay relationships, women abusers, all topics that have their own special forums. But I don't notice them being shoved into the special forums. The people who posted these two topics did so in the main forum. So pushing them down here is tantamount to trying to shush them, in my opinion. Hence, my comment about putting the debate back in the closet.
If the debate had turned into namecalling, threatening or hate speech, fine, kill the tread and/or comments. But to do this to it is wrong.