Newest Members
MG5555, ShinTensei, jaklumen, Bennett, 0128
12506 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
Moriji (44), Nicos (48), weharry1959 (55)
Who's Online
2 registered (manipulated, traveler), 18 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
12506 Members
74 Forums
64205 Topics
448046 Posts

Max Online: 418 @ 07/02/12 07:29 AM
Twitter
Topic Options
#355986 - 03/09/11 01:48 AM CSA, ASA & What We Have In Common
CruxFidelis Offline


Registered: 06/16/10
Posts: 486
Loc: NJ
I think I'll give up whining for Lent, so perhaps I'll get this out of my system now...

When I first came onto this site, I didn't know what CSA stood for. I remember being in chat and asking, "What's CSA?" It became apparent to me that as a man who was sexually assaulted as an adult, I was in the minority. If it wasn't for the fact that a few kind souls here reached out to me and told me this site wasn't exclusively for Childhood Sexual Abuse survivors, I probably would have thought this place wasn't for me and missed out on a lot of the healing that happened after I found this site.

I can't help but to notice that a lot of people on this site say "CSA" when it seems like what they are saying could apply to a man who was abused at any age. I'm not saying people should give up the term, or that I'm offended by people talking about childhood sexual abuse in a way that's mutually exclusive to adult sexual abuse.

Let's imagine a Venn Diagram:



There are CSA concerns, ASA concerns, and general sexual abuse concerns. Ask yourself... do you ever use the term "CSA" when you are really talking about that space in the middle of the Venn Diagram? Are you aware of the fact that grown men can be raped, too? Is that part of your consciousness?

I'm not saying this to single anyone out in particular, or to raise a big stink, but as an ASA survivor, it pushes me away when people say "CSA" like it is a blanket statement. It shuts me out of the conversation. It places a barrier between us that doesn't need to be there.

I'm sure no one meant to be hurtful... but let's all take a moment to think about the power our words have to include and exclude others from the conversation. Let's try to be intentional about the way we speak and be as inclusive as we can to people who may have had different experiences than our own. We don't know exactly how many words there are in the English language, but there are thousands and thousands of words out there--let's choose them wisely.

</whining>

_________________________
“If a man wishes to be sure of the road he treads on, he must close his eyes and walk in the dark.”

- Saint John of the Cross

Top
#356015 - 03/09/11 12:09 PM Re: CSA, ASA & What We Have In Common [Re: CruxFidelis]
kb8715 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 808
Well Pete you know me. Words and terms don't matter at all on this. What matters is your heart and soul.

Pete you are my brother in recovery not because you were hurt as an adult, not because I was hurt as a kid, but because you cared for me when I was down and in dozens of ways since then have both cared for and inspired me.

I guess I could say simply we are both recovering from abuse or we are both recovering from being crime victims, but even that just don't cut it for me.

Maybe I am avoiding your point but it's not ASA, or CSA for me. It's friends/brothers supporting each other on a bumpy ride.

Asked another brother here if he gets car sick on bumpy rides.

That's my Keithism for today, typo free......




Edited by kb8715 (03/09/11 12:09 PM)
_________________________
"You can get far in life by pushing except through a door marked PULL...." Profile quote in my oldest son's senior year HS Yearbook.

Top
#356100 - 03/10/11 10:06 AM Re: CSA, ASA & What We Have In Common [Re: kb8715]
Avery46 Offline


Registered: 09/23/10
Posts: 1243
Loc: USA
Hi, Pete.

Since most of my "issues" seem tied to CSA, I use the term CSA most often. BUT, I do talk about ASA without using the term ASA as I am adult today so, I use CSA to "clarify" the time period as well.

I have talked about my ASA in the men abused as adults section.

You guys inspire me to recover from the sexual abuses both CSA and ASA.

BTW - I don't get sick riding in a car.

A



Edited by Avery46 (03/10/11 10:06 AM)
_________________________
aka DJsport

Top
#356193 - 03/11/11 10:01 AM Re: CSA, ASA & What We Have In Common [Re: Avery46]
dark empathy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 2024
Loc: durham, north england
The problem with any sort of catagory, especially when applied to somethin like age, is that there are always exceptions.

As some people may know, my own abuse happened at secondary school when I was 12-15 and involved gangs of other students (of both gendas but mainly girls), approximately my own age or older.

Was this csa? I was legally a child, but it certainly didn't happen at home at the hands of an adult, neither did it happen in the context of a relationship, sinse those involved were blatantly, obviously and absolutely intent on causing harm, or at the most amusing themselves with what was considdered humerous.

This situation is hugely different from, ---- for instance a person who was abused by a parent.

This is also why I myself tend to use the term sa, or just abuse, rather than giving it an age limit.

The thing I have found though, is that while there are often huge differences in my own experience, and some of my feelings to others, there are similarities, and even in cases where my own experience is absolutely and totally unique, ---- for instance with respect to my visual imparement, I have found people on this site simply because! they themselves are going through recovery of some sort, are more receptive to the ideas, experiences and thoughts of others generally.

As far as conventions and abbreviations go, I'm genuinely not sure whether it's because a vast majority of cases of abuse do happen during childhood or adolescence that people use the term csa, or just that it's an easier text speak abreviation than typing the word abuse and one people have got used to. Usually, unless it is specifically in an age related context I've learnt to read "csa" as abuse in general.

Another point though, is what exactly in abuse terms is a child?

I was 12-15, yet I was reading degree level physics books, and actually the happiest experience I had as a teenager was my work experience at Nottingham university chaplaincy. I had no close friends my own age, and got on far better with adults.

Was I a child?

Is a Shy 32 year old who is coerced into his first relationship with an abusive partner any less vulnerable or hurt than he would've been at 16 or 18 simply because he's older?

Heck no! an even though a 16 year old in the same situation would count as having experienced cCsa, it doesn't seem that the situation can be overly different.

This is whyas I said, unless it is relative to the discussion I tend to just read the word "abuse" whenever people write csa.


Top
#356210 - 03/11/11 01:03 PM Re: CSA, ASA & What We Have In Common [Re: dark empathy]
RecoveryReady1 Offline


Registered: 12/05/10
Posts: 433
A big part of the problem for survivors of childhood sexual abuse is that they are unable to put themselves in the shoes of the child and to see the vulnerability of a child.....
Children have no defense, they have not developed a self....their brains have not developed the ability to think rationally....We as children are like blind people.....we need adults to tell show us and we have to trust ....WE HAVE TO! this is Survival.....a child will ask basic questions.....Am I pleasing you....will you keep me safe...there very survival depends on this.....Their vulnerability is very hard to contemplate....This I think is the major roadblock to recovery from childhood sexual abuse.....
As far as adult sexual abuse....It has it's own challenges, and demands it's very own sensitivity, in order to have the faith and trust to work through recovery....
The pain, isolation, addictions, hopelessness and whatever else are the same, but I think there are unique sensitivities that meed to be brought to each in order to really be where the rubber meets the road......
That's my take,
Steve


Top
#356243 - 03/11/11 08:38 PM Re: CSA, ASA & What We Have In Common [Re: RecoveryReady1]
LandOfShadow Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 684
Loc: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
I'm trying to understand this better.... here's what I think about it:

Everyone is unique, but certain catagorys don't offend. I don't mind if people assume I'm gay or assume I'm straight because I have good experiences in both catagories and I feel..... well, close enough most of the time. Whatever... about it.

But ASA and CSA, there a sting to CSA if your ASA. Telling. Ignored again. I understand. I think. It's just another whole layer of not understanding that's really VERY BIG. Perhaps we need CASA. Child & Adult SA.

Isn't there a lot more overlap between A & B in the Venn Diagram? Like, 80-90%?

_________________________
Et par le pouvoir d’un mot Je recommence ma vie, Je suis né pour te connaître, Pour te nommer
Liberté

And by the power of a single word I can begin my life again, I was born to know you, to name you
Freedom

Paul Eluard

Top
#356249 - 03/11/11 09:48 PM Re: CSA, ASA & What We Have In Common [Re: LandOfShadow]
jurek Offline


Registered: 08/23/10
Posts: 130
Loc: New Hampshire
Yeah, categories and labels can be really disempowering when there are assumptions built in to their use. For years I felt like I had no voice and no right to a voice whenever the topic of sexual abuse in general came up, because I always felt that there was an assumption that it is something men do to women period. So even though I often secretly identified with the victims I still felt excluded. Even though that was partly because of my ignorance (until I stumbled across MS less than a year ago I had NO idea how widespread the sexual abuse of males was, in spite of all of the clergy abuse cases in the media), it still bugs me that the local sexual abuse crisis center that runs the male survivor group I am in hands out reading material that assumes that the reader is female. My point? It's always good to use language carefully so as to not exclude people and rob them of their voice. I'll make the effort myself.

George

_________________________
-jurek

Jurek ogorek, kielbasa i sznurek, kielbasa uciekla, Jurek do piekla!


Top
#356508 - 03/14/11 08:52 AM Re: CSA, ASA & What We Have In Common [Re: jurek]
kb8715 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 808
Been thinking about this still Pete and I still just don't like or care for the labels.

Seen and heard good men in their teens twenties thirteis forties etc ask the related questions.

Abuse is abuse is abuse...

Don't know if those here hurt as teens or adult feel anyway different about the effect than I do.

What I do know is that the men here that I know who were abused later than I may have been have been are very supportive to me and all else here.

End of the day its still as bloody shame and of us are here and a blessing men like you are here to help.

Spring Lake....Hoffmans. That's the ticket.

_________________________
"You can get far in life by pushing except through a door marked PULL...." Profile quote in my oldest son's senior year HS Yearbook.

Top


Moderator:  ModTeam, TJ jeff 

I agree that my access and use of the MaleSurvivor discussion forums and chat room is subject to the terms of this Agreement. AND the sole discretion of MaleSurvivor.
I agree that my use of MaleSurvivor resources are AT-WILL, and that my posting privileges may be terminated at any time, and for any reason by MaleSurvivor.