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#345338 - 11/15/10 08:56 PM Re: uncovering the problem [Re: jesusfreesya]
hopeandtry Offline


Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 476
By "acting out" I assume you mean he has actually abused someone sexually? I think I'm a little confused by what has happened versus what you fear may happen.


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#345370 - 11/16/10 05:56 AM Re: uncovering the problem [Re: hopeandtry]
jesusfreesya Offline


Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 27
I am sorry I can not be more specific. Right now must concentrate on educating ourselves- I'm sure you remember when you were at that stage.


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#345376 - 11/16/10 06:34 AM Re: uncovering the problem [Re: Ken Singer, LCSW]
jesusfreesya Offline


Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 27
Ken,
Ty. Nice to meet you and the others I have encountered on the board so far and appreciate being educated re the false myth. Already, this site has been very useful for me in that I read an older post yesterday that answered at least 3 questions I have wondered about for years that I wondered if I would ever find answers to. Although this site is for male survivors of sexual abuse, I can see it answers many relationship issues. I am a "counselor person" having studied for a counseling degree, although I ended up going into a related field. I find it very interesting that with the lack of solidness in many, if not most marriages,that an issue like sexual abuse brings about a level of honesty and communication that most couples may never achieve. I'm a great believer that much good can come out of bad. So, I am happy to of found this site and look forward to what I will learn here. I have always cared very deeply about this subject and although I have a very full life as it is, hope that I can be of help to someone with what I am learning here.



Edited by jesusfreesya (11/16/10 06:36 AM)

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#345378 - 11/16/10 06:47 AM Re: uncovering the problem [Re: Avery46]
jesusfreesya Offline


Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 27
Hi Donnie,
I am sorry that you were once subjected to the myth. It is great that you can educate others now that it is not true.


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#345379 - 11/16/10 06:56 AM Re: uncovering the problem [Re: jesusfreesya]
dark empathy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 2024
Loc: durham, north england
86 percent of statistics are made up anyway ;D.

Seriously, welcome to the site Jf.

There is one thing which is confusing me slightly about your story.

This chap has admitted he has a problem, ie, acting out and is attending a live in program.

However, has he admitted to experiencing sa himself? The reason I ask is that's generally the first step.

it's possible that his behaviour is a symptom of something which happened to him earlier, and working on that will only deal with the symptom and not the desease, it's equally possible that his behaviour simply exists for some other reason or no reason at all.

say for instance someone were an alcoholic. they may be using alcohol as a way of coping with some sort of past trauma, such as abuse, ---- or indeed many other things, or they might simply be an alcoholic because they got into a bad cycle of addiction.

The only real person who knows this is the alcoholic themselves, and until they admit they have a problem, ---- either just an alcohol related problem or something else, there's not a lot that can be done. Therapy might be able to help in either case, but really the first move, either in getting rid of the alcohol addiction or deciding to deal with it's route cause, has to be the alcoholics, nobody else can pressure, cajole or persuade them into such a decision, it has to be theirs.

So, if this family member of yours is going on a retreat, that might be a good thing, sinse it sounds like he's planning on at least starting to deal with things.

Btw, as regards the statistic and myth business, I think part of the problem this provokes such a strong reaction is how harmful this believe has been to men in the past.

There are various stories of men on this site who've had some horrible treatment from others after they've disclosed their abuse, and some even worse stories of abusers who use such myths to their advantage.

I myself was not only abused by girls, but on several occasions they accused me! of doing things to them.

As an undergraduate I once had to sit through a so called "introductory" lecture to s/xual ethics, where a very aggressive feminist lecturer began with the words "70 percent of men would rape a woman if they could" and continued on a wrant about how evil men were. she admitted that on some rare, ---- very! rare, occasions men would rape another man (when no woman was available), but she never even considdered the idea that women could be abusers and men victims, ----- in fact she gave barely any time to the idea of men being victims at all, ---- and this was supposed to be a fair introduction to the subject as part of an applied ethics module I was doing.

Perhaps this explains why people on this site are a litle more sensative about male sterriotypes.

I hope you find something useful here.


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#345383 - 11/16/10 07:05 AM Re: uncovering the problem [Re: jesusfreesya]
Still Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 6607
Loc: FEMA Region 1
JF,

1) You can find a discussion of The Myths on the home page of this sight.

2) I urge you to buy the book "Victims No Longer" by Mike Lew. It will provide you with a heafty helping of the realities you are facing.


BTW: Love your screen-name. My signature line is sometimes "Jesus loves the hell out of me."



Edited by Robbie Brown (11/16/10 07:06 AM)
_________________________
Hell needs firewood too ya know!

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#345537 - 11/17/10 12:53 PM Re: uncovering the problem [Re: dark empathy]
jesusfreesya Offline


Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 27
Hi dark,

If you are confused then you know how we feel. The chap has long since admitted that the problem is his, but as to what the problem is, he has been very elusive. In other words, he knows he has a problem, but claims he can not remember his childhood.

Over time, the story of his family came out, a little by him and much more through an old family friend who paid us a visit one day. It was revealed that the chap was very much rejected by his father while his father and other family members were living immoral, highly dysfunctional lives. SA was not mentioned, but both the chap and the family friend seemed to hide something much darker.

Though we were relieved to get part of the story, we felt there is surely something else we were not told. For years, the chap was fairly chipper, however we noticed he was like 2 different ppl. One day he was chipper, almost giddy, and the next he was gloomy and often angry.

You don't know a person until you know him- with time we saw a very troubled soul emerge. We began to see other character flaws, mood swings and wrong behaviors. It became obvious the chap was in a great deal of denial re "something". This something eventually resulted in his acting-out.

So, years later and after many attempts to help him, this husband and father has agreed to go into a live-in program. No, he has not admitted what his problem is. Either he does not know himself, blanked out what he has been through, or he knows and is covering up what it is.

He has had many chances to come out with it and deal with it. Whereas he "owns" the problem (whatever it is) and has promised everyone who has offered their help that he would work on it, each time he has tried to begin, has acted like he has amnesia. When confronted by his wife as to what effort he has put forth, he has said that he had good intentions to begin, but "something" (another something)has stopped him every time- has said things like he couldn't focus. This is why the last resort has been to get to him to a live-in program.

From what the live-in counselors have told us, men who go into the program because they have reached the end of their ropes (hit bottom) are the ones who usually succeed. There are others who enter the program as a last resort if they don't want to lose their wives and children. A percentage of these men succeed. But the bottom line is, it is what a man puts into the program that is what he will get out of it.

The counselors told us that men have been set free from every kind of problem including csa. We have had our concerns that due to the intense nature of csa, although as I said, we have not even established if there is any csa, just strongly suspect it could be the problem, that possibly more specialized counseling will be needed in addition to a program such as this. But at this time, we know we have to take a very decisive step and this is it.

The counselors say it is a very good sign that he is willing to get help as most men run from help. So, at least we have that going for us. Of course, there are no guarantees, but we feel a peace that we are doing the right thing.

As long as this husband/father wants help, we will stand behind him. It is only if he shows us he is not going to participate in his recovery that we will wash our hands of the situation.

Although we understand that men need to hit bottom in order to change, we believe there are counseling methods to bring things into focus. To do nothing is not helpful and demeans the lives of innocent wives and children. The bottom line is men must choose to either stay stuck or to be set free.

I understand and very much agree with your assessment of how there could be a number of reasons men exhibit wrong behaviors, that they have to hit bottom and what often blocks them. Your account of the "aggressive feminist lecturer" is common in our universities. There are so many wrong messages all around us. But we each have a choice to whom we listen and in how we walk, or walk out of, wrong situations that are perpetuated against us.

Ty for your contribution to this discussion. It helps so much to have supportive ppl around when going through a life crisis.





Edited by jesusfreesya (11/17/10 01:12 PM)

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#345585 - 11/17/10 07:12 PM Re: uncovering the problem [Re: Still]
jesusfreesya Offline


Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 27
Hi Robbie,
Ty for your suggestions. Have viewed your videos and was deeply touched. Glad you like my screen name. It comes from a lyric in a song by one of my favorite singers, Jon Gibson. In fact, his music is about getting set free from the myriad of problems ppl have. Check him out at YouTube and jongibson.com. He once played with Stevie Wonder and another well known singer that escapes my mind right now.

Like your signature, too. Yes, Jesus can get the "hell" out of anyone who will let him- whether that hell was put there from someone else's actions or their own wrong choices! I found this out a long time ago and have lived 100% depression-free and in perfect peace ever since. The Bible calls it "the peace that passes understanding". Not that I don't have my share of unfair situations in life- the one I am dealing with currently is one of the worst ever. But I know what it is to be wrapped in the arms of God.

He protects me in such amazing ways. Like one thing he does is places a huge bubble around me re those who have hurt or betrayed me. If you can picture being enveloped by a huge, beautiful bubble so that when the painful thoughts of the wrong choices of others against you come your way, they just bounce off, that is what it is like. Instead of focusing on the unloving things that others have done to me, it is like the thoughts of the pain it brings can't penetrate the bubble. It is a form of supernatural protection.

Another example would be, you know how things seem dreariest at night when you've had a rotten day? Well I love the verse in the Bible that says, "joy cometh in the morning". Unless someone has experienced this joy, they can not know how amazing it is. Every single day when I wake up in the morning, I am so full of joy and peace that I can't even remember what bad events occurred the day before! This is also the reason that depression is not even in my vocabulary- it rolls off me like water off a duck's back. All of this is real and there are many other ways that God provides peace to those who believe in Him.

I have just practically arrived at this board, but already have heard so much anguish in members' lives over not being able to come to terms with the past or finding out that one's husband suffers from csa, thus the marriage is robbed of communication/intimacy. My own family member's life has been impacted by symptoms like this now.

And I know those affected by csa may all have questioned if there is a God why did He allow this to happen to me- why didn't he stop it?! But I see from reading posts that a few of you have realized that God is not the enemy. He's on your side, will completely heal and free you from the past and make something beautiful out of your lives. If he did it for me, He will do it for anyone-much more free than expensive therapy and much faster too!


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#345600 - 11/17/10 09:15 PM Re: uncovering the problem [Re: jesusfreesya]
kb8715 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 808
It sounds like a trouble house and extended family and its great professional help is being sought. Famalies unfortunately can "take sides" and for human reasons lack the objectivity to see all the issues taking place. Thankfully a professional will of course explore both sides of the family not assuming the husband or the wife is the sole issue. Reading so many stories here you can't help but see that sometimes the issue is with the husband, sometimes the wife, other times with both.

It is great the husband/father is being steered towards help for whatever issue he may have. No doubt similar care for the wife/mother will insure that any concerns possibly within the other 50% of that partnership is addressed as well.

Here is hoping husband, wife and children all get the professional care they deserve.....

Be well all.

_________________________
"You can get far in life by pushing except through a door marked PULL...." Profile quote in my oldest son's senior year HS Yearbook.

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#345620 - 11/18/10 06:30 AM Re: uncovering the problem [Re: kb8715]
dark empathy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 2024
Loc: durham, north england
Hi Jf.

One piece of advice that I will mention is dealing with sa is A, very hard work and B, not really something you can pick any generic counseler for.

There have been instances where men get very much the wrong response from different therapists, indeed there are stil members of the psychiatric profession who don't believe male Sa actually exists.

I'm not saying that the live in program is a bad idea, just that it may happen that this chap will need to look for a therapist that can be helpful to him, if indeed he is ready to deal with the problem, and if indeed the problem is Sa.

Ultimately, it's something that takes more motivation from within than pushing from without.That's probably why the single most helpful resource I've found myself is in fact this site, and if indeed this chap has experienced sa and is considdering dealing with it, checking here might be a good place to start.


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