brian brings up a great point in the oprah show thread



brian's statement exposes a very important distinction to which i had not given much thought. yes i was a victim of rape as an adult [on multiple occasions in my later teens] but i always perceived that as a secondary circumstance that emerged and developed from the early adolescent experiences of childhood sexual abuse that impacted me as a result of the incestous relationship with an older brother, and therefore did not give it much weight in the broader scope of my recovery story.

we need to focus as an organization as brian suggests on those victim/survivors whose experiences are unrelated specifically to early life CSA.

there are likely more male victims here [ and 'out there'] besides brian, daryl and caleb who would benefit from a broader research focus that would serve their particular recovery needs.

now if there was ever a need for a new forum on malesurvivor, there is one for sure!

Survivors of non-CSA related abuse.

how about them apples? if we had a forum like this, it could double as a statistical data gathering tool.

why not start one today?

Beside the csa ages 4-8 I was also abused as a teen although I got away pretty quick that time. But I was sexually abused in my early 20's and that one is the hardest to talk about or deal with in many ways.
I think a forum as you describe would be good & helpful.

I have never really thought of MS as being a place just (or mostly) for CSA survivors. I have been very aware that there are people on the boards who were abused at all different ages- but maybe a dedicated forum may make the fact that sexual abuse can occur at any age more visible. It would provide a dedicated place to talk about the shame and guilt etc that may be attached to the fact that it occurred at an older age, and may provide clearer insight into certain aspects- if somebody is abused as a child they may be more susceptible to abuse as an older person, and of course this draws in many issues such as how some survivors may be met with prostitution in their older life which is also abuse.

I think sexual abuse (or abuse) of an adult is something that needs to be talked about more, both independent of any abuse from childhood (and in the military etc) and also "interconnected" with abuse from childhood.

(I may be alone on this but to me the term "CSA" has always included young adulthood)

Lewis

I think there should be great consideration before creating a new forum (at some point there has to be a critical mass)...

That being said...it is hard for me to elucidate...why we don't already have a forum for those that don't fit the C...(child designation).

I think the --- (& Men) --- are definately unrepresented...


Caught between the Tigers (TNT)


island

I would definitely be more comfortable telling my story on a forum like the one being discussed. Being abused at a slightly older age than most people here comes with its own set of issues.

I think that this is a fantastic idea, I was actually going to ask for a forum like this to be added. Although we may have similar after affects of our abuse as those who have been affected by CSA, I do believe that there are some significant differences. Also, as an adult survivor, I desire to speak with other adult survivors. I looked around this site for about 2 months before finally signing up, I think I would have signed up faster if it had been more clear that this site was also designed to support and encourage adult survivors.

Thanks for putting this out there! I believe that a forum like this will open communication and ease some frustrations of adult survivors looking for help.

Caleb

I think it was in chat that another survivor pointed out how I might have felt had it happened to them as an adult. That hit me. One legitimate way of dealing with my responses to my own abuses was to remember that I was a developmentally delayed 8yo boy. But that is not so comforting to a man who was raped at gunpoint or by a physically large male. What is healing to remember about an 8yo boy only magnifies the feelings of guilt and powerlessness for someone abused as an adult. Should they have been able to take care of themselves. Truth is, most rapes are ambushes of one type or another. whether the web ensares a young boy or an adult male, predators are prepared to subdue their unsuspecting prey. I remember the news story of a man highly skilled in the martial arts taken captive by Central American guerillas. He was sexually abused during captivity because, as Chuck Norris puts it, fists are no match for bullets. In many ways, there are different issues to be dealt with and I can see those points.

I'm not sure about anyone else, but I would like to think that a forum on a survivor site for "Non CSA survivors" is about facilitating recovery and not to further a psychologist's research.

Brian

i agree that facilitating recovery would be the primary focus of such an endeavor. however i think that development of this as a fledgling field of interest and subsequent study would occur secondarily as a matter of due course. in the end, any responsible effort to raise awareness about a yet unexplored segment of victim/survivors could only serve to benefit the population under discussion, so i see that as a favorable thing. i definitely don't want to see survivors being exploited in any fashion, not for monetary gain or otherwise.

ron

I certainly don't think it should be called anything like "Non CSA survivors" though - a survivor of abuse which may have occurred as an adult may also be a survivor of abuse from childhood. Also "Non-CSA survivors" sounds like a segregation.

It would probably be a tricky forum to find a good name for- a name that is not too long but not confusing. There is probably a good and accepted terminology for survivors of abuse that occurred in adulthood- we could simply call it:

"Survivors of Adulthood Abuse"

But i would consult Ken Singer and see what he thinks.

Lewis

(if the idea goes ahead)

I am very grateful for the people here. Both on the site and those behind the scenes. I have to admit that I have struggled with being here at times though.

I never want to see separation on this site. Gay from straight. Same for adult survivors from CSA ones. I like unity and we need all the unity we can get here since there is little often in our outside world.

But I would like to see this forum come about. Not as a form of separation but as a beacon for new guys who enter and do not stay. I have counted so many who come and unsure if MS has a place for them. They look for posts and others to relate to. And then they do not stay. I think this forum would be a great tool to help them to do so. I think it would strengthen the site.

I am not good at asking for things for myself. Part of the aftermath of my assault. But I can do so for others and feel that for the sake of those not only here but also for the ones still out there - this is needed. And I must admit it fills me with a hesitant joy at the thought that it could become a reality.


Daryl

I would also suggest if this forum goes forward that the "Male Survivors" forum be given the axe.

At that point, the site would be segregated between CSA and non-CSA survivors, GBT survivors and Survivors of Female Abuse. What further need could there be for the Male Survivors Forum?

Brian

Simply because we don't need to pander to society's general attitude of there being something wrong with all-male groupings, whether physically or online, when they're trying to do something good.

For the record I can't remember the last folder that was added to the forum, so either it was over a year ago or I'm blind.

There's nothing wrong with the idea but deep deep down I'm leaning towards making sure the equivalent is also on the member's side for those who want to post in private, and I'd be interested to hear the views of survivors from the military who are all adults, to see whether they don't feel represented from the forum as it is now.

I was talking about the folder "Male Survivors", not the whole website.

I am a military survivor. As such, I do not feel represented when the majority of conversations in Chat and posts here involve aspects of CSA. A military sexual trauma folder would probably be too underutilized to justify its existence, but a Adult Survivors forum probably would not be.

Brian

Let me add a link here to show where this was discussed two years ago.
Adult Survivor Post

Brian

That's my confusion of the words "forum" and "folder", apologies, but my view stays the same about that single folder.

I didn't say I disagreed with it, but I'm surprised there was no official yay or nay two years ago. As long as it's replicated on the members side, there'd be nothing wrong with a pilot to see exactly what happened traffic-wise.

Just my spin...

but I feel...this creation is more about embracing than terminal separativeness...(military...if you were and adult, to be included...like clergy is encompassed, if you were a child)...

I post in many different forums...and, I don't need to be "friends or family" in order to post in that forum for example...

I personally like the "Male Survivors" forum and feel it should be kept intact...as the..."broadest of all/catch all forum."


Earth Born (Kitaro)

island

At least one person here is starting a PM group for those of us that are not CSA survivors.

The president, Jorge Ramirez, said when he took office that this organization would start being more receptive of the needs of non-CSA survivors.

This topic has been discussed for at least 2 years now with no movement whatsoever.

Is it possible NOW to start up this forum?

Brian