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#313027 - 12/05/09 04:57 AM Re: being called names [Re: LilacLouie]
sono Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/19/09
Posts: 1069
Louis,

Be mad at the guys who did that to you not an entire group of people who MAY or MAY NOT have something in common with those who hurt you. You'd do well in your recovery to work on learning to separate the two I think.

sono

_________________________
the family
the perp

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#313028 - 12/05/09 05:06 AM Re: being called names [Re: sono]
LilacLouie Offline


Registered: 07/02/09
Posts: 359
Loc: Utah
I came to the Gay/Bi/Trans Survivors forum ONLY because a man here at MS, a man I thought was my friend, posted something that really bothered him.

Go be gay if you want, I don't care. Leave me out of it.


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#313036 - 12/05/09 08:42 AM Re: being called names [Re: LilacLouie]
Sans Logos Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/03
Posts: 5791
Loc: in my own world in pittsburgh,...
hey carl,

we are all brothers of the wound drawn here because of what we share in common: a very powerful experience that caused our lives to change immutably. and we rally here because we learn the we have the power to be the best agents of nurture for each other as we work to reclaim the ground that was lost in those experiences.

we don't care who is what in terms of sexual identity; that does not matter. debating that will not lead us to wholeness and integration but further disparity, that's why we encourage that those types of arguments be taken elsewhere.

regarding jail rape, i am very sorry that that could happen to you [ i even feel badly that your abuse led you into that situation in the first place ], but i don't believe there was anything 'gay' about these jail rapists, other than the fact that they performed male on male rape, which is a non consensual homosexual act, not a characteristic of a gender type. just as i know my brother who used me as a sex object was not 'gay', nor were the guys in the navy who manipulated me into secret hidey holes on the destroyer for their own sexual satisfaction, nor was the guy who shoved his 9 incher inside me while holding a knife at my throat.

it hurts us all when we get lumped in with rapists. we were the ones that got raped after all.

i was very happy the day came when malesurvivor created the female abuse forum, because it helped take the pressure off of gays specifically to let people know that men are not the only ones who abuse boys sexually. it helps to remove the stigma that 'gay = abuse' and gives us a better understanding of who our real enemy is.

ron

_________________________
  1. the past
  2. ReClaiming Now
  3. advocacy


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#313063 - 12/05/09 12:36 PM Re: being called names [Re: LilacLouie]
DJsport Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 1742
Originally Posted By: LilacLouie
I came to the Gay/Bi/Trans Survivors forum ONLY because a man here at MS, a man I thought was my friend, posted something that really bothered him.

Go be gay if you want, I don't care. Leave me out of it.


LilacLouis,

I know your referring to me. I still consider you my friend. I am sorry to hear you say "Leave me out of it" when your voicing your pain.

It appears the men who hurt you are still hurting you.

Guys, this thread is getting off tract. My original thought when I started thread was to voice my hurt feelings about what was said in the words which to me is being called a "name".

I understand being called a "name" has different meanings for everybody and I appreciate more after this thread.

BUT I see us (survivor brothers who had awful things done to us) take this frustration of being called names out on each other. It is defining and redefining our friendships.

We deserve to be treated with love and respect including from each other.

I don't want this be about my brothers throwing insults at each other and it has.

Peace,
DJ



Edited by DJsport (12/05/09 03:06 PM)
_________________________
Live to your fullest potential

Never make someone a priority if your only an option

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#313064 - 12/05/09 12:58 PM Re: being called names [Re: westchesterguy]
Geeders Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/03/08
Posts: 1901
Loc: Peterborough, Ontario, Canada
In an attempt to get back on track...

Originally Posted By: westchesterguy
Originally Posted By: DJsport
.... "faggot"....


Reading all the posts here makes me wonder if there is a man alive today in the U.S. who is under 50, who was NOT called a fag at some point in time. :-)


Jeff: Hate knows no boundaries. Political, social, it doesn't matter. Ignorance will spread like the flu, and infect the weakest links, embuing them with a sense of entitlement for some reason.

To answer your question, probably not. It can also be said to have been inflicted on those over 50, and outside the US as well. wink

Jim

_________________________
My name is Jim
WoR Mysthaven 2008, Level 2 WoR Alta 2009, Kirkridge 2010, 2011, Oprah 200 men

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#313072 - 12/05/09 01:44 PM Re: being called names [Re: DJsport]
myboyhoodfears Offline


Registered: 03/13/09
Posts: 457
i was just asking Ron some simple questions DJ, he did bring this point up...they were not directed at you,...only wanted to know if he thought self identity was a legitimate way to ascertain the sexual orientation of his perps or is he just making assumptions which perhaps would be quite reasonable for any of us to do under the circumstances, not an unreasonable thing to ask since he did mention that he thinks his perps were heterosexual, while others claim theirs to be homosexual....how does he know?....how do any of us know?..which gets to the root of why this topic is heated,....im not raging against anyone here....if someone has internal strife, then they probably need to work on that, but thats not going to stop me from asking reasonable questions, based on previous statements in the thread.....nor do i see how the questions i asked has anything to do with someones internal strife....there are no insults or even implied insults against anyone in anything that Ive posted in this thread, it is however unfortunate that other posters are inclined express their hostilities, perhaps some nerve has been stuck by this topic for some,.....but my previous post are just some simple questions,....try not to read into them more than there is...and lets move on...thanks bro...

_________________________
Post Nubilia Pheobus

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#313127 - 12/05/09 10:38 PM Re: being called names [Re: myboyhoodfears]
Emmett Offline


Registered: 12/05/09
Posts: 4
I just wanted to say that I agree. The name calling was the worst thing that could have happened to me, as a child and as an adult. I am a survivor of an adult assault. Throughout the assault I was called lots of names and ridiculed. It is those words that have stuck with me even though it was so long ago.


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#313186 - 12/06/09 01:20 PM Re: being called names [Re: Emmett]
AndyS87 Offline


Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 302
Loc: sorry, but I don't say on the ...
Saw this in passing and thought I'd comment. (Me? Comment? Come on really?) So ok. Name calling does a lot more damage than people think. And yes, it also does say a lot about the people who are insulting you. Self Projection maybe?

Anyways, with "fag" or any other synonymous word used as an affront to ones maleness or sexuality, it can certainly be used by people who are self projecting. I think the reasons kids use it on each other so much is A.) Insecurity and B.) They hear everyone else calling it. It's kind of like when "You're Mom is X" or "Hey I X'd your mom" is really really offensive at first, but then you realize everyone is using it and suddenly people start using it completely out of context to what the insult originally meant. I just think of the episode of South Park last month where they had them change the meaning of the word "fag" in the dictionary to be a derogatory term for obnoxious attention hungry Harley Davidson riders. That's kinda how kids are using it now. Instead of being an affront to sexuality or manhood, it's used in similar context as "You're Lame, You're a Retard, You Suck" etc.


HOWEVER. I do definitely see the point being made here, and I think that word hits home for people who are gay, males who have been abused sexually by other males, or the guys who are both gay and abuse victims.

I'm sure I've said it before, but I didn't really process any of the information from when I was molested. It just kinda happened, I felt like something wasn't right about it, but I didn't really care cause I was 9, and my cousin was like a friend in an otherwise friendless existence at the time. He was also like an older brother figure by a couple years, but that wasn't so much of a factor. Everything we did was mutually enjoyable, whether it was sega, hockey games, football, whatever. We were close, and when I found out what was going on with the sexual stuff at age 10 that word "fag" became a big time "uh oh" word. It was like people knew somehow and I was stuck into a reputation that I didn't feel was me. But like I said, I wasn't popular, and more people would use that word on me, and it became a very powerfully negative word. That strong negativity made me so anxious and afraid of anything gay that upon seeing stuff like gay newspapers or articles, and for a few years gay porn, I HAD to check it out to gauge a reaction. As I understand the way my mind works, I realize that as unorganized as I can be on the outside, inside my head I have a need to know where everything is, where it came from, why it's there, etc. Being like that has allowed me to work through a lot of issues fairly quickly, but it's a two edged sword. I'm not homosexual, but that word can trigger tremendous self doubt in who I am.


Think about it though. ALLLLLLL of that came from a word.


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#313191 - 12/06/09 01:42 PM Re: being called names [Re: AndyS87]
michael banks Offline


Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 1755
Loc: Mojave Desert, Ca
DJ,

To me verbal abuse was the most damaging aspect of my abuse.
because what others say about you as a child. You internalize it and it becomes the very core of who you are. And these negative messages take years to unlearn.
Hopefully one day we as a society will come to the point where we can just accept each other as we are. And not attack and hurt others just because of our differences. Because in the end is it not the differences the make us special and unique.

Mike

_________________________
To own one's shadow is the highest moral act of a human.
-Robert Johnson-

"IT ought never be forgotten that the past is the parent of the future" John C. Calhoun

WOR Alumni Sequoia 2009

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#313259 - 12/06/09 10:16 PM Re: being called names [Re: michael banks]
catfish86 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 10/27/09
Posts: 821
Loc: Ohio
I know name calling was common in my abuse. My abusing uncle called me little bastard and told me I was lucky he was taking an interest in me because most "little bastards" are not wanted by anyone. He told me I was born after the divorce and therefore I was a bastard. Turns out, I looked up the divorce papers and I was born two months before the divorce was granted. Surprisingly, he lied (OK, not really).

My brother called me a "little faggot" because I had concluded it was better to please our uncle than piss him off. If I pleased him, things might feel good or at least hurt less. If I pissed him off, pain or death was waiting. My abuser was succesful in pitting against each other.

Name calling is just one tool in the mental toolbox of the abuser.

_________________________
God grant me
The Serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The Courage to change the things I can,
And the Wisdom to know the difference.

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