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#304407 - 09/27/09 03:56 PM .
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 811
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:28 PM)

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#304413 - 09/27/09 04:34 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
DJsport Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 1742
Originally Posted By: lynchmob212001
I fear being called gay in society because I choose to be straight. I can't even stand gay people. Im not homophobe there just annoying.


As a happy gay man who is tired of others stating they "can't stand gay people" when they have their own fears about being gay I have to say "look at your own stuff and be respectful of others. And be respectful of yourself.

You have never met me or even tried so don't say I am annoying. Of course now that I am in your face so to speak you might say I am annoying you.

The mods here might say DJ your violating some rule, I say suspend me. I am needing to speak up here because I am gay and being treated with disrespect and not being given a chance.

I have respect for all on here and deserve the same. I understand you or at least can say I have experienced some of what your going through.

This may be just the push I need to move on. I know one of the main issues here is "did the abuse cause me to be gay and if so what do i do about it". I come here and try to get through those of you who are struggling to here statements like the above. "Oh tell me about being bi - but know I think gay people are annoying."

Peace,
DJ



Edited by DJsport (09/27/09 08:10 PM)
_________________________
Live to your fullest potential

Never make someone a priority if your only an option

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#304418 - 09/27/09 05:25 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: DJsport]
InsideTheWall Offline


Registered: 01/10/09
Posts: 285
I think both your posts are a bit disrespectful. Lynchmob, theres nothing wrong with SSA. Everyone has it at least sometimes, including myself. DJ, you shouldn't take what he said so personally. We're all human beings with human weakness and not out to hurt each other.


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#304488 - 09/28/09 09:44 AM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: InsideTheWall]
LilacLouie Offline


Registered: 07/02/09
Posts: 359
Loc: Utah
Lynchmob, I hear ya and I understand your concern. I have had the same concerns and feelings. I find it really sad and annoying that I can attract homosexuals far easier than I can attract girls.

DJ, what I find annoying and nauseating is how I can be in a bar in Wyoming, hit up on a woman, and she can slap the hell out of me for it. That's justified, if she tells me to back off and I don't. But, as I found out in Laramie Wyoming, if a homosexual hits up on me, I tell him to back off, and he doesn't, I cannot do anything about it. If I hit him, it's assault and I go to jail for assault and suspicion of a hate crime.

I'm not a homophobe, as I don't fear them one bit. But they better be Carl-phobe, because the next time a homosexual doesn't back off after being told to, they're gonna get hurt bad.

I was raped by a bi-sexual. I tried it, like normal kids do, when I was a kid. And I found it sick, disgusting and repulsive. If you like it DJ, I'm happy for you. But leave me out of it. I don't do the gay scene.

Lynch was polite in voicing his concern and opinion. I won't be. Don't like it? Wah.


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#304508 - 09/28/09 11:26 AM . [Re: LilacLouie]
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:29 PM)

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#304521 - 09/28/09 01:28 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
DJsport Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 1742
Hi, LilacLouie

I respect where you are coming from. If it a personal attack on you then it is wrong. I would do the exact same thing. To me it is about respect for the PERSON.

I was upset at the finger pointing about "gays" in general that I thought this post started out in rhetoric.

Now I understand more about the author and the notion it is about wording, so I will stay away from any further posts.

Again, I was upset at the wording for "all gays".

DJ

_________________________
Live to your fullest potential

Never make someone a priority if your only an option

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#304525 - 09/28/09 02:10 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: DJsport]
prisonerID Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/17/08
Posts: 1247
Loc: Oklahoma
LL,

Boundaries are boundaries no matter who is involved or what sexuality is discussed. No one should push themselves past the initial "no" you or anyone else gives. It can happen with gays and it can happen with straight and bi folks as well. I am gay and have had to put up with boundary pushing from females which is as bothersome to me as some find it coming from a man.

All orientations can be pushy and show lack of respect to others. I wish all would respect boundaries period.





Edited by prisonerID (09/28/09 02:23 PM)
_________________________
Broad statements often miss their true mark.

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#304538 - 09/28/09 04:23 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: prisonerID]
AndyS87 Offline


Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 302
Loc: sorry, but I don't say on the ...
To LL, yeah, I get annoyed when people don't get the hint. I think you kinda ran over DJ a little bit much though. I don't think he meant for you to feel cornered, he was just responding to Lynch's statement about all gay people being annoying as if they're all the same.

Lynch, I initially may have thought this many years ago, but I now know plenty of gay people, and they aren't all flamboyant and queeny. SOme are, some are still very much effeminate, but if UFC or Football or something else is on the TV, they don't run screaming looking for HGTV. They will eat wings and drink beer with you, and they won't try to get in your pants. Lastly in my experience are the gay guys who you would never even know are gay. You can't tell unless they tell you or you find out some other way through the grape vine. Just like any other group of people, they're stereotyped. Everybody is.


Anyways Lynch, what I wanted to say is that chances are, deep down if you do a lot of soul searching and you're honest, you know at the end of the day who you are and what you really want. If you're thoughts are starting off with "what if I'm gay/bisexual" or "how do I know if I'm gay/bisexual" and you don't know or have any obvious answer, chances are you're not. Ruminating will lock you into a habituated thought pattern, and you'll fixate and micro-analyze everything to DEATH until you have an answer, and if you do all that, chances are you'll question your answer and keep on repeating. Chances are you probably know, you just have to really think about it.


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#304579 - 09/28/09 10:04 PM . [Re: AndyS87]
bardo213 Offline
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:29 PM)

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#304587 - 09/28/09 11:02 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
AndyS87 Offline


Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 302
Loc: sorry, but I don't say on the ...
Makes perfect sense Lynch. Not sure if I asked you about this before, but have you ever heard of HOCD? I've posted at a forum that adresses that kind of stuff, and although most of it is usually just people freaking out, occasionally somebody who has some sense posts there.

If there's enough anxiety surrounding this for you, then rumination will drive you nuts. I did that for a long time. There's also a "I wonder if I'm bisexual" part of things that seems to get people as well. Usually they "accept" this fact, and then notice that just from facing up to the fear the entire line of thought disappears along with the supposed "attraction". Since OCD is an anxiety disorder, if something makes you particularly anxious surrounding your sexual orientation, it's possible that when triggered this is the way you would respond. I saw a therapist about this, and she noted that while I didn't specifically have OCD/HOCD I most definitely had general anxiety disorder, and enlightened me into realizing that with anxiety disorders it's not so much what they're called as it is the symptoms.

If that doesn't sound like your thing, but acknowledging your bisexual makes you straighter, I gotta say I can't really say you're bisexual. Especially if you don't want to be with other men. What you call leftovers from the abuse, if that's how you phrase em, are likely just that. Leftovers from the abuse. Nothing more, nothing less. If you can find a good therapist who can help you take away the pain and the trauma of those leftovers and the incidents that caused them, I think you'll likely start feeling a whole lot better. Just my 2 cents though.

As far as your girlfriend goes I don't know what to tell you. I'm only just getting ready to get out and start dating, because of all the social anxiety I've never really dealt with until now, as an after effect of a lot of this stuff.


Good luck figuring it all out though dude.


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#304608 - 09/29/09 02:48 AM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: AndyS87]
Mike1968 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/14/09
Posts: 117
Loc: California
.



Edited by Mike1968 (11/03/09 11:29 PM)
Edit Reason: deleted as a courtesy to lynchmob who is deleting his own posts

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#304626 - 09/29/09 01:29 PM . [Re: Mike1968]
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:29 PM)

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#304635 - 09/29/09 02:47 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
Sans Logos Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/03
Posts: 5791
Loc: in my own world in pittsburgh,...
Quote:
that makes me feel a lot better knowing that somebody actually has the respect for me


lynchmob, now that you know the good feeling of being envaluated in such a manner, it is hoped that you will begin to use this same approach in respecting others and restrain yourself from bad mouthing the g/b/t constituency here in future postings.

it goes without saying that it be would highly appreciated if all persons using this site for recovery would follow the golden rule: do unto others as you would have them do unto you. [including me!]

thanks for your consideration,

ron

_________________________
  1. the past
  2. ReClaiming Now
  3. advocacy


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#304640 - 09/29/09 03:07 PM . [Re: Sans Logos]
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:29 PM)

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#304641 - 09/29/09 03:15 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
Sans Logos Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/03
Posts: 5791
Loc: in my own world in pittsburgh,...
i think it's natural mechanism when trying to manage painful thoughts, to try to build ourselves up by putting others down.

i know i did that for many years with my family. i constantly criticized them because they were emotionally incapacitated, and just dealt with their pain by dismissing it. since i could not get the resolution i needed, i obsessive compulsively picked at it like a scab and kept the wound alive. [just realized this yesterday, and no longer have a need to be accusatory toward them any longer, so i've let go that obsession].

unfortunately, until i came to the understanding and forgiveness, i had no other choice but to keep repeating my bemoaning them.

i guess the point i want to stress is that we never get larger by trying to make others smaller. we just shrink, too.

live and learn, eh?

all the best,

ron

_________________________
  1. the past
  2. ReClaiming Now
  3. advocacy


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#304673 - 09/29/09 06:43 PM . [Re: Sans Logos]
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:30 PM)

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#304700 - 09/30/09 01:13 AM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
AndyS87 Offline


Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 302
Loc: sorry, but I don't say on the ...
Yeah, I went through the persistent teasing and bullying bit through most of elementary, middle, and high school, but it damaged me by far the worst in elementary and middle school. If you talk to people about teasing like that, you find it's fairly common factor in any kind of obsessive sexual thought pattern.

Also, don't be so quick to automatically say you have OCD. OCD tends to jump around to lots of different things, whereas this particular problem is likely a reaction to all the anxiety you feel surrounding this issue. There are many different anxiety disorders, and many of them have similar symptoms. Obsessive/intrusive thoughts are among those symptoms. But until you get in to see a shrink and get evaluated, don't be too quick to self diagnose. I do certainly see some parallels between you and me though, difference being a lot of what's happening to you now as an adult in a professionals world happened to me as a kid in school. I think if that happened to me now I'd be a whole hell of a lot more pissed off, so I understand how angry you are at the situation.


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#304825 - 10/01/09 01:52 AM . [Re: AndyS87]
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:30 PM)

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#304828 - 10/01/09 03:47 AM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
Mike1968 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/14/09
Posts: 117
Loc: California
.



Edited by Mike1968 (11/03/09 11:27 PM)
Edit Reason: deleted as a courtesy to lynchmob who is deleting his own posts

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#304829 - 10/01/09 03:53 AM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: Sans Logos]
Mike1968 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/14/09
Posts: 117
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: Sans Logos
i think it's natural mechanism when trying to manage painful thoughts, to try to build ourselves up by putting others down.

i know i did that for many years with my family. i constantly criticized them because they were emotionally incapacitated, and just dealt with their pain by dismissing it. since i could not get the resolution i needed, i obsessive compulsively picked at it like a scab and kept the wound alive. [just realized this yesterday, and no longer have a need to be accusatory toward them any longer, so i've let go that obsession].

unfortunately, until i came to the understanding and forgiveness, i had no other choice but to keep repeating my bemoaning them.

i guess the point i want to stress is that we never get larger by trying to make others smaller. we just shrink, too.

live and learn, eh?

all the best,

ron


Good thinking, wise words


Mike


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#304862 - 10/01/09 01:04 PM . [Re: Mike1968]
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:30 PM)

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#304874 - 10/01/09 04:21 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
DJsport Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 1742
Hi, Lynchmob.

First of all, I wanted to say I learned to NOT be triggered by anothers perceptions.

I was once married so I am bisexual by history and have two kids to prove it. On the Kinsey scale, I am a 5.5 on the gay end of the spectrum.

I have lived with the "other thinking" I think you are referring to.

It sounds like your dealing with a lot of messages. Your not alone and I sympathize with you.

Peace,
DJ

_________________________
Live to your fullest potential

Never make someone a priority if your only an option

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#304907 - 10/01/09 08:49 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
Mike1968 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 09/14/09
Posts: 117
Loc: California
[quote=lynchmob212001]
.

Hope you get your computer security issue cleared up soon


mike



Edited by Mike1968 (11/03/09 11:25 PM)
Edit Reason: courtesy to lynchmob who is deleting his posts

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#305007 - 10/03/09 12:24 AM . [Re: Mike1968]
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 811
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:30 PM)

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#305009 - 10/03/09 12:44 AM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
AndyS87 Offline


Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 302
Loc: sorry, but I don't say on the ...
yeah, again don't be too ready to jump on that HOCD thing, just remember, it's a symptom or symptoms of what seems to be an already pre-existing anxiety disorder. To tell you the truth, I've made more progress having therapy for the abuse than I have for OCD type stuff. Tried going on lexapro and that was a miserable failure. Xanax did work well though, but because of it's extremely addictive capability I try to almost never take it.


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#305157 - 10/04/09 12:48 PM . [Re: AndyS87]
bardo213 Offline
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:31 PM)

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#305337 - 10/05/09 11:56 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: InsideTheWall]
jls Offline


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 1142
As someone who is as supportive as can be of gays and lesbians I can have compassion for those who are homophobic since a phobia is just that, a fear, no different than a fear of hieghts for example. I don't view homophobia any differently and when I meet people with such a fear I do my best to help them come around to understanding that such a fear is irrational so that they can become more comfortable with themselves. However, that said there is a difference between fear and hate, and I've no time for be people who make hateful statements or engage in hateful acts. Just my thoughts. JS

_________________________
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world.


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#305498 - 10/07/09 11:15 AM . [Re: jls]
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:31 PM)

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#305531 - 10/07/09 06:27 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: DJsport]
LilacLouie Offline


Registered: 07/02/09
Posts: 359
Loc: Utah
Originally Posted By: DJsport
Hi, LilacLouie

I respect where you are coming from. If it a personal attack on you then it is wrong. I would do the exact same thing. To me it is about respect for the PERSON.

I was upset at the finger pointing about "gays" in general that I thought this post started out in rhetoric.

Now I understand more about the author and the notion it is about wording, so I will stay away from any further posts.

Again, I was upset at the wording for "all gays".

DJ

DJ, don't worry about it. Mistakes happen. I don't hate you in the least, even if you are gay.

My opinion is, "Be gay, if that's your way." So long as others understand it isn't mine. FORCE it on me, different story. Last guy that tried forcing it on me nearly lost his life.


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#305585 - 10/08/09 12:32 AM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
jls Offline


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 1142
I am reluctant to label people so I am not calling you homophobic. However, I will say that we live in a society that does not understand or easily accept differences in sexual orientation I will venture to say that our world is homophobic and that affects us all. Even myself, as progressive as I try to be, with a family history that includes a lesbian mother I will acknowledge moments of homophobia on my part thruout my life. However, like I said in my post, when I find myself feeling this way I try and have compassion for myself and understand that it is an irrational fear and nothing more. You say that homophobia involves violence or bias. Bias in some cases maybe but I disagree that all homophobia is hateful. I have met many people who are homophobic who take a live and let live approach, as in they don't understand or feel comfortable around gay or lesbian people but still support their right to existence and happiness, nor do they make an effort to get in the way of this. JS.

_________________________
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world.


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#305600 - 10/08/09 05:30 AM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: jls]
LilacLouie Offline


Registered: 07/02/09
Posts: 359
Loc: Utah
Remember though, just because they oppose it or disagree with it does not mean they are homophobes.


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#305619 - 10/08/09 12:11 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: LilacLouie]
myboyhoodfears Offline


Registered: 03/13/09
Posts: 457
thats right louie

phobias are irrational fears which do not equate to moral or intellectual objections which actually are rational...though we may disagree with these various objections its not helpful to try to pathologize everyone who has a world view that does jive with our own...because that ultimately makes us all phobic then....which of course is rediculous....i suggest if someone objects to your particular world view, that you should present a "rational" argument as to why they maybe wrong....instead of labeling them "phobic" which requires a legitimate diagnosis from a mental health professional...otherwise its just childish name calling.

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#305624 - 10/08/09 01:11 PM . [Re: myboyhoodfears]
bardo213 Offline
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:31 PM)

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#305633 - 10/08/09 02:35 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
myboyhoodfears Offline


Registered: 03/13/09
Posts: 457

you certainly have a complicated situation on your hands, i think its a great idea to edit and simplify our lives when they get to complex to handle...moving away either with or without the g/f is probably not such a bad idea...imho.

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#305788 - 10/09/09 04:11 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: LilacLouie]
DJsport Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 1742
Originally Posted By: LilacLouie

DJ, don't worry about it. Mistakes happen. I don't hate you in the least, even if you are gay.

My opinion is, "Be gay, if that's your way." So long as others understand it isn't mine. FORCE it on me, different story. Last guy that tried forcing it on me nearly lost his life.



What mistake? What do you mean .... even if I was gay!

I do not apologize to anyone for my standing up for myself if they are making a generalization when I am around especially when the generalization includes me.

The words "lost his life" are very disconcerning.





Edited by DJsport (10/09/09 04:58 PM)
_________________________
Live to your fullest potential

Never make someone a priority if your only an option

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#305872 - 10/10/09 01:59 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: DJsport]
Daniel_forgotten Offline


Registered: 02/07/09
Posts: 479
i dont understand anything anymore.

you can do 'gay stuff' but not being gay at all? is that possible or am i mistaken? or you do and you don't know why, and then you feel grossed out about it. I don't think that's being gay bcause if you are gay you're supposed to like it, right? or you just feel confused about it and give the wrong sings and the whole thing ends up wrong, and then what?

idk it's all so confusing


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#305938 - 10/11/09 12:10 AM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: Daniel_forgotten]
Freedom49 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/30/07
Posts: 2723
Loc: Washington State
Sexuality can be very confusing. Yes you can do "gay" things and not be gay. It may mean nothing more than you like that particular sensation given by that particular act that particular time with that particular person in that particular place and situation. Which you may or may not find yourself in again. Or it may mean you are confused and conflicted about that whole issue at that time in your life.

Then again you may be gay in orientation and not comfortable with it yet and in denial but still enjoy the romp.

There are as many possibilities as there are personalities the spectrum is quite broad. It also may change quite a bit with time. Probably best to consider this issue ONLY as it relates to you and your situation. It can give you a headache.


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#305987 - 10/11/09 11:29 AM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: Freedom49]
myboyhoodfears Offline


Registered: 03/13/09
Posts: 457
yeah i agree....if you can engage in heterosexual behavior and still be gay...then you can engage in homosexual behavior and still be str8...behavior is not always consistent with ones actual sexual attractions, though we might like to think it is,...

but it ends up there are far to many people who choose to do things outside their attractions, for many different reasons,...some are driven to by these childhood experiences, others have more deliberate reasons....

here are a few reasons Ive heard why some str8 men (who Ive personally known) intentionally have sex with other men.....drugs, money, attention, lack of an easy female partner,..death of a female partner, feeling sexually inadequate with females, and because its taboo,...

over the years Ive heard all these reasons....some might be excuses, some not....but who am i to judge....i accept them at their face value...just like i would accept the reasons why many homosexuals manage to get married have kids and stay in their heterosexual relationships.



Edited by myboyhoodfears (10/11/09 11:35 AM)
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#305993 - 10/11/09 12:39 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: myboyhoodfears]
prisonerID Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/17/08
Posts: 1247
Loc: Oklahoma
Not judging is one of the greatest gifts one person can give another. It is one I would rather have than most anything else anyone might think that I need.

Gay, straight, bi, curious or whatever. The common denominator is we are here to heal. I would say the second is maybe to help a few others do the same along the way? The third? Perhaps to laugh here and there along the way.

Those are my three...anybody got any others?



Edited by prisonerID (10/11/09 12:48 PM)
_________________________
Broad statements often miss their true mark.

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#306023 - 10/11/09 06:07 PM . [Re: prisonerID]
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 811
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:31 PM)

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#306029 - 10/11/09 07:21 PM Re: Question out to those who are bi? [Re: bardo213]
prisonerID Offline
Greeter Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/17/08
Posts: 1247
Loc: Oklahoma
Lynch,

Just saying that all people here deserve the same consideration, respect and understanding. Not referring to predators by any means. I am trying with this thread to see what is perhaps behind statements and not take them personally. I would hope the same would be done for me.

I also do not think therapy or talking has anything to do with whether someone is gay or stays gay. That is like saying someone is not far enough in recovery if still gay. It helps to sort out whether a person is or not I believe. It helps them to discover that for themself. Sexual abuse screws up the mind. So therapy and talking to others helps get it out in the open for a person. The therapy can help a person decide if they are gay or just have SSA or simply conflicted from same sex abuse.

If you are not gay - you are not gay. Just like I am not straight. I cannot see myself that way. No way in hell. wink

I wish you well.



Edited by prisonerID (10/11/09 07:33 PM)
_________________________
Broad statements often miss their true mark.

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#306131 - 10/12/09 02:07 PM . [Re: prisonerID]
bardo213 Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
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Edited by bardo213 (06/21/13 09:32 PM)

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