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#282945 - 04/09/09 04:15 PM Physical problems *triggers?*
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
I'm not sure what does and doesn't trigger folks so I thought I would err on the side of caution.

The only reason I have joined this forum and am even reviewing/thinking about all this crap is that my body seems to be forcing me to.

When I was about 11, my Dad outdid even himself and, in a rage, stomped my ribs and collarbone until they were broken and threw me across the dining room table. I went in and out of consciousness and the only thing that got me off that table was the fear that my little sis would come home and find me that way. I made myself get off, clean up the mess and get in bed. My collar bone and ribs were broken. My Mom told the school that I had pneumonia and wouldn't be in for awhile. This is the first memory I have that forces me to realize that my mother knew frown

OK, enough about that, I'm over that rotten memory. However, I'm 44 and my collarbone is on completely backwards and that side of my rib cage is crooked. The older I get, the more trouble it gives me. The Doc says that this will continue because, since I am asymetrical, the muscles etc. always have to compensate. Its pretty painful.

The worst part, and this is tough to admit even here, is that my dad penetrated me with objects - big ones, sharp ones, heated ones. He made me choose which one so he could tell me that it was I that wanted it etc. etc. He once forced a rolling pin by kicking it and I remember hearing something crack. I passed out.

As a kid, I would have black stuff (old blood?) come out of me all the time. My dad explained that Satan lived in me and that it was his sh__. Charming, I know.

As I'm getting older, it is getting increasingly painful - excuciating really, to go to the bathroom and sometimes takes me an hour. I had to discuss this with my doc and he wants me to be scoped ( no way ) and says that I may need surgery to re-route (no way). In the meantime, I take laxatives or the pain is unbearable.

Now, the two issues are ganging up on me. Because of the asymetry, I guess, I have a bulging disk in my lower back. This happened in the gym. I work hard to stay in shape and lift weights 3-4 times per week. I guess I overdid it. Anyway, I found out that I rely on my lower back to brace for the pain in the bathroom and now I can't and the result is agonizing.


Does anyone else have the latter problem? It is so painfully familiar. It has also caused the nightmares to return. I had vivid flashback nightmares in my mid 20's but they disappeared completely the day my Dad died, 11 years ago. A few weeks back, I had the first nightmare since that time and now they occur almost nightly.

Sorry - whiney note. I'm just desperate for some answers.

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#282946 - 04/09/09 04:19 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
The other thing that makes me crazy here is getting my back adjuted by the chiropractor. He leans over me and presses down to adjust my back. My logic tells me that this is fine but my mind panics. I had to sit in my car for a long time after the appointment to stop shaking.

I hate to sound like a weanie and I'm not really, in real life. I want to take this stuff on, head-on and get over it. I don't have the time and the patience. I need to be husband, Dad, father, boss, friend, brother..

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#282947 - 04/09/09 04:22 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
Wow, how many times can I whine in one thread. It's like I opened the flood gates.

The only reason that I've been able to get sleep in the last couple of years is due to my per>
_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#282952 - 04/09/09 04:37 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
joelRT Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor


Registered: 09/11/08
Posts: 1357
Loc: Québec, Canada
cjb,

Let me blunt here - you are not whiney and you most ceratinly are not a weenie!!! You are, however, a victim of horrible child and sexual abuse - you are not yet a survivor though.

Survivors of CSA are men who are taking ALL the necessary mesures to get well and to recover from their past of abuse. You are refusing to do that. You doctor wants to perform necessary procedures to correct serious physical problems directly relating to your abuse and you say NO. What you are in fact saying is that you prefer to remain a victim!

Have you gotten yourself a therapist yet, or are planing "to get over it" by yourself?? My friend, I and and a whole slew of other survivors will tell you that that can't be done. Many have tried to go it alone and ALL have failed. You need to be working with a therapsit who is specialized in male CSA issues. That's what a good father and loving husband would do........

OK, I've ragged on ya enough, but just let say this to you in closing: The only way to get over it is to go through it so as to come out on the other side of it. Any other path always leads to a dead end.

_________________________
My Story 1
My Story 2
The longest journey we take is to self-discovery

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#282964 - 04/09/09 05:51 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: joelRT]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
I appreciate the directness but I don't completely agree.

I am not a victim and have always refused to be. I am choosing not to have surgery because I simply do not want to.

I am a good husband and father. Period. There's no way that you could know differently.

I went to a therapist and it was useless. I did, however, spend two years reviewing every memory that I could think of with a great Pastor that I really trusted. We prayed after each and I never had that same nightmare again. I have been doing pretty well until the physical things came back up.

I do get your points but I think they were a bit hastey. One size does not fit all. Wow, get the irony in that last statement ;-)

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#282998 - 04/09/09 09:12 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
michael banks Offline


Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 1755
Loc: Mojave Desert, Ca
cjb,

For someone who seems to be so focus on being a good father, husband, friend etc. How can you be these things if you do not address the problems both physically and emotionally that are taking there toll on your life.
Why the denial of the abuse that both your father and mother(neglect) inflicted on you. When will you make them responsible for what they did to you as a child. When are you going to stop protecting your mother and father. And begin to protect yourself and your family.
Reality bites sometimes but there comes a time to face it head on.
Whether we like or not.

Mike


_________________________
To own one's shadow is the highest moral act of a human.
-Robert Johnson-

"IT ought never be forgotten that the past is the parent of the future" John C. Calhoun

WOR Alumni Sequoia 2009

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#283042 - 04/10/09 02:46 AM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: michael banks]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
I couldn't be more confused. Why do you think I'm not dealing with it? I'm here aren't I? I have to deal with in exactly the same way everyone else did to be in the "survivor club"?

Maybe I'm just miscommunicating. I am not protecting my Dad. He's burning in hell right now and I'm pretty ok with that. My mom made her mistakes but her life was tough too.

This feels more like judgement than compassion. Does it make you guys feel better about yourselves to quickly point out how poorly I'm dealing with it?

Confused.

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#283043 - 04/10/09 02:49 AM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
I will say that I really resent the inference that I'm not, in fact, a good father and that I don't protect my children.

That's not true. If you knew me, you would have no idea that I've suffered anything. My kids are loved and so is my wife. Yes, I deal with some horrible memories but I am very good at being fully functional otherwise.

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#283045 - 04/10/09 02:51 AM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: michael banks]
Dusty Boy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 280
Loc: Australia
My Adult children tell me I was a good Father and yet I know when I was in pain I could not give them the best or even the ok of me.
I agree with Joel and Mike and the DR. You describe Horrible abuse and know that there must have been damage done, and the result - left untreated could even shorten your life. If that happened who would then be a good father to your children?
I reply out of concern from another survivor not to attack you.
Dusty


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#283051 - 04/10/09 06:19 AM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: Dusty Boy]
joelRT Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor


Registered: 09/11/08
Posts: 1357
Loc: Québec, Canada
cjb,

No one here is attacking you or is inferring anything even remotely close to you're not being a loving father and husband.

It's unfortunate that you've chosen to misinterpret our concern for your wellbeing, and that of your familly, as anything less than compassion and understanding for the pain that you all find yourselves in.

For any distress that I have caused you, I genuinely apologize.

You know something, cjb? It is very difficult to have to tell a guy the things he needs to hear and it is soooo much easier to tell him what he wants to hear. Unfortunately, doing so often only serves to deepen the illusions that a guy is adamantly maintaining himself in.

Those of us who've been at recovery for twenty plus years already, can easily recognize that you are still in the early stages of phase 1 recovery and make no mistake, my friend, we all thought, just like you, that we had a good handle on things and none of us wanted to hear anything different either when we found ourselves where you are now.

MaleSurvivor is a support site for sufferers of male CSA. That support takes on many and varied forms - compassion, understanding, the offer proven information, silence too sometimes, when a guy just needs to rant and to vent. And then again, sometimes the kindest support you can offer a guy is to rattle his cage in the hopes that you can get him to see that while his intentions are certainly honorable, he is misdirected and headed down the long road to nowhere.

None of us wants to see a fellow survivor go that way and we each of us feels the responsability to try, through our own experience, to guide that survivor on the sure and safest path.

I sincerely wish you well on your journey to recovery, irregardless of the path that you may decide on and please be assured that we will still be here for you whenever you may choose.

_________________________
My Story 1
My Story 2
The longest journey we take is to self-discovery

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#283104 - 04/10/09 03:48 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: joelRT]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
I guess this approach is just not for me.

I get the good intentions and thanks for the same. Joining this site is my way of trying to figure this all out cautiously and I probably just threw out too much transparency too soon.

I'm sorry if I sounded defensive - that wasn't my intention. I just have to do this my own way and at my own speed and I feel like I'm much further along than others have represented here.

Yeah, it was extreme and the above doesn't begin to describe it. At the same time, it was a long time ago and I don't want to throw a pity part. I'm blessed and I don't want to be ungrateful for those blessings. These things have come back to haunt me due to the physical issues.

My real question here was whether others have experienced the ano-rectal mutilation problem, what were their symptoms and how was it addressed?

Has anyone been able to heal this sans surgery?

If these questions are avoidance, I'm not sure how to avoid avoidance. ;-)

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#283111 - 04/10/09 04:10 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
king tut Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/13/08
Posts: 2466
Loc: UK
hi cjb,

To your original question.

If you do have problems with your behind it will not just go away. Some time you will have to get it fixed. So you have to come to a point and ask yourself, do you want to do it now whilst your young, or wait until you are old when there will be additional complications? I'm sure that other people have had to deal with this problem through surgery before.

I did find a good website on this once, on what the inital examinations involve and if you are a survivor of sexual abuse, i can't find that website now, maybe you could look around the internet, i dont remember what it was called

I found this but it talks about children going to the doctor and is specific for the DSAC
DSAC

i will look some more

_________________________
"...until lambs become lions"

I love you, little lewis, and i will never leave you. We are the same. You brighten my day, and i will make sure that i brighten yours. Hugs and kisses.


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#283114 - 04/10/09 04:20 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: king tut]
king tut Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/13/08
Posts: 2466
Loc: UK
This may be useful

Fears of medical examinations

Ken Singer also has an insert in that thread from his book that may be useful for you

_________________________
"...until lambs become lions"

I love you, little lewis, and i will never leave you. We are the same. You brighten my day, and i will make sure that i brighten yours. Hugs and kisses.


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#283115 - 04/10/09 04:22 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: king tut]
Anarion Cti Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 157
Loc: Eastern US
Dear cjb,
I too was violently assaulted, and I too have back and disc problems. Nothing as severe as what you are suffering from, but perhaps enough to help me to understand and to sympathize with the agony that you are going through. I will be praying for you, my brother.
In Christ,
Anarion

_________________________
"Thou, O Lord, are the shield about me;
You're my helper,
You're the one who lifts up my head."
"Whom have I in heaven or earth but You?"

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#283182 - 04/10/09 09:55 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: Anarion Cti]
michael banks Offline


Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 1755
Loc: Mojave Desert, Ca
cjb,

You have some serious medical problems you got to deal with from the physical abuse inflicted on you as a child by your father. But you come across as if what happened to you was no big deal or that you deserved to be treated that way. Are you not in fact conitueing this cycle of abuse and neglect that your parents taught you as a child. To truely recover we have to address the denial we learned in order to survive our abuse as children. To see how those who should have loved and protected really behaved toward us.
I am not attacking you personally thu it may feel that way. But only responding to what you are telling us in your posts. How you use my responses to you are entirely up to you. If you would really not like me to respond to your post as honertly as I can. Just say so and I will reframe from doing so.

Wishing the best

Mike

_________________________
To own one's shadow is the highest moral act of a human.
-Robert Johnson-

"IT ought never be forgotten that the past is the parent of the future" John C. Calhoun

WOR Alumni Sequoia 2009

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#283197 - 04/10/09 10:58 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: michael banks]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
It just feels like we're speaking a different language here. It's probably me.

Continuing the cycle? Wouldn't that mean abusing my children? I have been a father for nearly 20 years and have never raised a hand in anger or lust to my children even once. No. I have stopped the cycle with God's help and some healthy counseling.

What is it that makes you people feel that I'm failing so miserably in this?

I did some VERY hard work in my late 20's to talk through every memory that I could think of every Thursday night for two years. How is that not dealing with it?

I am looking for alternatives to surgery - that is all. If I am told that I have to crap out my side or die, that's a different story. I don't think that its come to that.

No big deal? Are you kidding me? I've spent my entire life in pain over the crap that happened to me. I just don't want to "wear it" every day.

What am I not facing? I sincerely don't get it.

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#283198 - 04/10/09 11:00 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
Yes, in all transparency, there are times that I feel like damaged material. I know that I didn't deserve it but it can feel like it defines me. I doubt that's unusual and maybe you'll all be happier that I admitted that?

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#283199 - 04/10/09 11:01 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
Maybe its just me but I've had two responses here and in the chatroom:

- judged
- hit on

Safe haven? I haven't seen it yet. I'm not trying to be critical. I'm being open and honest. Healthy of me, right?

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#283200 - 04/10/09 11:06 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
michael banks Offline


Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 1755
Loc: Mojave Desert, Ca
Cjb,

As survivors we have a tendency to conitue to treat ourselves as we were taught by those whom abused us. Conitueing the cycle of our abuse.

Mike

_________________________
To own one's shadow is the highest moral act of a human.
-Robert Johnson-

"IT ought never be forgotten that the past is the parent of the future" John C. Calhoun

WOR Alumni Sequoia 2009

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#283205 - 04/10/09 11:19 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: michael banks]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
I understand Mike but I haven't punched myself, broken my ribs or shoved anything unseemly up where the sun don't shine ever.

I know what you're saying but I don't get the inference that I'm not dealing with it. Maybe I'm very blind. Maybe that's easier?

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#283206 - 04/10/09 11:23 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
michael banks Offline


Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 1755
Loc: Mojave Desert, Ca
Sorry Will reframe from furhter response.

If someone hit on you. report it to the mods

Mike

_________________________
To own one's shadow is the highest moral act of a human.
-Robert Johnson-

"IT ought never be forgotten that the past is the parent of the future" John C. Calhoun

WOR Alumni Sequoia 2009

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#283222 - 04/11/09 02:20 AM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: michael banks]
michael banks Offline


Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 1755
Loc: Mojave Desert, Ca
Cliff,

All's well that ends well.
Really enjoyed talking to you tonight.

Mike

_________________________
To own one's shadow is the highest moral act of a human.
-Robert Johnson-

"IT ought never be forgotten that the past is the parent of the future" John C. Calhoun

WOR Alumni Sequoia 2009

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#283223 - 04/11/09 02:29 AM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: michael banks]
Freedom49 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 12/30/07
Posts: 2723
Loc: Washington State
Cjb,
The symptoms you are descirbing are serious but can be treated and inprove the quality of your life considerably. I would suggest a consultation with the appropriate surgeon and anestheiologist. As best you can make known your concerns and fears regarding these procedures. There are things they can do to eliminate the effects you are fearing and allow proper treatment of your conditions. If you feel you cannot properly communicate in person verbally then copy your post and give it to them. Trust me they are very compassionate regarding these things normally and will go to extremes to make this as painless for you as possible, literally and figuratively. I work with some of these guys and I can attest to that.

My abuse was no where near as horrific as yours. I am very sad that this has happened to such a nice guy, husband and father. Please think about this. You deserve it and your kids and wife will be glad their dad and husband is not suffering any longer physically because of the abuse.

Take care



Edited by Freedom49 (04/11/09 02:30 AM)

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#283229 - 04/11/09 07:14 AM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: Freedom49]
frozen Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/26/07
Posts: 22
Loc: Europe
Hi,Cjb
I was too reaped several times violently, during my long abuse.My first abuser treated me like specimen,I also had bottle inside,My second abuser was just cruell and mean he got kicks when he hurt.
I have had leaking problem since 15(26 years now).I tried to ingnore it,change clothes etc.But it is bit difficult to ignore if you have pants full of crap and you smell.
My kids made joke of me: Whats smelling? Is it little bro ?No,its you dad!
I started wearing diaper,it helps a lot controlling leaks.
My wife and my shrink convinced me to go to doctor,so I went.
I was send to University hospital .All docks were professionalls,they made me differend kinds of tests ,some were not very nice,but not as bad you would think.After all they treated me very well,like human.
I was diagnosed:bowell incontinent.I got new pills to control my bowells(have helped a bit) and I am still wearing diaper.
In my case,there is no better treatment.
Bigger problem is .when I change diaper I remember him who caused everything.
I hope you got some answers.
Take care!


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#283336 - 04/12/09 01:58 AM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: frozen]
cjb Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 19
Loc: Oregon, USA
I'm sorry, Frozen. That sounds awful. Fortunately, I don't have that problem, just alot of pain.

I'll work it out.

_________________________
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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#283405 - 04/12/09 05:21 PM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: joelRT]
Raybie Offline


Registered: 04/12/09
Posts: 1
Loc: London, Ohio USA
Hi. This is my first post here so I may be out of line but this is in reply to JoeIRT. He said "Many have tried to go it alone and ALL have failed. You need to be working with a therapsit who is specialized in male CSA issues." I am 54 years old and have been a survivor of CSA without the help of a specialized therapist. That has never been available to me (until maybe now). I have been in therapy groups but mostly for major depression and isolation. I do have flashbacks and nightmares but due to the nature of my abuse I cannot talk to anybody about it. I've been accused of lying or making it all up too many times. My CSA was at the hands of several sick groups of people, not individuals or family members.

I think I will stop here and let others voice their thoughts. Thanks, Raybie

_________________________
As for me and mine, We will follow the Lord.

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#283465 - 04/13/09 01:49 AM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: Raybie]
Trucker51 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/20/08
Posts: 2826
Loc: Denver, CO
Hey Ray:

Welcome to our support site. Gald that you found us. I think that you will find us to be a caring and understanding bunch of guys who are all here together trying to find our freedom.

Howard Freidken is in Columbus, I believe, and he is a highly experienced therapist in this field. My 1st attempt at therapy was at Cleveland State University back in the Fall of 1986.

Recovery can be a long road alone, but together with people who understand your path gets a little easier. Hope to see you up on the survivor forum soon. That is where most of the action is.

Recovery is possible. Have hope,

Mark

_________________________
"We stay here, we die here. We've got to keep moving". Trucker Mark



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#283485 - 04/13/09 09:30 AM Re: Physical problems *triggers?* [Re: cjb]
ModTeam Offline
Moderator
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 691
Good day fellows,

Quote:
I've had two responses here and in the chatroom:

- judged
- hit on


If this type of thing occurs please note that it is considered a serious infraction of the rules and guidelines for site usage and as such must be reported immediately. We are able to check into reports such as these, but unless someone actually registers a claim it is difficult to monitor such offenses as they occur.

Please do not hesitate to notify us of suspected or confirmed predatory behavior.

When you hear of such things, please let us know. We need your help in keeping this site safe and focused on recovery, and we appreciate your joining us in this work.

Appreciatively,

The ModTeam

_________________________
Private messages sent to this account are checked irregularly due to personnel and time constraints. Please send messages to one of the moderators for the forum that is concerned by user name, or if there is no named moderator, send a PM to any moderator.

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