Newest Members
jahfree, Daryl X., tryintothrive, BCtejas, JHNebraska
12494 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
mrwhiskers (25), SouthernLaw (41), TerryT (61)
Who's Online
3 registered (myrlin, woodenshoes, 1 invisible), 20 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
12494 Members
74 Forums
64159 Topics
447740 Posts

Max Online: 418 @ 07/02/12 07:29 AM
Twitter
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
#277868 - 03/01/09 10:15 PM Before recovery: Men treating their women badly
rainbow Offline


Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 28
Hello everyone,

I'm reticent to post because I fully understand people's sensitivities around women trying to push men into recovery. I truly don't want to do that.

My man is both devoted to me and puts me through hell. He tells me he has never loved someone this much. We broke up a few months ago and he cried for the second time in his life since he was 14 years old. We have broken up yet again because it is becoming impossible for me to set healthy boundaries with him.

I have a question for those men who acted out (as in treated their women badly) before they were ready to deal with recovery. Is there anything I can say or do for my boyfriend so he at least realizes that his bad behavior is destructing our relationship? I don't want to make him face up to anything, I fully understand he has to be ready for that, I just want him to take responsibility for his unfair treatment of me but he won't. He just blames me all the time. He admits he doesn't trust me and on some level he understands that is unreasonable.

I don't want to sound like a martyr. He's a good man. We love each other immensely. I know he is damaged and he struggles with trust and love issues. I just don't know how to break through his wall of blaming me. So I just wondered, in the men's experiences here, did your wives or girlfriends manage to do or say something that finally broke through your denial (not about recovery but about treating your woman badly)?

Thank you. Please forgive me if this question sounds wrong. I know my man does not want to lose me and I don't want to lose him. But I'm just lost because he just doesn't seem to see his role in what's going on between us, he just blames me.

Peace and love to all,
Rainbow


Top
#277873 - 03/01/09 10:43 PM Re: Before recovery: Men treating their women badly [Re: rainbow]
MichaeldR Offline


Registered: 12/02/08
Posts: 36
Loc: South Carolina
Hi, Rainbow:

It's not always what you say, it's how you say it. One of the first things I learned when I joined a 12-step group was to approach others with "I" statements. I'm not trying to manipulate the other person, simply express myself for my own sanity.

ex: "I felt really demoralized when you blamed me for your bad feelings."

Obviously this is just a beginning, but it certainly helped me. Couples counceling also might be suggested, or barring that some therapy for yourself maybe.

Just a suggestion,

_________________________
Mike

My mantras:

Easy Does I - - - - - - Là où il y a la vie il y a l'espoir.
One Day At A Time - - - Là où il y a l'espoir: la vie.
First Things First- - - Where there's life there's hope.
LIVE and Let Live - - - Where there is hope: life.

Top
#277903 - 03/02/09 06:28 AM Re: Before recovery: Men treating their women badly [Re: MichaeldR]
nathan555 Offline


Registered: 01/06/09
Posts: 230
Loc: Australia
Rainbow
your man needs a man to speak
man to man into his life

you are entitled to set boundaries

you can make councelling a condition of your relationship
because the consequences of him not entering into recovery impact on you

You can't change him
but you can say "change yourself or its over"
then its his choice


Nathan


Top
#277905 - 03/02/09 06:41 AM Re: Before recovery: Men treating their women badly [Re: MichaeldR]
joelRT Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor


Registered: 09/11/08
Posts: 1357
Loc: Québec, Canada
Rainbow,

There is the sentiment of love and then there is the commitment to love.

The commitment to love is always based on/in trust - no trust, no genuine love.

The sentiment of love can and often is very deep and very strong, but in order for that sentiment to be binding it requires the commitment of trust.

_________________________
My Story 1
My Story 2
The longest journey we take is to self-discovery

Top
#277910 - 03/02/09 09:00 AM Re: Before recovery: Men treating their women badly [Re: joelRT]
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
Rainbow,

You said you don't want to make him face up to anything but you have to make him face up to at least one thing. That is the fact that there is a boundary you won't let him cross and still be able to keep you in his life. You deserve to be treated with respect, not treated badly. It would seem if he cannot, or is unwilling to afford you that basic need it would seem to me you need to provide it for yourself and set that boundary.

Many times the prospect of losing the things they hold dear will be the catalyst in bringing about a new outlook for the victim/survivor. If you fail to set that boundary and keep going back to him without it you're simply enabling his bad behavior.

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

Top
#277920 - 03/02/09 11:58 AM Re: Before recovery: Men treating their women badly [Re: WalkingSouth]
DESPERATELY TYIN Offline


Registered: 02/15/09
Posts: 7
Walking south
I was advised by a therapist not to engage in what my husband would see as ultimatums or he would leave.I think like you I have the right to certain expectations-respect,faithfulness and above all honesty after 27 yrs of secrets.Who is right??? It seems no matter what I do I am wrong.He is at home where his therapist told him he shouldn't go because it could be disasterous for him.The pull of his dysfunctional family and most of all his "mother"( emotional incest perpetrator to all her sons) trumps me, her and our kids.
Today he is taking our oldest daughter to see her "grandmother" the one who missed birthdays, Christmases,Graduations, phone calls etc,etc,etc.I want to kill her and him too.I feel very bitter about my husband's life with her and hate that he is dragging our daughter through this.Tried to make him face these things and all I did was make him withdraw and escalate the fighting between us.He is there,I am here and nothing is good between us.How do we know which is the best way to go. No choice seems right and I'm still confused and frustrated.Please help with how to resolve some of this.
Still "Desperately Trying" but not having much success.Thanks


Top
#277922 - 03/02/09 12:29 PM Re: Before recovery: Men treating their women badly [Re: DESPERATELY TYIN]
fromtoday Offline


Registered: 10/04/08
Posts: 74
Loc: UK
Hi Rainbow,
This is an issue which I find difficult to work out who's right/ who's wrong.
In my own experience I have certainly pushed/encouraged my husband into therapy, I've tried with little success over 15 years until 2 years ago when he hit a new bottom and was ready to accept help.
These are the points that I mull over:-
* If I hadn't "pushed" him would he have sought help sooner, it might be interesting to know that his opinion is that if I hadn't pushed he would never have sought help - who know if this is true.
* Many many times I was a trigger for my husband often plumeting him further into his despair, this is hard for me to deal with, we both have resentment and anger towards each other directly related to the after effects of each others childhoods.
* Ultimately I believe in setting boundaries, however I suspect that if I set boundaries before we had children he would have left.
Good Luck

_________________________
Is this the real life?
Is this just fantasy?
Caught in a landslide,
No escape from reality
Open your eyes, Look up to the skies and see.....
_________________________________________________
Queen, Bohemian Rhapsody

Top
#277928 - 03/02/09 02:50 PM Re: Before recovery: Men treating their women badly [Re: DESPERATELY TYIN]
WalkingSouth Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/30/05
Posts: 16265
Originally Posted By: DESPERATELY TYIN
Walking south
I was advised by a therapist not to engage in what my husband would see as ultimatums or he would leave.I think like you I have the right to certain expectations-respect,faithfulness and above all honesty after 27 yrs of secrets.Who is right??? It seems no matter what I do I am wrong.

Yes, that is the conundrum isn't it? I can only speak from personal experience. Early in our marriage when I exhibited certain behaviors that were in some way or another disrespecting of my marriage or my wife she set come boundaries that I knew I could not violate and keep our relationship in tact. She didn't go so far as to set any kind of ultimatum. She simply conveyed to me the concept that was so eloquently uttered by Gandalf to the balrog in "The Fellowship of the Ring":

"You shall not pass!"

It wasn't uttered in an angry way. She didn't list the consequences. She just quietly drew a line in the sand and left it for me to figure out the rest. I don't know if she really understood the wisdom of her actions or if she did it out of instinct, but whatever the case, it was effective.

John

_________________________
“Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy ____…! What a ride!’” ~Hunter S. Thompson

Top
#278215 - 03/04/09 05:11 PM Re: Before recovery: Men treating their women badly [Re: rainbow]
rainbow Offline


Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 28
Thank you very much for your replies and wisdom.

I have realized that the only way change my happen is if I set the ultimate boundary by refusing to be in a relationship with him. He was borderline abusive of me, although I fully understood his triggers - a complete lack of trust and a belief that I only wanted to hurt him. I am his longest, most committed relationship that he's managed to maintain, and not to be conceited but I am a very loving and trustworthy person, so I think that's why he was actually able to stay with me. Sadly though he is still completely self-destructive. If only he could have faced a modicum of ownership for his intense over-reactions we may have made progress.

I wish you all peace and strength and love in your personal stories.

Rainbow
x


Top
#285226 - 04/24/09 03:31 PM Re: Before recovery: Men treating their women badly [Re: rainbow]
rainbow Offline


Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 28
Just an update and a question. My guy had taken ownership for his abusive behavior towards me, and was reading around the issue. Also, although he has never talked to me about his CSA, it came up in a round about way, and he just physically clung onto me for ages, unable to speak. I waited for him, waited for him to start therapy, or to speak to me, or something. And then I caught him trying to cheat on me. I understand, I love him, I know his pain, but it's over for me. He is not ready to face things, and I cannot put myself through it anymore. It was traumatic letting him go, just holding his hand, telling him I just could not do it anymore, he was very upset (he wants to marry me!). And that is it.

I have one final question. I want to write him a letter. There is so much unsaid between us but I know what happened to him as a child. And he has told me enough about himself that I know he has self-hatred. And for him, he doesn't know why I would want to be with him (his words)... But maybe I should just let go and never try to manipulate his recovery through a letter... Is that what it would be? :-( Should I just wait then, maybe this break up will be a catalyst for his change. I'm just being selfish though, wanting him to be 'all fixed'... so we can have a trusting, loving relationship...

Peace to all. It has been an incredibly painful experience and I just want to care for my man because he's been through so much pain but I have to look after myself so that is it.

Rainbow





Edited by rainbow (04/24/09 03:32 PM)

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >


Moderator:  ModTeam, peroperic2009 

I agree that my access and use of the MaleSurvivor discussion forums and chat room is subject to the terms of this Agreement. AND the sole discretion of MaleSurvivor.
I agree that my use of MaleSurvivor resources are AT-WILL, and that my posting privileges may be terminated at any time, and for any reason by MaleSurvivor.