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#277581 - 02/28/09 12:32 PM Re: Confusion as child from the abuse? [Re: nathan555]
ComicBookGuy Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/08/09
Posts: 443
Loc: London, England
Ken

The honest answer to this would be "yes, when I was a child". The fear was there, regardless of how many girls I chased at school, adolescence was a tough time figuring things out.

Carried on trying to have a romantic life through college and up to late 20s, gave up, now considering the worth of fighting to have a relationship when that's another ball game altogether, post-healing. You have to want to be in one for a start.

Nathan - see the quote from JoelRT in my signature and put it into practice. At least my gay friend admitted he had no idea what to say regarding my CSA and couldn't advise when I disclose. Up until then, he assumed I must have been gay if he decided he was (we were discussing questioning sexualities earlier in the friendship), but people with that recruitment attitude, they're just another bunch of agenda jockeys. Ditch them.



Edited by ComicBookGuy (02/28/09 12:33 PM)
Edit Reason: missed words
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- CBG

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#277641 - 02/28/09 09:50 PM Re: Confusion as child from the abuse? [Re: Ken Singer, LCSW]
king tut Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 02/13/08
Posts: 2469
Loc: UK
Originally Posted By: Ken Singer, LCSW
I'm wondering if any of you had experienced sexual identity confusion as a child/adolescent because you became aroused during the abuse.

Did you think it "made you gay" or did the perpetrator imply or say that you were because of the arousal?

Ken


I have not read any of the other replies here. I will tell you about some of my experiences briefly.

I was a cute kid. Girls fancy cute kids. Doesn't matter what your personality is like, not really, i was quiet, there is no way any of these strange girls knew what i was like.

I had lots of girlfriends, all short-lived, i would dump them all fast, i didn't see the point of having a girlfriend, i would prefer to just play as friends. But i found it hard to say no when they asked me.

Breasts have never been a great attraction, i like small breasts, and short hair, that still worries me sometimes, thinking that i may be looking for a girl that looks more like a boy.

Sometimes i had more than one girlfriend at a time, of course i had a guilty conscience, but i was a kid, and this girl would tell me to think of it as practice for my girlfriend, so i would listen to her.

When i was in my teens i sometimes found myself attracted to younger boys, never boys my own age, that was disgusting, but boys younger than me. Of course, i could see how messed up that idea was. For a while i really struggled with that idea, finding that i was sexually attracted to younger people. But the only reason i was feeling sexually attracted in that way is because i was given that kind of sexual pleasure at that age. I don't feel any sexual attraction to younger people anymore.

What was it? it was the fact that i was strong enough to get in touch with my own feelings, and therefore strong enough to have empathy, rather than to explore my own feelings through repetition. It was the fact that i had empathy, a quality that differs humans from the beasts. Imagine it, really imagine it, i really dont know what kind of person can go through with something like that.

But sometimes the idea of doing sexual things to a man, an older man, invade my mind. Does this make me gay? even though i may want it? even though i may temporarily feel impulsed towards it?

NO

it doesn't

i understand the deep set reasons that may draw me towards certain things, but i recognise THAT, i truly do, and i recognise the feelings and emotions that may say certain things, but i SEE where that come from, and i see WHY.

That's the difference.

CONFUSION. Of course. I often thought maybe it meant i was gay. Not because of anything anybody said to me. Nobody said to me look that means you are enjoying it, and i never even related the enjoyment to their gender- i could masturbate on my own, i couldn't ejaculate, but i could feel the magical feeling. It didn't matter if it was my dad or my brother or my neighbourhood friend who was a girl or if it was just me, it was the same stuff.

Did i ever fancy any of my friends who were boys? not particularly. There was one boy, we were friends, he basically tried to have sex with me, once we were play fighting and he put me in that position, he even made me bleed by holding a knife on my head really hard (we had been play fighting rough and this was how he could win). But was it a feeling in the real sense, or a feeling of submission where i owed him this to be my friend. It was the latter. It was not because i was gay, it was because of the false lessons abuse had taught me.

I have done so much in my past sure i wouldn't think much of pleasing a guy if he wanted to be pleased, still sometimes when i feel intensely towards somebody it pops into my mind for a miilisecond maybe i should give this person what he wants. But that isn't being gay, that is messed up thinking left over from so many years of abuse.

_________________________
"...until lambs become lions"

I love you, little lewis, and i will never leave you. We are the same. You brighten my day, and i will make sure that i brighten yours. Hugs and kisses.


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#277645 - 02/28/09 10:31 PM Re: Confusion as child from the abuse? [Re: king tut]
jacobtk Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/08/03
Posts: 527
I never really thought about it until I went to high school and was in care. I went to an all-boy high school. I didn't mind that so much since I was use to be being around mostly boys. But it dud worry me because every time I said something about the girls in the all-girl school across the field or talked about some WWF (it was still that at the time) diva, I was just going through the motions. Sometimes girls looked at me or seemed like they were interested, but I just wasn't attracted to them at all. I definitely didn't want to kiss them or have sex with them.

At the same time, I wasn't interested in any boys. It was weird being at school because everyone was hyper-vigilant about being called gay, yet some of the boys would brush up against me or stand close to me in the line in a way that I knew what they were up to. I made out with one boy a few times, but that was as far as it went. I assumed he was gay and that maybe I was too for doing that with him, but I wasn't really sure. I wasn't attracted to him at all.

Once I went to college I would make out with girls at some of the parties I went to. I didn't like doing that either, but I just went through the motions. I never initiated anything.

I don't know if what happened confused me so much as it made me indifferent. I'm not particularly attracted or not attracted to men or women. I do know I that I have more problems being with women than with men. No one ever specifically said I was "gay," although I was told a lot as a child that only "sissies" were good at pleasing men.



Edited by jacobtk (03/03/09 04:49 PM)
_________________________
Every day I die again, and again Iím reborn/Every day I have to find the courage/To walk out into the street/With arms out/Got a love you canít defeat/Neither down nor out/Thereís nothing you have that I need/I can breathe/Breathe now - U2

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#278026 - 03/03/09 09:31 AM Re: Confusion as child from the abuse? [Re: Ken Singer, LCSW]
nathan555 Offline


Registered: 01/06/09
Posts: 230
Loc: Australia
I certainly struggle with unwanted same sex attraction as a result of being aroused during my abuse

sometimes it drives me

until recently I had no idea what "it" was but now I know I can process it.

I am not gay but I get tired of being asked if I am gay when I raise ssa

Nathan


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#278337 - 03/05/09 03:14 PM Re: Confusion as child from the abuse? [Re: Ken Singer, LCSW]
Stephen_5 Offline
BoD Emeritus
MaleSurvivor
Registered: 09/12/00
Posts: 667
Loc: Northern California Foothills
I'm wondering if any of you had experienced sexual identity confusion as a child/adolescent because you became aroused during the abuse.

Did you think it "made you gay" or did the perpetrator imply or say that you were because of the arousal?

Ken

Ken,

From the retrospect of time, I realize that I had attractions to guys even when I was pre-adolescent. There was some of the 'show me yours and I'll show you mine' with peers and there was some mutual masturbation with a close friend who lived down the street from me. When he moved away, I felt very alone. I knew that what I was feeling could not be talked about with anyone. My older sister's boyfriend,Donny, befriended me, he was a few years older than me. He was like a big brother to me and we talked about all sorts of things, especially sex. One night when we were alone, playing hide and seek out in a field. Donny found me and we started talking. I was concerned about the size of my penis. I was only 11 years old, and he showed me his and asked to see mine. His was much larger than mine but he assured me that mine would be big like his one day too. Donny got me erect and then sat down on my ankles and proceeded to give me oral sex. I tried to get away but couldn't. I was getting very excited and I threatened him. I told him if he didn't stop I'd ejaculate. He just looked up, sort of smiled, and finished me off. He told me how much I'd enjoyed that. He and I went over to his house afterwards. He wanted me to spend the night. I was terrified. His grandfather was there and I was frightened by the look on his face when he looked at me; it was like he was starving and I was a piece of meat. I told them I had to call my mom. I called her and basically had a one-sided conversation telling her all the made-up reasons that I couldn't spend the night over at his house; she said that I could and should. I told them that I couldn't and ended up walking home; probably a couple of miles or so in the dark. Mom was surprised to see me come home. She had been drinking, as usual when dad was out of town, and I told her that I just wanted to come home. No questions were ever asked.

I was in Boy Scouts and Donny was one of the oldest boys in the troop. When we went on Boy Scout campouts or to summer camp somehow I always ended up in Donny's tent. Most times we ended up doing mutual masturbation, one time he made me give him oral, one time he tried to pentrate me anally but it hurt too much. One time at summer camp on the first night I had just had it, I told the Scoutmaster that I wanted to go home. I cried and cried and got to call my mom. She just told me to tough it out, that they'd spent the money to send me to camp I needed to stay there. I moved into a tent with another boy who wanted to go home. I felt safer there but there were stories of what went on in Donny's tent and the two of us were made fun of. I knew that I could never tell my mom about any of this, I felt that she just wouldn't listen.

One time when we were at a campout one of the young assistant Scout leaders told Donny that he had to sleep in the tent with him. On the way home the next day Donny made all sorts of snide jokes about the assistant scoutmaster. I never saw that assistant scoutmaster again and no one ever talked about it but there is no doubt in my mind that something happened and I was happy that it didn't happen to me.

When Donny and his family suddenly moved away, I felt abandoned.

I remembered everything that ever happened but I knew that I just couldn't be 'queer'. That was the worst thing that you could call anyone back in those days (1958). I made it through junior high and high school, I went to four different high schools in four different states so I was always a loner and never had any close friends. I learned about alcohol when I was 15-16 and would sneak beers or hard liquor every chance that I had. I was good in school and graduated with a 3.8 GPA because I thought that as long as I was perfect no one would notice all of my self-percieved defects. I went to college and found out about drugs. I ended up dropping out. I felt it was my obligation as the only son in the family to get married, have children and carry on the family name. I married a friend of my younger sister's and really did love her dearly. There was always the subconscious desire for sex with guys but I held it at bay for years. After five years of marriage we had a daughter and ten years later we had another daughter with several miscarriaged in between. I was sexually enthusiastic with my wife and never had any extra-marital sex with any other woman. But to my great shame I did seek out anonymous groping with other guys, especially when I was stressed about something else.

I finally sought out therapy when I was fifty years old in Colorado. I started dealing with all the things that were going on in my head. I started feeling better about myself, gained some self-esteem, found a better job back in California so my wife could be closer to her only sister. My wife had a lot of health problems. She had kidney failure, had a kidney transplant that failed after 7 years, went back on dialysis and didn't want to live anymore. My wife died of heart failure when I was at the lowest point of my life. In the previous year I had a motorcycle accident, had kidney cancer and surgery for that, had a mini-stroke, my dad died, I found out I cancer in my mouth and neck and had surgery for that and was undergoing radiation treatment that made me so damn weak. I had lost about 80-90 pounds at that time, couldn't eat much or keep much down because of the radiation. My wife was sleeping in the spare bedroom and woke me up yelling that she couldn't get up. I called 911, went to the hospital where she had a massive heart attack that afternoon, her heart had stopped for over 13 minutes but the revived her. I had to make the decision whether to keep her on life support or let her die. The doctors said that she had significant brain damage as well as significant heart damage. She died a little after midnight that night.

If I hadn't started therapy when I did I never would have had the tools to deal with the grief, my own health problems, and everything else that was going on. After my wife died I decided that I didn't want to live out the rest of my life alone. I didn't want to put another woman through what my wife went through, I would accept my feelings and desire for another man.

A little over a year later I met the man and fell in love. My two girls were sceptical at first but soon realized that we were serious. Things haven't been easy but we got married last July in our home in California.

And that's where I'm at right now. I still have health problems as does my husband; I lost a job last November but I'm still going on.

_________________________
I want to stay as close to the edge as I can without going over. Out on the edge you see all kinds of things you can't see from the center.
Kurt Vonnegut (1922-2007)

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#279679 - 03/16/09 02:16 PM Re: Confusion as child from the abuse? [Re: nathan555]
myboyhoodfears Offline


Registered: 03/13/09
Posts: 457
.



Edited by myboyhoodfears (08/31/09 03:22 AM)
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