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#275462 - 02/16/09 04:11 AM Re: Need some advice regarding my marriage. [Re: petercorbett]
michael banks Offline


Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 1755
Loc: Mojave Desert, Ca
Katie,

What is with opening your mouth before turning on your brain thing about?
I always wonder about people who don't think before they talk.
If I was not really questioning things would I be here examing myself and my life.
Some people have more than enought B/S words and answers for everybody else but themselves. Some people just like to hear themselves talk.
I guess it make them feel part of something.

Let's cut the b/s.
I am a csa Survivor that is why I am here.
How about you my wordy friend?
Do you get off on our issues?

Mike


_________________________
To own one's shadow is the highest moral act of a human.
-Robert Johnson-

"IT ought never be forgotten that the past is the parent of the future" John C. Calhoun

WOR Alumni Sequoia 2009

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#275469 - 02/16/09 07:28 AM Re: Need some advice regarding my marriage. [Re: michael banks]
sweet-n-sour Offline
Member

Registered: 10/03/06
Posts: 409
Loc: chicago
What Pete shared regarding his experiences with this made me wonder about something??? I was just thinking about patterning and how when we enter a relationship we are at one place and in being a survivor, then working towards healing...well, maybe a person blossoms to the point where they just wish to wipe the slate clean and start over.
Mike I can see by this especially if your wife is unwilling to meet you in keeping the balance in your relationship that you would desire a "clean slate" as well.
When my husband disclosed and his therapist recommended certain things to enable him the space to heal...well, if I was not willing to change with him, if I had been too fearful and pushed him to go in a direction that was not helping, I can see where he would have maybe questioned whether or not I was an asset or a liability to what he needed to do for himself.
I believe I'm seeing this from a different perspective and I thank you for that. I still maintain that sucessful relationships are all about balance. When one person gives to the point of it all becoming top heavy, well, it stands to reason that the whole thing falls over. I truly believe that both people must want the same things, share the same desire for a better life then be willing to do the work for it both individually and as a team. The objective should be for each person to want the absolute best for the other person and in that, the committment to reinvent to accomodate each step both take in a better direction for a renewed quality of life.
Thanks guys for sharing your life stories and helping me understand a bit more regarding marriage, balance and doing what is best for yourself.

S-n-S



Edited by sweet-n-sour (02/16/09 12:52 PM)
_________________________
"As long as he continues to try, I will meet him in that determination and commitment."

cm 2007

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#275482 - 02/16/09 10:08 AM Re: Need some advice regarding my marriage. [Re: sweet-n-sour]
Kathryn Offline
Guest

Registered: 02/08/07
Posts: 303
Look guys simple point:

My previous marriage was to a guy who was not sexually abused. He was, however, emotionally unavailable.

But guess who chose him? I did.

And that says something about ME.

But to be able to deal with why I - ME - chose him, it sometimes takes a period of emotional distance.

Too often this reasonable need for emotional distance translates into a period of demonization. Lots of people do this.

Hopefully we don't get stuck there.

In my previous marriage both I and my ex. got stuck there -- thus the divorce.

That's all,
Katie


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#275485 - 02/16/09 10:38 AM Re: Need some advice regarding my marriage. [Re: Kathryn]
Kathryn Offline
Guest

Registered: 02/08/07
Posts: 303
P.S.

And maybe "demonize" isn't the best word -- just that lots of folks fall into it -- say blame, say making the other the "identified patient", etc....

It takes a lot for two people to sit down -- not matter their relationship or what stripes and spots they carry -- and say "You know, I have my issues, you have yours, and when we come into contact with each other, we pass it back and forth, just the human condition and nature of relationships".

And to answer Mike's question: Do I get off on your issues?

Hmmm.... If I didn't on some level, then I wouldn't be in a relationship with Rob.

And if he didn't get off on my issues, he wouldn't be in a relationship with me.

And same with my previous marriage....

And what did I get out of being married to an emotionally distant person? Lots, but one of the things I got out of it was that it didn't require of ME to be truly emotionally intimate, though it provided an excuse to not look too closely at my own issues of emotional intimacy. We both got to stay in our own little private places. It worked, even if it wasn't what I more deeply desired.

My point about you wife not reading here is just related to this: If I had empathized more with my ex then two things would have happened: 1) The focus would have stayed on him, in both good and not so good ways, and 2) I would not have created the space I needed, at least temporarily, to look at myself at least as much as we both looked at him.

To my present relationship: Being over 40 years old, having been married already to a person with a different kind of crazy, I just figure I could trade Rob's crazy in for another kind of crazy.

But I doubt there's a way out of crazy.

We're all crazy.

Katie


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#275490 - 02/16/09 11:58 AM Re: Need some advice regarding my marriage. [Re: Kathryn]
Kathryn Offline
Guest

Registered: 02/08/07
Posts: 303
PPS,

And I'm NOT putting it on YOU, Mike.

But people have two primal responses: fight or flight.

If one person has a tendency to over-use the flight response, then contact, such as it is, demands that the other move forward in some way, and it's not always a good way.

In my previous marriage, it was mostly my ex. who overtly used flight.

But when he did move towards me, I'd use flight....

That crazy dance so common in early courtship... Becomes a way of life.

And not just for csa survivors, but for lots of people.

It seems to me -- and yes, I'm risking putting words in your mouth -- that you'd like your wife to come here as a means of saying something like: "Gee, I'm sorry for not being perfect, I'm understanding why I've had the patterns I've had, I'd like for you to have some understanding as well so that you'll see I'm both sorry and would like to make the future different".

And probably because, like any other human being, you'd just like some simple validation and recognition.

And if your wife is smart and wise and strong and has adequate self-esteem and an adequate sense of her own separateness..... etc.... then she really would benefit from reading something like this forum. And not just to understand you better, but herself as well.

But sometimes we just go through a period where the pendulum swings too far in the other direction in order to gain the smarts, the wisdom, the etc....

But if I were your wife, I'd really like a letter saying what it would mean to you for me to come here. A letter, not a talk, where all our stupid defenses are too easily triggered.

And then I'd like to be able to duke it out, because when two people are fighting at least their not both fleeing.

And a woman's only forum wouldn't have given me nearly the amount of insight both into Rob and myself that this forum has provided.

Though I have also participated in a woman's only forum.

Take care,
Katie


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#275497 - 02/16/09 12:23 PM Re: Need some advice regarding my marriage. [Re: Kathryn]
Sans Logos Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/03
Posts: 5791
Loc: in my own world in pittsburgh,...
hi katie!

Quote:
But people have two primal responses: fight or flight.


i just wanted to peek my nose in here and add a third to your two

freeze

i know that one all too well. was never good at fighting or flighting [wings were clipped early on....]

i suspect i'm not the only one, but the good news is, wings grow back!!!!!!

tada!!!!

ron

_________________________
  1. the past
  2. ReClaiming Now
  3. advocacy


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#275499 - 02/16/09 12:43 PM Re: Need some advice regarding my marriage. [Re: Sans Logos]
Kathryn Offline
Guest

Registered: 02/08/07
Posts: 303
Ron,

Yes, the freeze response, I know it well.

From the person's perspective that's moving towards, the freeze response can look like the flight response. Rob often looks like the deer caught in the headlights.

Can't speak for how he's actually feeling at the time, only he can.

But for myself, when I freeze I get a sense of lights exploding outward while something in me flees inward.... or something like this. But there's an explosive double movement -- fight and flight -- which amounts to freeze. For me it's filled with anxious tension.

Rob LOOKS like he just plays possum. It looks like just a drifty sort of stare. It pisses me off! I want anxious tension, existential anxiety, nail-biting angst! SOMETHING! I'm working on it smile Guess he just has his internal life and I have mine. Though... shouldn't he be more like me? I mean what's he doing just being his ol' possum self?

Katie


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#275562 - 02/16/09 09:10 PM Re: Need some advice regarding my marriage. [Re: Kathryn]
michael banks Offline


Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 1755
Loc: Mojave Desert, Ca
Katie,

You are one peculiar woman. And it is crazy making trying to follow your reasoning and logic at times.
No wonder you enjoy Ttoons posts. You guys are two peas in a pod.

But in your post you have made some very valid points and have given me some things to think about. You must have because I had a very strong reaction to your first post this mourning. You pissed me off at first I thought you where judging me without knowing me. But to be be honest some of what you have been saying hits closer to home than I want to admit.

You have made me very aware of the anger I am feeling towards my wife right now.
Time for a time out to process that first.

Rob, has his hands full with you. No wonder he plays possum.

Thanks

Mike

_________________________
To own one's shadow is the highest moral act of a human.
-Robert Johnson-

"IT ought never be forgotten that the past is the parent of the future" John C. Calhoun

WOR Alumni Sequoia 2009

Top
#275609 - 02/17/09 07:35 AM Re: Need some advice regarding my marriage. [Re: michael banks]
Kathryn Offline
Guest

Registered: 02/08/07
Posts: 303
Mike,

Guess we've made up -- wew, now I can go to work in peace.

Yes, Rob has his hands full smile

Then again so do I.

Take care,
Katie


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#275679 - 02/17/09 03:55 PM Re: Need some advice regarding my marriage. [Re: Kathryn]
michael banks Offline


Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 1755
Loc: Mojave Desert, Ca


I am not trying to run but when does it reach the point that I have all the craziness that I can handle. I have acklownledged to everyone in my life who I am, had happen and how screwed up I am. I am not denying anything about myself. Not blaming others for my actions.
But at the same time I am tired of being responsible for the happiness or more importantly the unhappiness of another. I am also tired being made out to be the bad guy when I chose to set some boundaries for myself.
Tired of always feeling like i am just not that important. That others peoples needs are more important. Constantly having to pick up the messes created by others than having no right to say anything about it.
I am tired of living with people in my life who just refuses to live in reality and deal with their own problems.
I am finished dealing with the crazies in my life.
I just can't do it anymore.
Screw the insanity of it all.

Mike



Edited by michael banks (02/17/09 03:59 PM)
_________________________
To own one's shadow is the highest moral act of a human.
-Robert Johnson-

"IT ought never be forgotten that the past is the parent of the future" John C. Calhoun

WOR Alumni Sequoia 2009

Top
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